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- Dec 30, 2005
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/special_packages/olympics/13635616.htm
Interesting final quote from Miss Kwan...
Interesting final quote from Miss Kwan...
Frank Carroll says this team is weaker than SLC
- Thread starter Misplaced Gymnast
- Start date
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
Well the team is weaker than the 2002 team and the 1998 teams. I don't expect Frank Carroll to be singing Kwan's praises. He's still carrying a grudge from being fired by her, LOL. I don't see that he's has produced anyone to help out the cause. We are sending the best we have. Kirk, Nikodinov, nd Hughes I, who all had international experience, chose not to stick with it because of personal reasons or injury. Kwan has been injured and Kimmie has no international experience.
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- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Obviously this team is not on a par with the 1998 team. Michelle and Tara were considered absolute shoo-ins for number one and number two. And so it proved, although maybe not in the order that most people expected.
In 2002, the situation was a little different, not because the American team was weaker, but because the competition was stronger. Slutskaya was slightly favored over Kwan, and Butyrskaya was a strong contender for bronze.
This year, Irina is very strongly favored for gold no matter what the Americans do, and there will very likely be at least one Japanese lady on the podium.
MM
In 2002, the situation was a little different, not because the American team was weaker, but because the competition was stronger. Slutskaya was slightly favored over Kwan, and Butyrskaya was a strong contender for bronze.
This year, Irina is very strongly favored for gold no matter what the Americans do, and there will very likely be at least one Japanese lady on the podium.
MM
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Nagano - It was Tara v. Michelle with Lu Chen to spoil.
SLC - It was Irina v. Michelle with Sasha to spoil. Who knew Sarah could pull it off?
Torino (or Turin if you prefer) - It is Irina v. Sasha with Shizuka to spoil.
The above is JMO but I can't help but wonder where Caroll is at?
Joe
SLC - It was Irina v. Michelle with Sasha to spoil. Who knew Sarah could pull it off?
Torino (or Turin if you prefer) - It is Irina v. Sasha with Shizuka to spoil.
The above is JMO but I can't help but wonder where Caroll is at?
Joe
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2005
It is still a very strong team but not on par with last two. In 98 they were virtual shoo-ins to go 1-2. In 2002 they had 3 strong medal contenders, 2 supposed gold medal contenders(Hughes was the one not considered a gold contender IMO), and a good chance to win 2 of the 3 medals, and a shoo-in to win atleast 1.
This time around they dont have the gold medal favorite, they are likely to win 1 medal, but unlikely to win 2, and one of their skaters will be hard-pressed to reach the top 10(Meissner).
This time around they dont have the gold medal favorite, they are likely to win 1 medal, but unlikely to win 2, and one of their skaters will be hard-pressed to reach the top 10(Meissner).
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2003
Frank is right that this team is weaker than the 1998 or 2002 teams. Going back further, it's also weaker than the 1988 or1992 ladies teams.
However, despite this, I feel confident that the U.S. ladies will win at least one medal. Sasha's chances to medal (and win) are excellent. As to Michelle--who knows. It's still not completely out of the question that she could medal (although it does seem unlikely). Kimmie will not medal, but I predict she will do better than Nicole Bobek's 17th place in 1998. I would not be surprised to see a top 10 or top 12 finish from Kimmie.
So we may not come out so bad. It won't be like 1992 or 2002, when we were 1-3-4. But you can't expect that kind of success in every Olympics.
However, despite this, I feel confident that the U.S. ladies will win at least one medal. Sasha's chances to medal (and win) are excellent. As to Michelle--who knows. It's still not completely out of the question that she could medal (although it does seem unlikely). Kimmie will not medal, but I predict she will do better than Nicole Bobek's 17th place in 1998. I would not be surprised to see a top 10 or top 12 finish from Kimmie.
So we may not come out so bad. It won't be like 1992 or 2002, when we were 1-3-4. But you can't expect that kind of success in every Olympics.
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2006
Joesitz said:
Why Arakawa? I would say that Ando has better chances. And what about Kostner? I think she is the real girl for Bronze! :yes:
:yes:
anything_for_skating said:Why Arakawa? I would say that Ando has better chances. And what about Kostner? I think she is the real girl for Bronze! :yes:
Arakawa has shown more consistancy this entire season than either Ando or Kostner. Kostner has shown very few glimpses of someone deserving of a bronze in a major competition. But we can all say how it "should" be on paper. It often doesn't result that way. That's why there is an actual competition.
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2005
My personal hunch is that Kwan will get the Butyrskaya treatment in Turin, meaning comparable to Butyrskaya in SLC. With her World ranking slipping the last couple years, with lack of exposure in front of international judges, she will be a real underdog in Turin, and will have to far outskate, and probably outjump, some of her chief competitors in order to finish ahead of them.
I think you almost have to go back to 1980 to find a team that wasn't as "stacked" as this one --
1980 - Fratianne was two-time world champ, Allen had a top 5 finish, but Lenz was the unknown.
1984 - Sumners and Zayak had world titles and Chin was on fire.
1988 - Thomas had a world title, Kadavy was the bronze medalist, and Trenary just needed to prove her potential, but she was top 7 the year before.
1992 - Obviously 1991 made the talk of a sweep very possible.
1994 - Hard to compare, since there were only 2 entries and the whole year was just plain weird ...
1998 & 2002 - already discussed here.
1980 - Fratianne was two-time world champ, Allen had a top 5 finish, but Lenz was the unknown.
1984 - Sumners and Zayak had world titles and Chin was on fire.
1988 - Thomas had a world title, Kadavy was the bronze medalist, and Trenary just needed to prove her potential, but she was top 7 the year before.
1992 - Obviously 1991 made the talk of a sweep very possible.
1994 - Hard to compare, since there were only 2 entries and the whole year was just plain weird ...
1998 & 2002 - already discussed here.
I don't know, I don't think this team is too shabby. You've got Sasha, National champ, two times world silver medalist, numerous Grand Prix medals, Michelle, 9 times National champ, 5 times World champ, Grand Prix winner at least once, and Kimberly whose got triple-triple jumps plus a triple axel in her arsenal.....a nice set of credentials I'm thinking...........42
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2003
The team is certainly weaker than the one at SLC:
Cohen has the same role on the team this time as Kwan had 4 years ago - the strongest team member. Except that Kwan was the reigning gold medalist, while Cohen is the reigning silver one.
Kwan has the same role on the team as Hughes had 4 years ago - a reliable skater who can really rise to the top if others make mistakes.
This leaves us comparing Sasha of 4 years ago with Kimmie of today. I'd certainly say that edge goes to Sasha 4 years ago, Kimmie's axel notwithstanding.
Cohen has the same role on the team this time as Kwan had 4 years ago - the strongest team member. Except that Kwan was the reigning gold medalist, while Cohen is the reigning silver one.
Kwan has the same role on the team as Hughes had 4 years ago - a reliable skater who can really rise to the top if others make mistakes.
This leaves us comparing Sasha of 4 years ago with Kimmie of today. I'd certainly say that edge goes to Sasha 4 years ago, Kimmie's axel notwithstanding.
First, I don't think that Frank has any "sour grapes" about Michelle -- he said repeatedly that he thought she deserved the "bye".. I think he told the truth -- Michelle is a "question mark", and even if she passes the test skate with flying colors (which won't occur for another two weeks or so), she will still be one. Yet, it has been when the "chips were down" and the situation was "impossible" that she has come up with some dynomite skates -- her FS at Worlds in '00 and her FS at Worlds in '04 (after the streaker, no less), so that bodes well -- if she can pass her test skate.
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2004
Honestly, I am scared to predict anything when it comes to the Olympics. I thought Kurt was going to score both times he went; true to that freaky Olympic vibe, he didn't. Everyone had written Paul Wylie off and thought Bowman and Eldredge were the ones to watch on the American team in 1992. And-then look what Paul did! I was frozen to my seat with pure joy and amazement.
I felt Michelle was sure to win after 1998 Nationals. Then-the wattage just wasn't there in Nagano. Sarah Hughes; that was another bolt from the blue. Not to mention two bronze medals for Phillipe Candeloro! I give up!
I felt Michelle was sure to win after 1998 Nationals. Then-the wattage just wasn't there in Nagano. Sarah Hughes; that was another bolt from the blue. Not to mention two bronze medals for Phillipe Candeloro! I give up!
a pox
Usually I agree with much of what Mr. Carroll says.....but in this case, I feel great about our team...and by that, I mean that I think Weir, Inoue/Baldwin, Cohen, and Belbin/Agostino will ALL come home with a medal of SOME color. That's what I call a "sweep" no matter whether gold, silver, or bronze medals come home.
I realize that Mr. Carroll is speaking of the women's team in particular, but he has no corner on that "market" any longer, despite helping train Bebe or others trying to "work their way up". Perhaps he's a little out of the loop these days in that little corner of the world and unnecessarily gloomy as a result. A pox on that. No matter that I love him for what he has meant to this sport and for the many skaters whom he has helped, he seems to always have had a tendency to support what he thinks to be the "sure thing" and not much imagination for the magic of "possibilities" (I believe this to be perhaps his ONE big failing, both personally and in the way he trains his students)....and, as we have seen too many times in this sport.....there has ALWAYS been magic as an ingredient for outcome at many many Olympics.....can you name them....?....Wiley, Manley, Lipinski, Baiul, Hughes, all those "weak" young, untested, after-thought-team members.......
Usually I agree with much of what Mr. Carroll says.....but in this case, I feel great about our team...and by that, I mean that I think Weir, Inoue/Baldwin, Cohen, and Belbin/Agostino will ALL come home with a medal of SOME color. That's what I call a "sweep" no matter whether gold, silver, or bronze medals come home.
I realize that Mr. Carroll is speaking of the women's team in particular, but he has no corner on that "market" any longer, despite helping train Bebe or others trying to "work their way up". Perhaps he's a little out of the loop these days in that little corner of the world and unnecessarily gloomy as a result. A pox on that. No matter that I love him for what he has meant to this sport and for the many skaters whom he has helped, he seems to always have had a tendency to support what he thinks to be the "sure thing" and not much imagination for the magic of "possibilities" (I believe this to be perhaps his ONE big failing, both personally and in the way he trains his students)....and, as we have seen too many times in this sport.....there has ALWAYS been magic as an ingredient for outcome at many many Olympics.....can you name them....?....Wiley, Manley, Lipinski, Baiul, Hughes, all those "weak" young, untested, after-thought-team members.......
I think Frank is quite knowledgeable. He's the coach of a reigning Oly medalist and a current world medalist and has an athlete on this team but he's a realist. He's put 3 athlete's on the podium in this quad and done the rounds at int'l comps with about 3 others so he knows who and what is out there.
We don't have a Hughes who was almost wild at times when she would go all out for any spot at any comp. Therefore we have 2 athletes whose hands we know and a third who we don't. A question mark- like he said.
We don't have a Hughes who was almost wild at times when she would go all out for any spot at any comp. Therefore we have 2 athletes whose hands we know and a third who we don't. A question mark- like he said.
S
SkateFan4Life
Guest
IMHO, the best US Olympic women's figure skating team was the 1992 team of Kristi Yamaguchi, Tonya Harding, and Nancy Kerrigan. This is the trio that swept the medals at the 1991 worlds 
and they might have done the same thing at Albertville if:
-- Harding not chosen to remain in Oregon until after the Games started. She was jetlagged when she arrived, and she never got her act together.
-- Midori Ito had not landed that fabulous triple axel in her long program
-- Kerrigan skated a better long program
Oh well, there's a lot of "IFs" in that scenario!
and they might have done the same thing at Albertville if:-- Harding not chosen to remain in Oregon until after the Games started. She was jetlagged when she arrived, and she never got her act together.
-- Midori Ito had not landed that fabulous triple axel in her long program
-- Kerrigan skated a better long program
Oh well, there's a lot of "IFs" in that scenario!
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