Virtue/Mior

There is a high probablity that the 16/18 year old will be in the podium at 4CC, V/M beat a strong skate from Wing/Lowe both in Original and the Free Skate! Wing and Lowe did well in the grand Prix even medaled so that says something!

They definitely have a bright future ahead of them. I saw them at Celebration On Ice in December, and they are a treat to watch.

V/M barely beat W/L in the OD and FD. It was a virtual tie.

Well I hope they can get a podium finish at 4CC's. I love this team but have only seen them in downloads. I'd love to get their FD on tape.

hockeyfan228 said:

V/M barely beat W/L in the OD and FD. It was a virtual tie.

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Still they beat them, some even say they where undermarked plus Wing/Lowe could beat the second american team easy so why can't Virtue/Mior

Actually, the "second American team" (Gregory/Petuhkov) outfinished W/L in the GP, pointwise. G/P aren't going to 4CC due to illness, and are being replaced by Matthews/Zavozin.

Besides that, Nationals results don't compare to ISU results. Maybe V/M beat W/L at Nationals in some of the segments, but ISU judges' results might be completely different.

If the ISU judges results were different than the national results, I would expect that the difference would be to give Virtue/Moir even more of a lead over Wing/Lowe than the Canadian national judges did. International judges have been in love with Virtue/Moir over the past two seasons on the Junior Grand Prix.

Having said that, I think that the really interesting matchup at Four Continents will be between Virtue/Moir and Matthews/Zavozin. These teams were virtually tied last season on the Junior Grand Prix, with a very slight edge going to Matthews/Zavozin. It will be interesting to see how these two teams have progressed relative to last year in the eyes of the judges.

Obviously Matthews/Zavozin need to skate clean, which they did not do at the American nationals. I think that if Matthews/Zavozin and Virtue/Moir both skate clean (and I hope that they do), then both teams will place ahead of Silverstein/O'Meara, but I would not predict in which order.

geoskate said:

If the ISU judges results were different than the national results, I would expect that the difference would be to give Virtue/Moir even more of a lead over Wing/Lowe than the Canadian national judges did. International judges have been in love with Virtue/Moir over the past two seasons on the Junior Grand Prix.

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I disagree. First, there was as compelling a political reason to overmark V/M at Canadian Nationals -- i.e., to give them Olympic experience before 2010 in Vancouver -- as to overmark W/L -- i.e., to reward them for working very hard for Skate Canada.

The International judges were in love with V/M, although more so with Matthews/Zavozin, in the Junior ranks. In Juniors, not only is the program 30 seconds shorter, but because the skaters are so young, they aren't expected to have the presentation or maturity of couples in their mid-late twenties and early 30's. Tech is what stacks the deck in the junior ranks of any discipline. Juniors who compete in the international senior ranks for the first time usually don't do particularly well. Even Domnina/Shabalin were 15th at their first Worlds, just behind Gudina/Beletski.

Virtue/Moir's programs may be stacked with difficulty, but their footwork sequences in particular slow down their program, and they look like exercises. They had classic Shpilband programs, and like Belbin/Agosto, I expect that they will grow into them with more speed and polish. They couldn't touch the quality of flow that Wing/Lowe brought to their programs. I was shocked at how well W/L performed their tango free skate, considering how new it was and how it was the first performance in competition.

Their free skate wasn't new in that they've skated it before...however, they just never skated the whole 4 minutes of it. I mean it is basically their Jr Free dance, with about an extra minute. So technically, they have skated it, and should know it fairly well. Other than adding a little more footwork and a couple of more elements. I think that this year is packed with so much difficulty that it definitely has slowed them down a little in the footwork sequences. Last year's Sr dance for V/M seemed to flow a little more effortlessly.

But I think that is due to the desire to measure up in the Sr. ranks and really push themselves. And this is what I LOVE about V&M. Because they don't sit back and do what is 'easy'. But they do what challenges them!

ITA, jayta, about last year's FD flowed better. I found myself liking that FD a lot more whereas this year's FD does seem sort of mechanical especially in the latter half and looks like "exercise" at times just like hockyfan said. But the dance is packed with many more difficult steps and holds than last year--maybe a little too many. I expect that maturity, power, and ease will come with time. Moir, especially, is such a wonderful dancer technically and artistically, but he's still noticeably smaller than all the other guys out there. I believe their physical appearance hurts them especially in their projection. At the same time, I don't think they are quite mature enough in their presentation to pull off the latin/spanish style of dancing yet (such as this year's OD and FD), but their musicality and dancibility really came through in their standard (as in ballroom) dances such as last year's foxtrot/quickstep OD and tango FD. I'll sit back and wait for the two to mature physically and artistically because I believe they have SO much potential.

I have to disagree with the assessment that their physical appearance has really hurt them. I mean, watching them, I feel they are as 'big' as any of the top skaters in the world, when they perform. They emote soooooo well. I love that about them. I love that BOTH of them emote. And that you can really feel the connection between them. The shipperness (tv fan term) would like to think that they could *end* up together I know that isn't so....but it really is the result of how GREAT they skate and connect to each other.

As for the FD. Yeah, I really think that it isn't much the difficulty, as I've seen their earlier FDs (2003? I think and on...) and I think this year's FD was a combination of '03-'04 season FD and '04-'05 season's FD. I just think whoever choreographed it didn't really see it as a whole dance. I can appreciate the difficulties of the holds and changes of holds, but I think whoever choreographed it was thinking more about difficulty than the dance as a whole. Plus, I think that certain executions of spins and twizzles in footwork sequences haven't been thought out right. Like those turns inbetween spinning Tessa in the footwork sequence has Scott spinning with his leg straight out, which would be more difficult, but if you're going to do that, you've really got to teach the poor guy to have a tighter core, so that you don't spin wonky, throwing your rhythm out of wack.

But anyways, I digress. I thought this season was probably a big learning experience for these two. They are *going* to win Jrs this year. I have no doubt. But I see this year also as an opportunity to learn from the mistakes of this season on the Sr. International scene, as well as gaining experience psychologically.

I actually enjoyed this year's OD. I think Scott did a wonderful job in it. I felt like he was a latin dancer, as I've said before. And the FD, well, I do notice a few things that V&M need to work on - as Tessa said, she doesn't have much flexibility in her back. I also think that the FD was kind of hard, because all of the dances seemed very similar. In the respect that they were all seemingly latin in taste. I would love to see V&M do something more modern...maybe? These two are so great at dance - they have that passion and natural feel for music - that they can pretty much slip into any type of dance and blend in.

I can't wait for the rest of the year. And I'm sure after 4CC's slight stumble, they will go back to the drawing board to prepare for a spectacular Jr. Worlds. I have no doubt!