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Thread: Is Emily The Next Sasha, with respect to jump consistency?

  1. #46
    Custom Title Ogre Mage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    I think Alissa is WORSE than Cohen though when it comes to nerves. I mean, she had several multiple-fall performances after peaking at SA and SC. It's almost an insult actually IMO to compare the two in consistency.
    That is why I said (note bold letters):

    Quote Originally Posted by Ogre Mage
    OT, if there is anyone who is "The Next Sasha" it is Alissa Czisny. Alissa has lovely line, posture and carriage and has wonderful spins and spirals, just like Sasha. I think her presentation is great. Unfortunately she has the same problem as Sasha too -- makes mistakes on jumps under the pressure of major competitions. Alissa's jumping problems are IMO worse than Sasha's, even the Sasha of 2000-02. OTOH, Alissa's stroking and ice coverage is better than the Sasha of those days.

  2. #47
    what didn't kill me-made me stronger!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    Hey, Anything-for-skating, I noticed your post. I agree with all your points. Sasha has made many mistakes at the worst possible times in international competition. Other skaters also can do difficult spirals exhibiting great flecibility. Sasha does not have a monopoly on musical interpretation. Her Lutz is a flip. Irina, Plushenko and Lambiel are exceptional skaters, and Carolina has great potential despite an off year.

    The only thing I disagree about is, to me there will never be another Michelle.

    Your friend,


    Mathman

    Wow, sobebody FINALLY understands me when I'm saying that Sasha is not such a special skater. Yeah, there will never be another Ira, Plushy, Stephane, but also Carolina, and Jeffrey Buttle.
    P.S. check out "looking for Carolina's fans". Now we are talking about her worlds.

    Milochka

  3. #48
    MY TVC 1 5 SeaniBu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nubka
    Wow, all these replies, and stiil, nobody understands the meaning of my original post....

    This thread is NOT to compare Emily and Sasha's artisitry, etc., or to imply to Emily will be the "next" Sahsa - she won't.

    It was to point out Emily's recent problem getting trough her LP without falling on a jump, and that my hopes that she will not follow in Sasha's footsteps of not being able deliver a clean LP (or two clean programs babck to back,) when it really counts.

    That's it folks...

    Quote myself, 'Nof being harsh, I see what your point is, but it is one that you just got to say "put a hat on it." - clever but misleading.

  4. #49
    Custom Title antmanb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm
    Michelle was 12 at her Senior Nationals debut in 1993, when she finished 6th. Emily was 16 at her debut in 2005. Michelle won her first World Championship at 15 in 1996. Emily is just a bit behind.

    Michelle WON Junior Worlds at 13, in 1994. She also went to 1994 Worlds the same year, when Nancy Kerrigan declined to go, and finished 8th. (Kerrigan had failed to medal at Worlds in 1993. Kwan did not go to 1993 JW.)
    Emily went to 2005 Junior Worlds at 16, and won a bronze medal. She went to Worlds the following year and finished 8th--at 17.

    Michelle won nearly every competition she entered when she was 16. Emily has won zero competitions at the National or International Senior level since skating at US Nationals in 2005. Another MK? Sorry, Emily is already way too old to be another MK.
    But the rules were different when Michelle competed to now. Emily, indeed no one, could ever do what Michelle (or Tara, Sarah, or Oksana etc etc) did because they cannot enter senior championships until they're 16.

    Ant

  5. #50
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Interesting reads among these posts!

    The bottom line for me is that Emily through no fault of her own has been thrushed into the limelight by the media and nonfans of Kwan. I think this has put an added burden on her expectations for being a top ten skater who must win.

    Imo, there is enough talent there for her to lay low for a while; get out of the public spotlight; and spring a great skate at the next Campbells.

    Since this Emily post brought up Alissa, I would like to comment that I think with all her faults she is the best American Lady Figure Skater. No one comes near her when it comes to the basics. That stroking alone brightens my day, and when she does a rocker down the center of the ice, you see the body language, the rythym, the timing, the music. IMO, not many skaters have these qualities.

    I know it's not easy to overlook the poor jumping technique and that is the one flaw most posters center on. Well, those posters are right but I see her correcting this probldem in the future and winning the 2010 Olys.

    Joe

  6. #51
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    About Alissa, one of the commentators -- I think it was Dick Button at U.S. Nationals -- mentioned that Alissa had learned a poor jump technique where she turns her head to the side and kind of leans a little bit on her take-off.

    She has corrected this in practice, but -- according to Dick -- in the stress of competition sometimes old habits come back to plague you.

    MM
    Last edited by Mathman; 03-28-2006 at 01:18 PM.

  7. #52
    Lovin' the Kween ... Now and Forever
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    I think Emily is an energetic skater with lots of personality and confidence, but I don't really see her going that much further than she already has. She is a "heavy" skater, and by that I don't mean overweight ... but she is built solid from the waist down, and I tend to think this limits the height on her jumps ... which may cause problems with thoughts of 3/3/ combos. I think she won't match up well against Kimmie, Mao and Yu-Na in the next few years, but you never know.

  8. #53
    Custom Title antmanb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    About Alissa, one of the commentators -- I think it was Dick Button at U.S. Nationals -- mentioned that Alissa had learned a poor jump technique where she turns her head to the side and kind of leans a little bit on her take-off.

    She has corrected this is practice, but -- according to Dick -- in the stress of competition sometimes old habits come back to plague you.

    MM
    HA! that's what i do on my tiny single jumps...particularly on my flip...my coach jokingly suggested a neck brace would stop that...bad habbits die hard...maybe we could suggest a neck brace to Alissa?!

    Ant

  9. #54
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    Tonya

    I think she is more like Tonya (without the triple axel}!! we call her ta'daaaa! she celebrates the entire program.
    Last edited by sk8addict; 03-29-2006 at 12:18 PM.

  10. #55
    Hopeless fan Doggygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nubka
    While watching Emily skate her LP today, I found myself holding my breath to see if she would be able to get through her program without a fall. I really like her energetic way of skating, but lately she seems to have problems skating clean.

    I'm to the point with Emily (as with Sasha, too,) where I find I'm almost waiting for the fall to happen...

    Even though many feel that Emily's skating is "rough around the edges," I like her energy and joy of skating. I hope next season, she will be able to get through her LP's and stay on her feet !

    I also really like Sasha's skating, but it's getting to the point where I almost can't watch her compete...too nerve wracking! I hope Emily doesn't go down that same road.
    My response to the original question. Maybe in this "right now" (this season) moment, Emily might seem to have an issue staying on her feet 100% through multiple LP's. But for me, that's where any comparison's end. They are at two highly different places in their careers, and I suspect the "stay on the feet thing" is for very different reasons too.

    I love the young, up and coming skaters for a very specific reason. They haven't been spoiled by the media. They haven't had high expectations placed on them - at least not compared to the expectations placed on the "favorites." They all bring a certain brand of honesty to the ice. (because they still can - not because the veteran favorites are "lying" or anything)

    IMO, Emily's brand of honesty that I have really enjoyed this season is her big smile, and her big ATTACK. She has a way of leaving me with the impression that if she never put on a pair of skates again...she might say to her college pals...."WOW!! It was really COOL to be an OLYMPIAN!!" or "WOW!! Getting a medal at Nationals was TOTALLY neat!!".....stuff along those lines. For me anyway, she represents the freshness and freedom of youth. It's in the face and the smiles. (like several other young skaters!!)

    DG

  11. #56
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    I honestly think Emily is as good as she will get. I think that her bodytype is not suited for figure skating at all and it's miraculous that she has gotten as far as she has and can do the jumps that she can do. I love Emily's skating skills and style, but I don't see her jumps improving. Emily already has good jump technique: her issue has been getting all the way around on the triple loop. Looking at footage of Emily in regular clothes, she is a small girl already. She has a large frame and isn't going to be able to get thinner without sacrificing a lot of muscle mass.

    I'm glad Emily was able to compete in an Olympics before heading off to college.

  12. #57
    Custom Title Ogre Mage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz

    Since this Emily post brought up Alissa, I would like to comment that I think with all her faults she is the best American Lady Figure Skater. No one comes near her when it comes to the basics. That stroking alone brightens my day, and when she does a rocker down the center of the ice, you see the body language, the rythym, the timing, the music. IMO, not many skaters have these qualities.

    I know it's not easy to overlook the poor jumping technique and that is the one flaw most posters center on. Well, those posters are right but I see her correcting this probldem in the future and winning the 2010 Olys.
    Joe, I'm glad that I am not alone in liking Alissa. Similar to Sasha, Oksana Baiul and Jill Trenary, I sense Alissa is a natural dancer on the ice with an instinctive feel for the music. But she must improve her nerves/jumping if she is to go anywhere. The way her 2axel whips around looks strange. It doesn't get good lift-off and reminds me of Tara's 2axel. I really hope she improves her jumping technique, not only for her sake but because a technically consistent Alissa would really push Kimmie to improve her presentation.

    Anyway, this is an Emily thread, not Alissa. Carry on!

  13. #58
    Custom Title Lonewolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ogre Mage
    Joe, I'm glad that I am not alone in liking Alissa. Similar to Sasha, Oksana Baiul and Jill Trenary, I sense Alissa is a natural dancer on the ice with an instinctive feel for the music. But she must improve her nerves/jumping if she is to go anywhere.

    I too think Alissa has potential to become a talented skater that is if she can master her jumps and nerves. I totally agree that her artistic ability is her greatest strength – she is “a natural dancer on the ice”. However, right now, I think she is the one who is most like Sasha, but only time will give us the answer.

  14. #59
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Emily may have peaked artistically. I don't see anything that would vary her present style. I liked her approach to the Sleeping Beauty pieces she used at 2004 Nats, and thought that she would develop more in artistic strength. However, I have not seen that. I do imagine her hitting 3x3s and adding quite a bit to her Tech scores. I'm in no rush for Emily and I will give her another season to develop more artistically.

    Joe

  15. #60
    Custom Title antmanb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz
    Emily may have peaked artistically. I don't see anything that would vary her present style. I liked her approach to the Sleeping Beauty pieces she used at 2004 Nats, and thought that she would develop more in artistic strength. However, I have not seen that. I do imagine her hitting 3x3s and adding quite a bit to her Tech scores. I'm in no rush for Emily and I will give her another season to develop more artistically.

    Joe
    What makes you think Emily has peaked artisitcally...surely artistry is far less likely to reach a peak than technical stuff. Most skaters have everything they're going to have jump wise by the time they're 20-22, its very rare for skaters to add harder jumps or combinations to their repetoire after this [let the posts listing skater and their jump achievements post this age commence...i'm sure there's a US male skater who added a quad later than this but still...]. But artistically people carry on growing and are much more capable of growing (some might even say are only capable of growing) artisically once they are older. If Emily at what 17 has peaked artistically then does that mean Kimmie only has one more year in which to grow artistically?

    Ant

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