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Philip HershOnline InterviewAugust 20, 2002
For the past six years, Hersh has been listed among the most influential sports personalities in the world by SportIntern, an international newsletter published in Germany. Hersh's work has been honored with four Pulitzer Prize nominations and numerous awards from such organizations as the Associated Press Sports Editors, the Headline Club of Chicago, the Chicago Association of Black Journalists, the Track and Field Writers of America and the Pro Football Writers of America. APSE selected his story about Tara Lipinski's 1998 Olympic victory as an award-winner in the best news coverage category. Several of his stories have appeared in the annual anthology, Best Sports Stories. One such story, "Baseball is a Dream that Won't Go Away," won the Best Commentary Prize for Best Sports Stories in 1986. As a recognized expert on figure skating, Hersh appeared on The Today Show, CBS Morning Show, CNN, CNN International, The Sam Donaldson Show and ESPN during the 2002 Winter Olympics. Hersh has reported from Iran, Cuba, Japan, South Korea, Trinidad, Russia, England, East Germany, Germany, Italy, France, the Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Greece, Spain, Australia, Bosnia-Herzegovina (then Yugoslavia), Canada and the Czech Republic. Hersh is a 1968 graduate of Yale University with a B.A. in French and a specialization in early 19th Century French literature. He has done post-graduate study in Spanish at Northwestern University and Italian at DePaul and Loyola universities. Hersh resides in Evanston, IL with his wife and son. Elena: What do you think about the two Russians: Alexei Yagudin and Evgeny Plushenko? Philip: Yagudin is the more complete skater. While his presentation sometimes goes over the top in terms of posing, he blends the artistic/technical side very well. His jumps aren't perfect, with the bent-knee landings, and his spins are inconsistent, but the jumps are huge. There is an emotion in his skating Plushenko can't match. Plushenko badly needs better choreography and music. His original long program last season was auditory torture. There is an arrogance about him on the ice that is competitively sound but hard to relate to. Yagudin has risen to the great occasions. Plushenko's short program error at SLC should have dropped him from medal contention. Tom: Phil, as a total package how would you rate Michelle Kwan, Sarah Hughes, and Sasha Cohen from the ages of 13 to 16? Philip: By age 16, Michelle had won a world title and skated what I feel is the signature performance of her career, Salome, with 7 triple jumps at the world meet. Within 9 months from 1995 to 1996 Worlds, she transformed herself from a bubbly kid to a mature skater. The only one comparable at that age, for me, was Tiffany Chin. For me, Michelle has not improved technically since, and her artistry, though refined, has never been as compelling as it was with Salome. At age 16, Sarah is an Olympic champion with one of the greatest competitive performances ever. Say what one might about flutzes or under-rotations, however, no one ever has succeeded at a more technically difficult program. Only time will tell if that also is the highlight of her career. Sasha certainly burst onto the senior level with more of a splash. Her short program at the 2000 U.S. Nationals in Cleveland was one of the most stunning performances I have ever seen. She was 15 then. Since that point, she has been inconsistent with the exception of the 2002 U.S. Nationals. I can't remember another US skater with such balletic grace and eye-catching moves at 15. Sasha has the most potential of any skater I have seen since Chin, but Chin's jumps were better and more consistent. Kelly: Phil, regarding ladies figure skating, I like Sarah Hughes as a person but her poor skating technique and posture bother me. I also always get the feeling that her "artistry" is forced; as if she is trying way too hard to show she is graceful (phony and pretentious). Am I wrong? What do you think? Philip: As I said in the previous answer, you can quibble about some of Sarah's jumps. Her posture is much improved and she is developing a sense of pure line. Other than Cohen, Sarah has more sense of the music than any other skater. Most could be skating to trash cans banging or cats howling and they would do the same program. Lexy: Hello Phil, I was wondering why Michelle Kwan is still more beloved by most even though Sarah Hughes won the gold medal? Philip: Michelle has been on the scene since age 12, has been a champion many times over and has comported herself with grace and dignity. The general public has yet to develop the same long-term relationship with Sarah. Dave: Could Sarah Hughes, being the new Olympic gold medalist, work against her? With names like Kwan, Slutskaya, Suguri, Cohen, Nikodinov, ect., will her poor posture and bad technical flaws be magnified and work against her when all others skate well and judges have to get really technical? Philip: I think Sarah's posture problems and technical flaws are exaggerated. Her bravado in attacking the 3-3 combos gets more points on my scorecard than sticking with the tried and true. Sasha, of course, is the X-factor: If her jumps become consistent, she could be the next world champion. Anonymous: How did you learn how to identify all the elements of a technical program and how would you rate yourself at it? Philip: I learned by observing closely at practices and competitions, asking questions, and by having them explained to me by judges and coaches like the late Carlo Fassi. I believe I am a good technical judge of singles, but I have more trouble identifying the throws in pairs. Beware, though, I hate bad music choices. I would be severe on presentation mark for badly cut music or choreography that bears no relation to the music. Maegan: Are you ever going to write a book? I'm lucky enough to live in Chicago so I read you every chance I get and I'll bet you have a lot of interesting things to say that would take up more than a newspaper column. Philip: There are no current book plans at this time. Anna: Many people do not consider figure skating to even be a sport. Do you think awarding a second gold at the 2002 Olympics was damaging? Philip: I think the second gold medal was a hasty, expeditious solution to get rid of the 900-pound gorilla crushing the Olympics in North American media. I think it opened Pandora's box. Anonymous: Which performance was technically more difficult, Tara Lipinski's Olympic long program or Sarah Hughes Olympic long program? Which of these performances wowed you more? Philip: I think Hughes did harder triple jumps and had a more ambitious music selection. Lipinski wowed me because of her unfettered joy at being out there and because she beat the best second-place performance in Olympic history (it would have won gold in every other Olympics but 1998 and, given Hughes SP standing, would have given Kwan the gold in SLC). Like Lipinski, Hughes had nothing to lose and went for it; given the slop around her, with Kwan, Slute and Cohen hardly brilliant, Sarah stood out more by comparison than Lipinski had. Adam: Should Michelle quit amateur skating now that the Olympic gold is practically out of reach? I think she should move on and design skating costumes or go into TV broadcasting with Paul Wylie doing a skating show called, ìWATCH FOR ICE." By the way, you look surprised in your photo. What are you thinking? Philip: Figure skating is a never-ending string of surprises. Hit men, Tonya Harding's next court case, mobsters, Tonya Harding's previous court case, trumped-up judging, Tonya Harding's current court case, so a reporter simply develops an expression that is most useful. As for Michelle, she should do whatever she wants as long as she doesn't become Ahab chasing a gold whale. Sandy from MA: Considering how figure skating is not always viewed as a "real" sport, I always imagined sports writers cover figure skating only because they drew the short straw! Obviously you have been covering skating for many years. How did you feel about the sport when you first started covering it compared to now? Philip: I liked it from the start because of the combination of art and sport as well as all the intrigues involved. In 1980, it was Vladimir Kovalev's sudden withdrawal and the Gardner-Babilonia mystery; in 2002, 'we are married to the mob'. Sandy from MA: This comment is made with some humor on my part. I believe you once joked about how Michelle Kwan should know what question you're going to ask at the press conferences because you always ask her the same thing (planned 3/3 combos) year after year. Given your occasional critique that Kwan is in an artistic and technical rut - I now must challenge you to get out of your journalistic rut and ask her something new in any future press conferences. :) Philip: Actually, I think Michelle was referring to my having been writing about her since 1993. Anonymous: Honestly, what is your opinion of Michelle Kwan, the skater and the person? Philip: She is a great skater who has not made a significant advance technically since 1996 or artistically since 1998. She has deserved every major medal she has earned with the exception of the 1999 world silver, which should have been bronze (or less) if the judges hadn't propped her up in the SP. Off the ice, she also has earned the respect she gets. Christie: Is the technical ability of women skaters lagging too far behind that of the men skaters? Philip: It is strange that since 1992 (not counting one by Midori Ito at some lesser comp), no woman has done a 3 AX. So the answer is yes. Thomas: After the Olympics, there was a lot of controversy about the placements in the ladies free skate. The Eastern Bloc all voted for Slutskaya. My question is, do you think Michelle Kwan should have been placed second and Slutskaya third? Same question for the Worlds free skate. Philip: Actually, (especially after watching a replay), I would have scored the Olympic FS as Hughes-Cohen-Kwan-Slutskaya. Irina was awful. Tosca is supposed to die at the end of the story. Irina was a zombie throughout. It is harder to judge worlds since I wasn't there. TV impressions are not true. Alice M.: By the time 2006 Olympics come, do you think the Kwan/Slutskaya era will be over? In the mid-90s it was Elvis Stojko and Todd Eldredge. After 1998, Yagudin and Plushenko ended that dominance. Which of the ladies do you see ending the era of Kwan/Slutskaya? Philip: If Hughes can skate as well as she did at Skate America, Skate Canada and the Olympics, she will be hard to beat. Ditto Cohen, especially if she adds a quad. Suguri shouldn't be counted out either. The big question is, why are there no other good women in Europe? And why can't Canada, the country most passionate about the sport, produce a successor to Manley/Chouinard and Orser/Browning/Stojko. Alice M.: Where do you see the sport of ladies figure skating going in the next 4 years? There be an emphasis on "the whole package" or technical brilliance? Philip: It always will be the whole pkg. I would like to see a jump limit be imposed IF that would encourage a woman to try a 3AX or quad, or even a 3Lutz-3T. People forget Kristi Y (the most underrated great skater since WWI) did a 3L-3T in 1992. Anonymous: Do you think Michelle Kwan will try for the 2006 Olympics? Philip: Why keep banging your head against the wall while some phenom comes along? Remember that in 1994, only a few insiders had even heard of Lipinski; same for Hughes in 1998. Michelle can't go back to the Olympics without feeling that gold is the only thing that counts. Meagan Leigh W.: In your opinion, will the IOC ever force the ISU to straighten up its act and clean house and get rid of corrupt judges? Do you feel that the French judge was pressured to give her vote to the Russians based on a deal between the French and Russian federations? Philip: I haven't the slightest idea about who is telling the truth in the mess. I am as skeptical about Stapleford-Lindgren-Lavoie as I am about LeGougne-Gailhaguet-Russians. Maybe it will all come out in the Toukhtakounov trial. To a degree, the corruption reminds one of the promoters (Barnum?) who said, "I don't care if you spell my name right, just spell my name." Curiously, it was Gailhaguet who led the failed effort for a judges' evaluation system at the 2002 ISU Congress. Meagan Leigh W.: Skating fans are super critical of sportswriters who tend to ignore, make fun of or downplay the athleticism of figure skating yet they also are quick to jump all over writers like yourself or Christine Brennan who actually do a decent job. What do you say to these critics who don't seem to appreciate quality and in-depth coverage by journalists sincerely attempting to give the sport quality coverage? Philip: If I feel I have done my job with fairness and accuracy, the criticism has no effect. This is, remember, a subjective sport. People are entitled to differ reasonably. Some of the critics let figure skating consume their lives. To me, it is simply something I enjoy covering. Being there to see Galindo at the 1996 U.S. Nationals or Kwan at 1996 Worlds or Yagudin at 1999 Worlds or G&G in Calgary or Yamaguchi at the 1992 U.S. Nationals or Midori Ito apologizing to the cameraman at the 1991 Worlds or Harding land the 3Ax--and many more--are what is best about writing about figure skating. L. Zinser: What reforms would you like to see implemented in figure skating? Philip: As I said in an earlier answer, maybe a jump limit (if it encourages more technical daring) and much more emphasis and credit put on spins. L. Zinser: Since the demise of school figures, it appears to me that we no longer see Olympic champions with staying power. Do you agree or disagree and why? Philip: There may be more injuries with the demands of free skate practice, but look how long Kwan, Stojko, Eldredge, Slutskaya, Nikodinov, Butyrskaya, etc. have skated. The financial rewards have encouraged longevity. Kristen: What is your problem with Michelle Kwan? Your comments about her have been down right mean. YES, you say some good things but I feel you only do that for damage control. So what gives? Philip: I criticize Michelle Kwan for the sameness of her skating. I think she should have grown more artistically and technically. Maggie B.: How will Michelle Kwan be remembered? As one of the greats never to have won Olympic gold? A choker? A legend of the sport? Thanks. Philip: I think she will go down as all three. Her record is unmatched, but it does not include Olympic gold, and this Olympic gold was just sitting there for her to win. Melissa: How do you think the judges will treat Sarah Hughes this year? Will they view her as the "golden girl" and prop her up accordingly, or will they be more critical of her mistakes? Philip: Hughes likely will get the benefit of the doubt for a while, as all past champions have. Pete: I love reading your articles, and most of the time you hit the nail right on the head. What female skater do you think is the one to beat? I know that Irina Slutskaya has won many competitions, but do you think the judges give her high scores because she's a Russian? I know that she won worlds with an excellent short and long program, but many people thought Michelle Kwan should've been the winner there. What's your take? Thanx, and keep writing those great articles! Philip: As I mentioned earlier, I thought Irina was over scored in the LP at the Olympics but I believe her victory at worlds was unquestionable. Anonymous: Who would you rate as the top ten female figure skaters of all times in the order of their greatness? Philip: 1. Sonia Henie; 2. Peggy Fleming (her influence as a TV commentator is tremendous); 3. Katarina Witt; 4. Carol Heiss; 5. Kristi Yamaguchi (don't forget her pairs career); 6. Michelle Kwan; 7. Dorothy Hamill; 8. Janet Lynn; 9. Tiffany Chin (the greatest pure talent I have ever seen, even if her record doesn't match it); 10. Barbara Ann Scott. Cynthia: Hi Phil. What did you think of the outcome of the ladies' final at the Olympics? Philip: Hughes should have won the free skate 9-0. I would have had Cohen ahead of Irina. Susan P.: Do you think Michelle Kwan's season would have gone differently if she had kept Frank Carroll as her coach? Philip: Hindsight is 20-20, but one would hope a coach could have given MK what she was so sorely lacking, a champion's confidence, in the Olympic free skate. Jon: Do you now feel you made an error when you suggested that Sarah Hughes should have won Skate America even with faulty technique? Philip: No. Hughes won, period. Anonymous: What's your favorite figure skating discipline to watch and who are your favorite skater(s) in that discipline? Philip: I'm going to waffle on this one. I love the risk in pairs, with the throws and twists, and I enjoyed G&G and Dmitriev & Mishkutionok the most. I like the in-your-face nature of the men's competition, especially the quad showdowns in the warm-up, and I think Hamilton at the 1984 Olympic trials, Boitano at the 1988 OG and Yagudin at the 1999 Worlds were as good as it gets. The soap operatic dramas in women's skating have their special appeal, but so does the toughness and competitive grit of a Witt at the 1987 Worlds, Kwan at the 1996 Worlds, Lipinski and Hughes at the OG. Anonymous: When covering skating competitions, do you talk to skaters and coaches before the competition starts? Philip: Always. It's for background. Anonymous: Dick Button always mentions "Eastern Bloc" judging on his TV commentary. Do you agree with his opinion on the "Eastern Bloc" subject? Philip: I am inclined to think this is now more of a cultural than political bloc. Poles and Russians aren't exactly bosom buddies, for instance; nor are Lithuanians and Russians. But most of the judges and coaches from those schools were trained in a Soviet system, with emphasis on classical music and ballet. It will take a couple generations for that cultural tie to weaken -- if it ever does. Anonymous: How many skating events do you cover in a year? Philip: 3 to 5, live. Anonymous: Figure skating does not get a lot of newspaper coverage as compared to baseball or other sports, but it's a big money maker for TV. Why don't most newspapers cover the Grand Prix series like The World Series? Philip: Because not as many readers are interested. Anonymous: What's your opinion on jumping-related injuries for young teenagers? Do you think it's a necessary risk to take or should there be better ways to train and avoid injuries? Philip: Clearly, in the 12 yrs since the last compulsory figure at worlds, injuries have increased. Coaches may not have fully adapted to training without figures. Skates and blades have barely changed in a century. Better equipment and more sophisticated training are necessary. And so are skaters willing to say, "enough for today." Julie U.: At the Olympics there was a lot of complaining done by the Olympic silver medalist in ladies. She felt that she had a valid claim to the gold medal. Do you think it was a valid claim or is this simply something that was an off shoot of the pairs scandal? Philip: I think she had no claim to gold. The Russian's whining had as much to do with the cross-country ski disqualifications and the hockey tourney as they did with pairs. Patricia Y.: Mr. Hersh, as a figure skating expert could you please explain the differences in the performances of Irina Slutskaya and Michelle Kwan in the ladies long program at SLC? What made Slutskaya's performance better than Kwan's? Thank you so much. Philip: As I mentioned earlier, I thought Slutskaya's performance was not better. Irina was wooden, her jumps insecure. Kwan may have botched the 3/3 and fallen on another triple, but she still was better. I would have given Kwan 5.6, 5.8; Slutskaya, 5.7, 5.5. Fran E.: Mr. Hersh, I love your articles about skating. Do you think Michelle Kwan should continue to compete in the eligible ranks, and if so, would she be able to be competitive with the up-and-comers? Philip: Michelle should continue only if Olympic gold is not a monomania. If she likes to compete and doesn't mind having the losses go from rare to occasional, she should stay. In terms of jumps, she will be at a disadvantage. Brady: Do you think that "figure skating" should be call "ice jumping" now? Philip: Only if judges fail to give proper credit to spins. Chloe: Philip, why is Michelle Kwan held to a higher standard than any other skater? I remember Dick Button saying, "When somebody else falls you don't think twice, but when Michelle Kwan falls it's like national news." Do you think there is a double standard, and why? Philip: Michelle is judged against Michelle. That is the problem with having been so good right away. It is like the Carl Lewis of 1996 being judged against the Carl Lewis of 1984, with the difference being that the drop-off is objectively measurable on the track. Kwan remains very, very good, but in my mind, not as good as she was 4-to-6 years back. Marlena: Phil, what did you think of Michelle Kwan the first time you saw her skate? Did you see the potential she had to become the great champion she is today? Philip: The first time I saw her skate was at the 1993 U.S. Nationals, when she was a 12-year-old twig with the presence of a veteran. I thought she could be very, very good, but even in the fall of 1995, I did not foresee the brilliance that emerged at the 1996 Worlds. Celeste: Philip, Michelle Kwan has shown this past season that she is now a woman who wants to make her own decisions and is willing to take whatever comes from them. As a person and a sportswriter, what advice would you give her pertaining to life and skating? Philip: I would advise her to be even more independent. She can afford to. Michelle: Phil, what do you think would be the best thing for Michelle Kwan to do right now; continue skating, turn pro, take some time off (from skating), go back to school, or a combination of these? Philip: I am not inside her mind, but I think she should go back to school with no intention of returning to Olympic-style skating and then see if she misses it too much to stop now. Karen: Phil, If Michelle Kwan should stay eligible till 2006, what would you suggest she work on? Philip: She needs to do more difficult triples and try different music. I thought Chris Dean's SP from 2000/2001 was a move in the right direction, even if the other SP she used at the 2001 U.S. Nationals was stunning. In an SP, the sameness of her skating is not as obvious. Baryshnikov did not always dance the classics. Anonymous: Do you feel that B&S were terribly mistreated during the Olympics? Philip: I think they were worthy champions. I think Love Story is such a piece of hokum--and recycled hokum, to boot--that S&P suffered by comparison. The NBC-fueled outrage unfairly diminished B&S's achievement. Julianne C.: Why was NBC's coverage of the pairs scandal in SLC so decidedly and obviously one-sided? I was amazed by the strong anti- Russian sentiment exhibited by NBC. Philip: Sandra Bezic is Canadian. Scott Hamilton is always emotional on the air. Their outrage was not thought through. Julianne C.: What happened to Scott Hamilton's sense of judgment and professionalism during the men's LP? Why would a respected, well-loved figure give such an embarrassing commentating job in the name of creating false tension? Philip: I didn't see the TV coverage of the men, since I was at the arena. Cianni: Will you hold the judges accountable for the judging this season? The changes are not really any different and can still be manipulated. There are too many European judges at every event and we all know who will win. The media has the power to keep the feet to the fire. The sport will drop if the same judging continues. Philip: While I find Cinquanta's judging reform too complicated and secretive, I think he deserves credit for trying something radical. I will continue to make my points clear about obviously inept judging. Joesitz: Do you think that the judging of figure skating will be changed to the extent that the public and fans will be kept in a cloak of secrecy? Philip: I hope not. That secrecy is what I like the least about Cinquanta's system. Anonymous: I subscribe to the paper version of the Chicago Tribune and always enjoy your articles, however, I wish there were more of them. How do your editors determine how often you appear in the paper, and is there any way that number could be increased (assuming you would want to, of course!)?
Anonymous: You have written many unkind comments about the most decorated United States figure skater, Michelle Kwan. Do you ever regret what you have written? Philip: I regret that you did not sign your name to the question. Mine appears on everything I write. Paula: Thank you, Mr. Hersh, for taking the time out of your schedule to answer questions from your readers! Is there anything you would like to add? Philip: Keep reading. And, as those emailers who have sent thoughtful notes have learned, I try to reply to every reasonable email, especially the ones that contain well-reasoned criticism. |
Philip
Hersh has been the full-time Olympic specialist of the Chicago Tribune
since 1987 and is the senior figure skating writer among those who work
for non-specialized U.S. publications. He has covered figure skating since
the 1980 Olympics and has attended every Winter Olympics since. He has
also covered 11 of the past 13 World Championships, missing only the post-Olympic
championships in 1994 and 1998, and 17 of the last 19 U.S. Championships,
missing only 1986 and 1987. 
Philip:
I write whenever I feel I have something to write about. Skating/Olympic
sports competes in a smaller-than-ever news space allotment with a zillion
other things. I try not to ask for space if I have nothing important or
interesting to say. I wish papers had more space, but there are economic
considerations.