In Johnny's own words

MKFSfan · May 4, 2006

Not to drag up the whole "snow globe" VS "skating from the heart" thread but here, in Johnny's own words, is sort of an explaination:

A: They are both real sides of my personality. When I am competing, I am focused, not cold. I want to achieve everything I've trained for, which takes a little mental focus. It is something I need to work on, to make my skating more interesting and take it to a new level, but I will never be as "sunny" as say Evan Lysacek because that is his skating persona, and something he's comfortable with. I envy people like him in a way for being able to wear their hearts on their sleeves when they perform, and I'll learn how to, things just take time. Off the ice, I'm goofy and crazy and don't have to worry about certain elements, I can just have fun and that is the main difference. I don't have to focus to live, only to skate and that's why you see a difference.

Taken from his journal:

http://www.figureskatersonline.com/johnnyweir/interact.html

Spun Silver · May 4, 2006

Well, he said NOT cold. I find him inward but so intense. I've been watching his 2005 Otonals. The first time: breathtaking. The second time: stunning. The third time: I wept. And I feel the same way about Sasha.

People find different things moving.

But I adore Yagudin as well. The Prince!

MKFSfan · May 4, 2006

Spun Silver said:
Well, he said NOT cold. I find him inward but so intense. I've been watching his 2005 Otonals. The first time: breathtaking. The second time: stunning. The third time: I wept. And I feel the same way about Sasha.

People find different things moving.

But I adore Yagudin as well. The Prince!

Exactly. I agree! I never criticized Johnny's (or Sasha's) skating style. I never found him "cold". I find he has a more inward/private/reserved skating style. I just couldn't put it into words how I feel Johnny and, for example, Alexei differ when it comes to performing. But like you said-differnt things/styles move different people! I am a fan of Johnny's. I prefer Yags's style.

Spun Silver · May 4, 2006

Oh, OK - I thought I remembered you calling Johnny & Sasha cold. Maybe the snow globe metaphor confused me.

Between Johnny & Yagudin I don't even know if I could choose. When you get to that level, choosing which is "better" would be like cutting your own arm off. That's how it feels to me anyway. They are both so unique and magnificent. Also Johnny still has a lot of competing ahead of him and we don't know what will happen so there is a little extra emotion about his open future - excitement, a little worry as he seems a little vulnerable...

I wonder if anyone ever worried about Yags! I wasn't watching skating closely when he won OGM but my impression at the time was that he was the king of the world.

Ptichka · May 4, 2006

Spun Silver said:
I wonder if anyone ever worried about Yags! I wasn't watching skating closely when he won OGM but my impression at the time was that he was the king of the world.

Actually, not at all.

The previous season, he lost GPF, Europeans, and Worlds to Plushy. The opening competition of the Olympic season was the Goodwill Games - and it was a disaster as he came 3d (behind not only Plushy but Weiss as well)! It was after that that TT hired the shrink Zagainov to work his magic on Yags; they also made sure he didn't meet Plush in competition until the big one.

At the same time, Plushy was undefeated since the disastarous 4th place at 2000 Worlds. Since then, whenever the two giants met, Plushy would come out on top. So, if anything, Yagudin was more of an underdog than anything else.

Spun Silver · May 5, 2006

Gosh, thank you for that history. Who'da thunk it! I just remember how he struck me when he won - I didn't pick up on (or at least understand) his emotion - just saw something glorious and astounding.

So were they bitter rivals because Yagudin thought the judges were undermarking him? or just plain rivalry?

Kelly22 · May 5, 2006

Spun Silver said:
Gosh, thank you for that history. Who'da thunk it! I just remember how he struck me when he won - I didn't pick up on (or at least understand) his emotion - just saw something glorious and astounding.

So were they bitter rivals because Yagudin thought the judges were undermarking him? or just plain rivalry?

Few share the same opinion.. Alexei was destined to win the gold - watch the films, study the programs, read the interviews. The "shrink" comment is insulting and sour grapes.

Joesitz (RIP) · May 5, 2006

Back to Johnny

I've always found Johnny's style of skating to be wistful. He seems to be flowing through perfection (not that it always happens). At the end of a good performance it seems to me that he gets out of character; looks up at the audience and is saying: how was that?

I like diversity in skating and he gives me something in men's skating that is not just another rendition of a toreador or a warrior.

I wish his off the ice comments would cool down. I do not find them 'honest'. I find them reaching out to be noticed.

Joe

curious · May 5, 2006

Kelly22 said:
Few share the same opinion.. Alexei was destined to win the gold - watch the films, study the programs, read the interviews. The "shrink" comment is insulting and sour grapes.

Yes,he was destine to win in salt lake just like Plush was destined to win in torino. The psychologist helped Yags to deal with his insecurities about Plush :biggrin:

Tonichelle · May 5, 2006

Joesitz said:
I wish his off the ice comments would cool down. I do not find them 'honest'. I find them reaching out to be noticed.

Joe

I agree, if he truly believed what he said I don't think he'd be so stinking upset when he gets bad press or someone says something about him that he thinks is "unfair"

It undermines the beauty of his skating because people will read or hear him say something out there, and that in turn turns them off to his skating... it's a hard hurdle to get over...

Love his Otonal... his programs this year didn't work, IMHO for him.... well maybe his SP did. Camille

I am left cold in his programs because he doesn't seem to want to draw me in. I like the more in your face programs just because I feel more a part of the program...

but there's no doubt that Johnny is a wonderfully beautiful skater.

attyfan · May 5, 2006

Joesitz said:
...

I wish his off the ice comments would cool down. I do not find them 'honest'. I find them reaching out to be noticed.

Joe

ITA!!!

Dee4707 · May 5, 2006

Kelly22 said:
The "shrink" comment is insulting and sour grapes.

Actually the shrink comment was not insulting at all. Alexei himself said that after the 2000-2001 year he feared Plushenko. Zagainov helped Alexei to understand that his thinking was what was defeating him, not Plushenko. I honestly think that even if Evengi didn't have the fall, Alexei would have beaten him.

Dee

Spun Silver · May 5, 2006

Joesitz said:
He seems to be flowing through perfection (not that it always happens).
...

I wish his off the ice comments would cool down. I do not find them 'honest'. I find them reaching out to be noticed.

I like that - "flowing through perfection" and it does capture something of Johnny's aura.

But I like the off ice comments very much. I can't know for sure what makes him talk so openly, but (a) it's a refreshing change from the innocuous (or vacuous) comments of most skaters, and does seem honest to me, and (b) to me it goes with his inwardness on the ice - he speaks *for himself* like anybody else and seems to forget the whole world is listening; IOW he insists on his right to be a normal person as well as a skater. It's a healthy instinct IMO but I doubt it will serve him in the long run - it will always generate negativity (as well as support), he will inevitably feel persecuted, and that won't help his skating or his happiness.

Likely he will learn to hold it in like the others... unless he is successful and thick-skinned enough to do whatever he wants. (I would wish for the latter scenario.)

hockeyfan228 · May 5, 2006

The other that helped Yagudin over the 2001-2002 is that he started to eat again. In response to having lost repeatedly to Plushenko the season before, against all advice, including Tarasova's, he decided he needed to lose weight over the summer of 2001, and he lost strength.

Going into the 2002 Olympic cycle, after a 5th place showing in Nagano skating while very ill, Yagudin was the frontrunner.

Ptichka · May 5, 2006

Dee4707 said:
Actually the shrink comment was not insulting at all. Alexei himself said that after the 2000-2001 year he feared Plushenko. Zagainov helped Alexei to understand that his thinking was what was defeating him, not Plushenko. I honestly think that even if Evengi didn't have the fall, Alexei would have beaten him.

Thank you Dee! The last thing I wanted to do was insult Alexei in any way shape or forn. Zagainov helped Yagudin concentrate, he helped bring out the best in him, which was necesasry to beat Plushenko. BTW, Zagainov's clients include not only athletes but also chess players (Karpov worked with him a lot). Tarasova says that under the Soviet system the elite athletes had access to good psychologists, and she wishes it were so today as well.

Joesitz (RIP) · May 5, 2006

Spun Silver - We definitely agree on his figure skating but I am not really into off ice comments by anyone. It's not unusual for baseball players to explain why they lost the game, but they never put down their opponents individually.

I guess the 'openess' is just not that interesting to me as the skating is. It could affect his scores if it does bother some judges. Let's hope it doesn't.

Joe

Alsace · May 5, 2006

But baseball is a team sport. I don't follow your analogy.

Eeyora · May 6, 2006

Interesting! It is good he understands his weakness but when I saw his "My Way" number at COI it totally drew me in.

Spun Silver · May 6, 2006

Joesitz said:
they never put down their opponents individually.

Good point. His saying again (in case we didn't hear it the first time?) that Sasha didn't deserve the silver took me aback. But he also says she should have beat Slutskaya in another competition, so obviously he's not anti-SC.

Such "putdowns" don't seem to have any malice or personal animus or inherent negativity, so they don't bother me. He just gives his views as if the world weren't going to jump on them. There is an innocence about him, to me.

debdelilah · May 6, 2006

Spun Silver said:
Good point. His saying again (in case we didn't hear it the first time?) that Sasha didn't deserve the silver took me aback. But he also says she should have beat Slutskaya in another competition, so obviously he's not anti-SC.
Such "putdowns" don't seem to have any malice or personal animus or inherent negativity, so they don't bother me. He just gives his views as if the world weren't going to jump on them. There is an innocence about him, to me.

Mostly I agree with you. I like reading his journal entries, and I do think he really says things as he sees them. In this entry he comes across as biased against Emmanuel Sandhu, and I understand how this could be offputting, especially to people who may not have read other things he has said. In the past--and in other very recent Q&As--he has said very nice things about Emmanuel. He called him the very best and most naturally talented, and someone whose skating style he admires, and who is also a good guy off the ice. And despite making the claim that Brian should have won the World Championships this year, Johnny was very happy that Stephane won them last year, and made a point of saying so in his 2005 Q&A. He makes "wuzrobbed" claims on behalf of various people at various times, and usually he only makes them because people ask him directly what he thought of such-and-such a result.

As for finding Emmanuel intimidating on the warmup ice, I don't know. That was just a very bad warmup for everyone, and emotions were high. And Johnny isn't always the best at being aware of what's around him when he skates--he fell onto the blue carpet at the post-Olympic gala in Spain, and I think he skated into the boards at Skate Canada.

In Johnny's own words

MKFSfan

Spun Silver

MKFSfan

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Ptichka

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Ice Is Slippery - Alexie Yagudin

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