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Thread: Michelle's Proof-of-Recovery Skate, Jan 16

  1. #31
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    is a bye fair?
    ....I'm not real comfortable with a bye, because it implies that Michelle owned a spot all along and that Nats was meaningless for her. Now is that fair to those who will compete at Nats? In 91, Jill Trenary asked for a bye and in 96, Nicole Bobek asked for a bye, both times because of a slow recovery from an injury, and both times the answer was no.
    Let's see, how could a "bye" imply that "Nats was meaningless for her"? There are "byes" in the majority of sports for injuries, etc. I don't think Nicole Bobek is a fair comparison because despite being "injured", she still skated in the Nutcracker on Ice. That, to me, is a whole different horse of a really strange color.

    And Jill was a toss up although I had hoped she would be on the team, but at least she didn't go out touring while she was injured.

    Personally, I don't see the problem with requesting a "bye" based on an injury at all, for anyone. And we do want to send the best we have. How do we know Kwan won't be the best in Torino and win gold? Ok, so I can still hope, ya know. I just don't see how getting a "bye" based on medical reasons, ie injury, illness, is such an unfair or wrong thing.

  2. #32
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    constant injury

    Quote Originally Posted by realistic51
    Let's see, how could a "bye" imply that "Nats was meaningless for her"? There are "byes" in the majority of sports for injuries, etc. I don't think Nicole Bobek is a fair comparison because despite being "injured", she still skated in the Nutcracker on Ice. That, to me, is a whole different horse of a really strange color.

    And Jill was a toss up although I had hoped she would be on the team, but at least she didn't go out touring while she was injured.

    Personally, I don't see the problem with requesting a "bye" based on an injury at all, for anyone. And we do want to send the best we have. How do we know Kwan won't be the best in Torino and win gold? Ok, so I can still hope, ya know. I just don't see how getting a "bye" based on medical reasons, ie injury, illness, is such an unfair or wrong thing.
    Don't you think there is a problem being injured for the entire SEASON?? AND she did skate at Marshall's which I would compare to Nutcracker on ice. $50,000...how much was Bobek paid?Unfortunately I didn't get to see Bobeck but I would bet she didn't land any tripple top loops going forward. Waiting to many years to do difficulty again is what I'd bet the problem is. Riding on the 6'Os Michelle was doing more techical in 1998.
    Last edited by sk8addict; 01-05-2006 at 10:19 AM.

  3. #33
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    [QUOTE=show 42]I don't think Michelle has anything to be "sad" about, career-wise. Many athletes keep competing that "one last time", even perhaps past their prime....ex. Brian Boitano, Kurt Browning......


    I wouldn't have said Browning was past his prime--he retired in 94 after his disappointing Olympics (bet he wishes COP was in place then!), but was the 93 World Champion, and I believe silver at 95 Worlds--not exactly past his prime!

  4. #34
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    One also has to look relatively at the situation.

    Kwan is still one of the top skaters. But the real question behind whether to give her a bye or not is this: Can an injured Kwan, or an OK Kwan, have a better chance to place high and get a medal than whoever the alternate would be? The results of the US Ladies in the GP don't sound too promising. Can Kwan pull better scores than they can? That's what the USFS has to think about.

  5. #35
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    last year

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    One also has to look relatively at the situation.

    Kwan is still one of the top skaters. But the real question behind whether to give her a bye or not is this: Can an injured Kwan, or an OK Kwan, have a better chance to place high and get a medal than whoever the alternate would be? The results of the US Ladies in the GP don't sound too promising. Can Kwan pull better scores than they can? That's what the USFS has to think about.
    She was one of the top skaters last year. We don't know that she can skate a competition at all this year. Marshall's wasn't really a real competion & you saw how she skated. Tod Eldredge stayed around longer than he should have & some young skater who could have gotten someOlympic experience didn't. USFSA kept 6.0 around longer than they should. What ever happened to going out on top & gracefully.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    One also has to look relatively at the situation.

    Kwan is still one of the top skaters. But the real question behind whether to give her a bye or not is this: Can an injured Kwan, or an OK Kwan, have a better chance to place high and get a medal than whoever the alternate would be? The results of the US Ladies in the GP don't sound too promising. Can Kwan pull better scores than they can? That's what the USFS has to think about.
    All they need to do is look at the Worlds 2005 results. Even with few recent competitions behind her and her first outing under COP with non-COP-friendly programs (and a fall even in the LP), she still managed to place third in both the SP and LP. Would any other American skater (including Cohen) have been able to pull off that kind of feat?
    Last edited by havanamesa1; 01-05-2006 at 02:22 AM.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    Kwan is still one of the top skaters. But the real question behind whether to give her a bye or not is this: Can an injured Kwan, or an OK Kwan, have a better chance to place high and get a medal than whoever the alternate would be? The results of the US Ladies in the GP don't sound too promising. Can Kwan pull better scores than they can? That's what the USFS has to think about.
    That's why I would use 4CC as a test run.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptichka
    That's why I would use 4CC as a test run.
    Unfortunately, Four Continents coincides with the deadline for naming the U.S. OLY team (1/30), so that's out of the question.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by curious
    was the marshall joke televised? she doesn't have to prove a thing cause she is da kween lol!

    That was a popularity win not a win based on her present skating abilities - formula won't work at the Olympics.

    Even the best have to prove they are healthy and ready.

  10. #40
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    Remember Elvis in 98. He didn't do so bad even with his injury. Michelle said if she wasn't 100% she would pull her own self out of the Olympics even if the powers that be said she was okay.

    Michelle is going to the Olympics to win not for the Olympic experience. If she doesn't think she can win, you won't see her there.JMO

    Ladybug

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by sk8addict
    Don't you think there is a proble being injured for the entire SEASON?? AND she did skate at Marshall's which I would compare to Nutcracker on ice. Unfortunately I didn't get to see Bobeck but I would bet she didn't land any tripple top loops going forward. Waiting to many years to do difficulty again is what I'd bet the problem is. Riding on the 6'Os Michelle was doing more techical in 1998.
    I wouldn't compare Marshalls to the Nutcracker on Ice because the Nutcracker was a tour, not a one time skate. Nicole "toured" with them and some say that is the reason the USFS didn't give her the bye. And had you seen Bobek you would realize that the USFS probably made a wise decision.

    There are huge differences anyway. When Kerrigan came back and had to do her test skate, she wasn't at 100 percent. But by Olympics she was doing pretty darn good to win a silver medal (and I still think she should have been over Baiul). So I just don't see the comparisons with Bobek at all. And I don't see how a bye is unfair. Here we are, 12 years later, and now Kwan is trying to do the same thing that was essentially done to her when Kerrigan got the bye to skate on the Oly team.

  12. #42
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    Isn't there an alternate? (like MK in 1994?) They will most likely name MK to the team and then before the Olympic competition begins, if she is unable to skate the alternate will be able to fill in. I think it makes sense to put her on the team, as well as Sasha if she is injured - because the other girls do not have a great chance at a medal.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by sk8fanconvert
    you are hilarious!

    OFF TOPIC: will you please get a job with ABC/ESPN and do commentary?!
    sk8fanconvert - THANKS, Where do I apply???!!!

    Freekatie - Of course, there'll be an alternate (most likely whoever captures the bronze medal at Natls). Given the gravity of Michelle's injury, that alternate stands a very, VERY good chance of eventually skating in the Olys, even though the ladies portion of the Olys happens at the very end of the Games. HOWEVER - the following scenario would be a real 'bummer' for that alternate: Michele is deemed fit to skate. Michele & the alternate both travel to Turin. Michele does well in practices & Team USA's doctor gives Michelle the thumbs-up. Michelle skates the SP but aggravates her injury & has to withdraw. SO THE ALTERNATE CANNOT STEP IN & TAKE OVER MICHELE'S SPOT FOR THE LONG PROGRAM.

    In other words: I sure hope that the Team's doctors are absolutely certain that Michele can withstand the ENTIRE competition & not just the SP.

  14. #44
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    prove it

    Quote Originally Posted by realistic51
    I wouldn't compare Marshalls to the Nutcracker on Ice because the Nutcracker was a tour, not a one time skate. Nicole "toured" with them and some say that is the reason the USFS didn't give her the bye. And had you seen Bobek you would realize that the USFS probably made a wise decision.

    There are huge differences anyway. When Kerrigan came back and had to do her test skate, she wasn't at 100 percent. But by Olympics she was doing pretty darn good to win a silver medal (and I still think she should have been over Baiul). So I just don't see the comparisons with Bobek at all. And I don't see how a bye is unfair. Here we are, 12 years later, and now Kwan is trying to do the same thing that was essentially done to her when Kerrigan got the bye to skate on the Oly team.
    Kerrigan had to prove she could skate 2 full programs. Kwan said at Marshall's she would be ready for Nationals. She's not. If she's ready for Olympics she should have to show she can skate. Kerrigans injury was not self inflicted. She was attacked. That was different. Kerrigan sure would not have beaten Baiul in COP. Nutcracker on Ice does not require jumps like a Marshall's does. It's playing a pretend role & being pretty..
    Last edited by sk8addict; 01-05-2006 at 10:36 AM.

  15. #45
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    thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by Frau Muller
    sk8fanconvert - THANKS, Where do I apply???!!!

    Freekatie - Of course, there'll be an alternate (most likely whoever captures the bronze medal at Natls). Given the gravity of Michelle's injury, that alternate stands a very, VERY good chance of eventually skating in the Olys, even though the ladies portion of the Olys happens at the very end of the Games. HOWEVER - the following scenario would be a real 'bummer' for that alternate: Michele is deemed fit to skate. Michele & the alternate both travel to Turin. Michele does well in practices & Team USA's doctor gives Michelle the thumbs-up. Michelle skates the SP but aggravates her injury & has to withdraw. SO THE ALTERNATE CANNOT STEP IN & TAKE OVER MICHELE'S SPOT FOR THE LONG PROGRAM.

    In other words: I sure hope that the Team's doctors are absolutely certain that Michele can withstand the ENTIRE competition & not just the SP.
    Thanks to you for stating the obvious!!

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