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Thread: ISU ladies standings

  1. #16
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly
    I was referring to Slutskaya's 9th place at 2004 Worlds.
    I shouldn't open a can of worms here because IS was just getting out of sick bed, but she was held up getting that ninth place. If I remember correctly Susanna and Joannie skated better than her in Dortmund and I believe they were finished behind her.

    Joe

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly
    They tell us who has had the best combination of results in international events across the last three seasons. In general, better skaters will get better results and more ranking points. But participating in fewer competitions, whether because you just don't want to, you're physically unable to during the week of competition, or your federation chooses not to send you, or any other reason, gets you fewer points, regardless of the actual quality of your skating.
    Well that's what a ranking is all about. In tennis, if a player misses a season or doesn't play in many events, the player's ranking suffers unless this player is able to win the really big events (Grand Slams) that are heavily weighted. The skating rankings are messed up because not every skater gets to compete in Worlds and only a handful of skaters compete in GP events. Also there are many skaters who compete the GP who don't go to Worlds and vice versa. I feel that since skaters have to compete in qualifying rounds anyway at worlds, let as many skaters who qualify (via Nationals [for skaters who don't receive GP invites and are from smaller federations] , the Grand Prix and prior worlds) compete. That way you can legitimately give the World championships a lot of weight (as well as 4Cs and Euros) and it would be an accurate reflection of where everyone stands. I also think that it would encourage more US skaters to compete in 4Cs and make that event as prestigious as Euros if they knew that they had a shot to compete at Worlds based on 4C results. If it means 6 US ladies and 5 Japanese ladies competing in worlds then all the better. It definitely would bring up the level of competition because quite frankly, the event would be more competitive if the 5th ranked Japanese lady competed instead of one of those skaters who wouldn't even make it out of sectionals if they tried for the US team (ie the OES skaters).

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz
    I shouldn't open a can of worms here because IS was just getting out of sick bed, but she was held up getting that ninth place. If I remember correctly Susanna and Joannie skated better than her in Dortmund and I believe they were finished behind her.

    Joe
    She was held up because I think she only landed 3 triples , while Jenny Kirk made 5 triple attempts and landed 3 and finished 17th or something.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by soogar
    I feel that since skaters have to compete in qualifying rounds anyway at worlds, let as many skaters who qualify (via Nationals [for skaters who don't receive GP invites and are from smaller federations] , the Grand Prix and prior worlds) compete.
    Of course, if you did this, it would require more than two qual rounds, more ice time, more officials, hotel time, etc., all of which adds to the cost.

    And would make Worlds even more of a big event in all senses of the word, which might indeed be a positive thing.

    You probably still have to draw the line somewhere at the number of entries per country, even if you make the maximum 5 or 10 instead of 3.

    My suggestion, in that case, would be to give every federation one free entry in each discipline, and charge a high entry fee for every additional skater/team entered, or some variation on that theme, to help cover the additional costs.

    Meanwhile, the main significance of the current ISU ranking system is to determine which skaters who didn't compete at the last Worlds or didn't finish well there get priority for Grand Prix invitations, especially the ones who don't represent GP host countries. For that purpose it works well enough. Just don't expect a direct correlation between the rankings and the latest Worlds results.

  5. #20
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    I really don't find fault with the ISU's rankings. The criteria is clear and if a skater cares about this, the skater will enter that many more ISU events.

    In Michelle's case, I think she couldn't care less.

    Joe

  6. #21
    Custom User Title CDMM1991's Avatar
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    Joannie Rochette finished 8th, ahead of IS, but yes I agree she was held up.

  7. #22
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    And Poykio finished ahead of Slutskaya in both their qual round (4th vs. 5th) and the final long program (10th vs. 11th); it was her 15th place in the short that held her down overall.

  8. #23
    Tripping on the Podium
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    I think this whole ranking business that the ISU started a few years back is a total joke. I don't believe I have ever heard more than a casual reference to it by any of the commentators or figure skating officials. And I'm pretty certain that most of us don't even take is seriously. Tennis and figure skating are not the same type of sports, unless the ISU plans to revamp figure skating to be like a tournament which skaters facing off one another. Oh wait, they did try that for the Grand Prix Finals for a couple of years...I wonder whatever happen to that format.
    Last edited by TNT2012; 09-29-2005 at 06:21 PM.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfan5
    If the ISU ranking mattered a great deal to Michelle, I'm sure she would have put those events higher on her priority list. It's obviously higher on the ISU's list than it is on Michelle's the past few years. But she previously competed in the series (two and three events plus final) for quite a few seasons (5 at least).
    ITA. She does what suit her FS career as WHOLE......She said in a interview that she is selective for what events she wanted to be in. She did just that for last couple of seasons.

  10. #25
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    ISU ranking list is based on skaters´ results from ISU competitions. To get points one needs to compete... So, skaters that compete at ISU events get ranking points from the events they participate in. Skaters that don´t compete, don´t get ranking points from events they are not participating in, LOL. I think the system is simple and fair.

    The fact that Kwan has chosen not to participate in GP events and as result does not get as high ranking points from the season as those that are competing in those events and elsewhere, does not make the ranking system wrong or biased.

  11. #26
    Down With It
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaana

    The fact that Kwan has chosen not to participate in GP events and as result does not get as high ranking points from the season as those that are competing in those events and elsewhere, does not make the ranking system wrong or biased.
    But it's not just Kwan- and I'd be the last person ever to defend her- it's the whole system IMO. Maybe it's OK since they are basing the rankings over several years, but I still can't put much stock in the ratings. Do you really think that Irina is 4th in the world? Suguri 3rd? Arakawa 1st? (THIS YEAR I mean)

    If they did it by year, I don't know, maybe it would look better/more accurate. But for now, it's somewhat outdated IMO.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    Do you really think that Irina is 4th in the world? Suguri 3rd? Arakawa 1st? (THIS YEAR I mean)
    According to the ranking system it is right, because it bases on the participations/results from several years. Although Irina is only 4th according to this ISU ranking system, it does not diminish her worth as 2005 World champion at all, in my opinion.

  13. #28
    It's all about Plushenko.
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    It's based pretty heavily on the Grand Prix. Shizuka Arakawa is nice and all, but she finished 8th at the past Worlds.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicole_l
    It's based pretty heavily on the Grand Prix. Shizuka Arakawa is nice and all, but she finished 8th at the past Worlds.
    Yes, but Shizuka´s win at 2004 World Championships still counts. Plus of course her participations in other competitions where she got points. The system quite rightfully favours skaters that participate in ISU competitions. Or are there many opinions that perhaps all other international competitions except Europeans/Cup, Worlds and Olympics should cease to exist?

  15. #30
    Creative Compilation Compiler aka 3axel
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    This rating system is complete nonsense. It isn't worth the time of day. It's just another gimmik, thought up by $peedy, to promote his cash cow, the GP series.

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