Final Lineup Confirmed for Campbell's Classic

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

Robin only became eville when Sarah stopped training hard and then quit the sport. I can only imagine what kind of exchanges occurred between those two to cause Sarah to completely cut off contact from her coach. I imagine they were a lot worse than the crap that happened with Sasha. Though I believe that everything went down the way it did with Sasha because Robin was so frustrated that she finally had a talented skater to work with yet that skater didn't want to work hard. I agree with Robin that Sasha just doesn't want to do what she needs to do to win.

I dunno...I find myself getting the feeling that RW isn't all that. The little episode we saw with her and Cohen may just be the tip of the iceberg...(and Hughes cutting off all contact with her? Ouch!)

I can't say anything about Cohen's training habits because I'm not with her following her around. But it's hard for me to believe that even someone as headstrong as Cohen wouldn't want to do what would help her win. Maybe the difference is in the way she wants to go about doing it. But I'm not going to speculate or assume that's the reason she's made so many coaching changes.

Red Dog, don't tell me you've found a skater you can be a fan of!

Now...just how did I see this coming? :scratch: :indiff: :biggrin:

attyfan · Sep 24, 2005

Red Dog said:
I dunno...I find myself getting the feeling that RW isn't all that. The little episode we saw with her and Cohen may just be the tip of the iceberg...(and Hughes cutting off all contact with her? Ouch!) ...

I think that you are probably correct. Hughes cut off contact; Sasha left; and Robin doesn't have any other big name students. Compare Robin with a coach like Frank Carroll -- who epitomizes class and discretion. (It was Tim who disclosed that Frank "fired" him; Frank never said anything.) When one of his big names left, he coached the other (Tim) to the first men's Oly medal in a decade; and since 2002, every American man on the world podium has been a Frank Carroll student.

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

Mathman said:
Here she is with evil puppet-master Pam (as opposed to good puppet-master Robyn).

http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2005/...sner,K-02lg.jpg

Back to the issue...

Actually there were only two more pictures of Meissner on that website. Here they are:

http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2005/oct/Meissner,K-18lg.jpg

http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2005/oct/Meissner,K-34lg.jpg

gezando · Sep 24, 2005

attyfan said:
I think that you are probably correct. Hughes cut off contact; Sasha left; and Robin doesn't have any other big name students. Compare Robin with a coach like Frank Carroll -- who epitomizes class and discretion. .

Oh please, that is unfair assessment of Robin. Hughes shared her victory parade with Robin post olys 2002, that is an indication of how much she respected Robin. Also Robin is one of the most devoted coaches, she drove Sarah 3 hrs one way to her daily practice. I could easily picture why Hughes cut off contact, most likely Hughes wanted to quit skating and enter college, and at her young age of 17, she probably did not know how to articulate that to Robin, or Hughes just wanted to cut off competitive skating all together.

Cohen left, so.....

Cohen left TT, and Tarasova immediately got herself a world champion. Cohen left Robin, but Robin is still a coach of an olympic gold winner, and Cohen is stil a bridesmaid at worlds and nationals

soogar · Sep 24, 2005

gezando said:
Also Robin is one of the most devoted coaches, she drove Sarah 3 hrs one way to her daily practice.

I read somewhere that Sarah was upset that she had to train in NJ when she had a rink located just a few minutes from her house (her sister trains in the LI rink). I don't know what was Robin's reasoning for making Sarah make that trip on a daily basis.

Robin does have a "top" student now : Silvia Fontana, therefore you might see her at the Olympics.

hockeyfan228 · Sep 24, 2005

soogar said:
I read somewhere that Sarah was upset that she had to train in NJ when she had a rink located just a few minutes from her house (her sister trains in the LI rink). I don't know what was Robin's reasoning for making Sarah make that trip on a daily basis.

I don't know what the business arrangments were or how much they influenced Wagner's decision; Moskvina got free ice time and good ice for her skaters, which is the reason why she "made" Berezhnaia and Sikuharlidze move to the US to train. However, one reason may have been that she wanted Hughes to skate on the same ice on a daily basis with the best -- B&S and the US champions Ina and Zimmerman -- in another discipline. There she was able to focus on the things she lacked as a young skater -- interpretive skills, polish -- by watching the "adults."

soogar · Sep 24, 2005

hockeyfan228 said:
However, one reason may have been that she wanted Hughes to skate on the same ice on a daily basis with the best -- B&S and the US champions Ina and Zimmerman -- in another discipline. There she was able to focus on the things she lacked as a young skater -- interpretive skills, polish -- by watching the "adults."

Well considering that Emily is a more polished and innovative skater than her sister, I would say that Sarah really didn't get a whole lot from watching B&S. According to boards, Sasha was floundering awhile with no home ice, training at Chelsea Piers and in Connecticut because the training arrangements with Ice House were not finalized (if you believe that was why Sasha was training everywhere but with her coach).

Personally, considering how much emphasis the Hughes placed on academic performance, a 3 hour commute takes so much out of the skaters' free time. Perhaps Robin wanted to keep control over Sarah by reducing as much of her free time as possible (less time for boys).

Mathman · Sep 24, 2005

Does Robin Wagner look like Katie Couric?

K-Mo · Sep 24, 2005

Mathman said:
Does Robin Wagner look like Katie Couric?

She kind of does! You could put Robin and Sarah next to Katie Couric and Reba McEntire. :laugh:

gezando · Sep 24, 2005

soogar said:
Well considering that Emily is a more polished and innovative skater than her sister, I would say that Sarah really didn't get a whole lot from watching B&S.

A matter of opinioin as to who is more polish. IMO Sarah was more polish.

Personally, considering how much emphasis the Hughes placed on academic performance, a 3 hour commute takes so much out of the skaters' free time. Perhaps Robin wanted to keep control over Sarah by reducing as much of her free time as possible (less time for boys).

Seriously, where does this Robin hate come from?? The reality was Robin took the time to drive Hughes to her training. Hughes had no problem with the 3 hr one way commute. There is no basis to say that Robin was trying to control Hughes and her dating experience. BTW, most Sarah fans don't have any problem with Robin. The three hr one way commute was years ago, it produced an OGM. Sarah cut off communication with Robin in the 03 -04 season when she was preparing for college. Sarah fans do not have any problem with it. That issue was never discussed on the boards bacl then. Somehow after Cohen and Robin parted ways in 04 - 05 season that all of a sudden these diss against Robin being controlling over Sarah started popping up.

Actually, Cohen was scrambling for a coach after TT, lucky for her that Robin took her. Robin was also gracious enough to drive from NY to CT initially to coach Cohen.

Joesitz (RIP) · Sep 24, 2005

TT suggested that Sasha get an American coach. I have no idea what prompted TT to suggest that.

I then think if she was staying in NYC (they had just bought a condo) that Robin's name came up. Who else was there? and no other Russian coach came forward and there are plenty in the tri-state-area.

Anyway, I think Sasha and the family have settled in California. We will not hear anything conclusive about these doings until a smart biographer (not an autobiographer) gets what was going on. No point in guessing.

Robin is getting a lot of flack in this thread for bringing Sarah to an OGM :scratch:

Joe

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

Seriously, where does this Robin hate come from??

Many people lost respect for her after the falling out between her and Cohen went public, and Robin "vented" her frustration to the press. Typically coaches (and skaters) keep stuff like that private. It was enough that Cohen found herself on the defensive, trying to do some "damage control". (That one ESPN interview comes to mind).

I don't really have an opinion on that, except that it's odd- if nothing happened, the speculation would never end. But now that a reason for a coaching breakup is known the coach gets docked for it. It's sort of a lose-lose situation either way.

I do think things between Robin and Sarah went downhill after Sarah decided she wanted to focus more on college. However, I just cannot buy what some people are saying here about Robin trying to deliberately take away Sarah's "free time". Maybe Robin had a contract with the rink 3 hrs. away and not with the closer one, and for whatever reason that couldn't be resolved? Sarah could always try to find another coach if she didn't like the commute, but she chose to stick it out. I think their relationship was fine in the beginning and up to the Olys. And yes, the partnership produced an OGM winner. But I think Sarah should get more credit than she's getting right now- she knew she had nothing to lose and she just went for it. Robin couldn't make Sarah do that, but she did it anyway.

JMO.

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

TT suggested that Sasha get an American coach. I have no idea what prompted TT to suggest that.

I think it had to do with a cultural issue (?)... another poster could probably give more info on that than I can, but I THINK it might have been a "respect" issue that MAY have involved (Sasha's) parents.

But keep in mind: This is mostly speculation. But Tarasova actually said something to this effect in some Russian article.

gezando · Sep 24, 2005

Joesitz said:
TT suggested that Sasha get an American coach. I have no idea what prompted TT to suggest that.

From reading fsu and other boards, during the press conference in Moscow worlds 05, Cohen said she prefers American coaches, and thought TT is not a good fit for American skaters. Galina Cohen was very public at the time of the Cohen TT break that TT was spending too much time on charity cases. Since TT was not willing to devote 100 percent of her time to little Ms. Cohen, Robin should be a good choice.

hink if she was staying in NYC (they had just bought a condo) that Robin's name came up. Who else was there?

Since Robin has money, she does not need to coach for a living, she can afford to dedicate herself to one skater at a time. She believed in Cohen, and was willing initially to drive from NY to CT to coach Cohen. She was willing to give 100 percent of her time to just one student, and she is an American coach.

Roin is getting a lot of flack in this thread for bringing Sarah to an OGM :scratch:

Joe

Certainly Sarah fans have never given Robin flack. Cohen fans initially were singing her praises. in fact the same people who were singing Robin praises are dissing Robin now. But why drag Sarah and Robin's working relationship in?? They worked well together.

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

From reading fsu and other boards, during the press conference in Moscow worlds 05, Cohen said she prefers American coaches, and thought TT is not a good fit for American skaters.

She said this??? Must have missed something...or not? :scratch:

Certainly Sarah fans have never given Robin flack. Cohen fans initially were singing her praises. in fact the same people who were singing Robin praises are dissing Robin now. But why drag Sarah and Robin's working relationship in?? They worked well together.

In a sense this is true. But what one has to keep in mind is that the Robin dissing didn't REALLY kick into gear until the Wagner/Cohen "fallout". People didn't know the "other side" of her so to speak. But beforehand, even many Cohen fans dreaded seeing her in the "kiss and cry" again :laugh:

Guess there's one too many bad memories :laugh:

gezando · Sep 24, 2005

Red Dog said:
She said this??? Must have missed something...or not? :scratch:

According to the messages on other boards, she said that. It was also mentioned that Cohen received some of the most tepid reception from some Russian audience, and prior to Mosow, Cohen fans were bragging that Cohen is the most popular American skater in Russia.Michelle received warmer response from some of the audience, according to the message boards.

People didn't know the "other side" of her so to speak.

Sarah fans see all sides of Robin and she is a very good coach.I am sure fans of another skaters are creating all sorts of eville side sand pin that on Robin, and that is IMO unfair. Even if they have a grudge against Robin, please don't drag Sarah in. :sheesh:

But beforehand, even many Cohen fans dreaded seeing her in the "kiss and cry" again Guess there's one too many bad memories

Oh Robin at Kiss and Cry :biggrin:

Well after the sp at olys 02, Cohen was in the driver's seat being third, and if she won the lp, she won the gold, by the time Robin made it to kiss and cry, oh well the rest is history, Sarah was on top, and Cohen missed the podium, bad memories indeed

Joesitz (RIP) · Sep 24, 2005

Red Dog said:
Many people lost respect for her after the falling out between her and Cohen went public, and Robin "vented" her frustration to the press. Typically coaches (and skaters) keep stuff like that private. It was enough that Cohen found herself on the defensive, trying to do some "damage control". (That one ESPN interview comes to mind).

On what public communication did Robin vent?

I think it had to do with a cultural issue (?)... another poster could probably give more info on that than I can, but I THINK it might have been a "respect" issue that MAY have involved (Sasha's) parents.

Cultural? All that Ukrainian/Russian influence? The question remains, did TT dump Sasha or not? This we do not know and we probably wont for a long time. I believe there was a clash of personalities, but I'm guessing. I don't think that Sasha's parents were involved in this except to pay for expenses.

Joe

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

gezando said:
According to the messages on other boards, she said that. It was also mentioned that Cohen received some of the most tepid reception from some Russian audience, and prior to Mosow, Cohen fans were bragging that Cohen is the most popular American skater in Russia. In fact even Michelle received warmer response from the audience, according to the message boards.

I DID hear of the few that were booing Cohen and chanting something to the effect of "Fall! Fall!", but reading the reports from FSU it was only a small minority of the crowd. It was just one section or something like that and a lot of people (including non-Cohen fans) were in mass disapproval of this.

About Cohen fans "bragging" that she was the most popular American skater in Russia, I think that was limited to the message boards. Were there actually people THERE doing that? (I find that somewhat difficult to believe.)

I think you're making it sound worse than it actually was (reported to be). I read many of these eyewitness reports as well.

However, I don't know about Kwan getting a better response than Cohen. It might have happened (or not), but really, I don't care so I won't talk about that.

gezando · Sep 24, 2005

Red Dog said:
I think you're making it sound worse than it actually was (reported to be). I read many of these eyewitness reports as well.

However, I don't know about Kwan getting a better response than Cohen. It might have happened (or not), but really, I don't care so I won't talk about that.

You are a bit sensitive??I am not making it worse than it was. I said Cohen received some tepid response from some audience, not all the audience. i said Michelle received warmer response from some audience. That was from reading eye witnesses. I was not there. So what is your problem ??

R.D. · Sep 24, 2005

Joesitz said:
On what public communication did Robin vent?

I put "vent" in quotation marks because it was more like "complaining" but I don't know. Anyway, to answer your question, her interview with ESPN (pre-Nats I think) was one where she definitely was talking to the press. Also I THINK she was quoted in a few articles about Cohen's coaching change.

The question remains, did TT dump Sasha or not? This we do not know and we probably wont for a long time. I believe there was a clash of personalities, but I'm guessing. I don't think that Sasha's parents were involved in this except to pay for expenses.

I agree with this- except for the last sentence. It's been reported that her mom played a role in this whole thing, but that's also speculation.

Final Lineup Confirmed for Campbell's Classic

R.D.

attyfan

Custom Title

R.D.

gezando

soogar

hockeyfan228

soogar

Mathman

K-Mo

gezando

Joesitz (RIP)

R.D.

R.D.

gezando

R.D.

gezando

Joesitz (RIP)

R.D.

gezando

R.D.

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