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Thread: No more QR at Worlds, Euros

  1. #31
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antmanb
    I would have thought logically the co-conspirator would have to have been the russian judge in the Olympic Free Dance since in order to swap votes a deal done between the Russians and French the Russians would have had to uphold there side of the bargain and the only one able to do that would have been the judge on the day ... its the other countries/judges/federations who were in on it as well that we can make assumptions about, but i guess we will never *know*.
    The Russian judge voted for Lobecheva and Averbukh over Anassina and Peiserat.

    ("With these evil folk we never know when they are in league and when they are cheating one another." -- Aragorn, son of Arathorn, speaking of the Orcs. )

  2. #32
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    The ISU outsmarted us on that one, Joe. Didier was never formally charged with colluding or conspiring. He was only charged with exercising undue influence over a judge.
    Then there is no point in discussing this anymore than we have for the past 4 plus years.

    The French Federation decided to place the Russian Pairs team ahead of the Canadian Pairs team in exchange for the French Dance team being placed ahead of the Russian Dance team. I think that would have required another Federation to ensure that a judge would give the French Dance team a first placement to complete this deal. At that point, the ISU investigation into finding out the counterpart to this scam stopped with a decision to award 2 gold medals.

    I don't know how anyone can not say there was no collusion here unless they were trained to believe in 'and they lived happily ever after' stories. The Powers that be are always correct. hmm. So this whole fiasco was the fault of the French Federation and Mme Le Gougne in particular. Nothing else was involved.
    Yeah, that's what happened.

    Joe

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Okami
    I like the change intoduced by ISU better. At first I felt kind of sad, as one of my favourite performances of the last season happens to be a QR performance. Looking at the bright side however, if there had been no QR, perhaps the skaters would have been able to preserve strenght (both physical and mental ) and perform at their best in the LP.
    One of my favorite Cohn performances was the QR in Dortmund. Clean as a whistle and with the proper bravura of a swan queen. Someone should get that on video.

    I don't think strength has much to do with the LP as having the Will to Win.

    Joe

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    The Russian judge voted for Lobecheva and Averbukh over Anassina and Peiserat.
    With the full blast of the LeGougne case going on before the Dance competition, it is easily understood that any prior deal was off.

    Joe

  5. #35
    Custom Title antmanb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    The Russian judge voted for Lobecheva and Averbukh over Anassina and Peiserat.

    ("With these evil folk we never know when they are in league and when they are cheating one another." -- Aragorn, son of Arathorn, speaking of the Orcs. )
    But by the time of the FD the media was so switched on the fact a deal had been struck that the russians would have hanged themselves if that had voted for the french...

    Ant

  6. #36
    ~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~ Ladskater's Avatar
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    I always thought the QR was rather redundant. I also feel it puts extra stress on the skaters. Instead they need to bring back figures or find something else to replace the QR. This is great news! Thanks.

  7. #37
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    No more QR at the Worlds

    Great news it is about time.

    diamond

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ladskater
    I always thought the QR was rather redundant. I also feel it puts extra stress on the skaters. Instead they need to bring back figures or find something else to replace the QR. This is great news! Thanks.
    Are you prepared to watch 45 Short Programs which count in points for the gold medal? If Buttle skates first in the SP and Weir skates forty-fifth in the SP, which skater will be remembered more? What happens if Buttle is placed in the third group to skate the LP?

    Although I did not like the use of two separate judging panels because points are very subjective, the QR offered some sort of seeding for the SP which in turn offered seeding for the LP.

    Without the QR, I think some sort of seeding will be needed for the SP.

    Joe

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ladskater
    I always thought the QR was rather redundant. I also feel it puts extra stress on the skaters. Instead they need to bring back figures or find something else to replace the QR.
    If they found something else to replace it, would it be something that would then be required for all senior-level competitions, whether there were 4 skaters entered or 40? Or would it be something that only gets used at Worlds?

    Either way, it would reduce the burden on the skaters during the actual week of Worlds but increase the burden on training during the rest of the year.

  10. #40
    Custom Title dwiggin3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hockeyfan228
    Bummer. I loved quali rounds at Euros and Worlds. I was hoping that the change would be either auto-byes for top skaters or full qualis, with the scores wiped out after the field was narrowed.
    Oh, hadn't thougth about this option...hmm... Having seen worlds when it was in DC, I had a chance to watch most of the QR's and I must say, it was rather a let down when it came to the top, say 15 ladies - the ladies you all expected to make it. The only only time the QR's seemed like it was being skated as a "real compitition" was for hte skaters who were in jeopardy of not making the cut.

    I guess I felt a bit jipped since it was clear so many of the top skaters treated it like a runthrough. I would have preferred to have watched them practice.

    On the flip side, I would NOT want to be a judge and have to watch 43 short programs.
    d

  11. #41
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    If there were no QRs at this past Worlds, the results would have been:

    1 Brian JOUBERT (2)
    2 Stephane LAMBIEL (1)
    3 Emanuel SANDHU (5)
    4 Evan LYSACEK (3)
    5 Nobunari ODA (4)
    6 Jeffrey BUTTLE (6)
    7 Johnny WEIR (7)
    8 Alban PREAUBERT (8)
    9 Chengjiang LI (9)
    10 Matthew SAVOIE (11)

    1 Kimmie MEISSNER (1)
    2 Sasha COHEN (3)
    3 Fumie SUGURI (2)
    4 Elena SOKOLOVA (4)
    5 Sarah MEIER (6)
    6 Yukari NAKANO (5)
    7 Joannie ROCHETTE (7)
    8 Emily HUGHES (8)
    9 Susanna PÖYKIÖ (9)
    10 Kiira KORPI (10)

  12. #42
    Down With It
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    of course, that's assuming a lot there. Interesting list, though.

  13. #43
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    Yes, it is assuming that Sandhu would have skated well in both SP and FS. He bombed the QR, so he skated well later. Eman's usual pattern is to bomb the SP and try to make up for it in the FS.

    What is interesting is that Sasha, who skated virtually identical QR and FS, finishes up higher than she would with the QR removed. Meanwhile, Suguri, who skated well in all 3 segments, and Sokolova who skated well in the SP and FS, wind up behind Sasha. It just goes to show how horribly overmarked Sasha's FS was.

  14. #44
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm
    If there were no QRs at this past Worlds, the results would have been
    Chuckum - Not alltogether sure what thos nos. in parenthesis represent. I don't remember Kimmie being 1st after the SP, if that is what the nos in parens represent.

    It probaly worked for Joubert who got the edge on Lambiel's 3A. Points, points, points and they are close all round the board.

    Joe

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    The Russian judge voted for Lobecheva and Averbukh over Anassina and Peiserat.

    ("With these evil folk we never know when they are in league and when they are cheating one another." -- Aragorn, son of Arathorn, speaking of the Orcs. )
    The judge from Russia, Sheshtakova, voted 1-2 for Anissina/Peizerat and Lobacheva/Averbukh in both CD's and the OD. The judges were nearly unanimous on A/P for those phases. Since the LeGougne story broke before the FD, it would have been suicide for the Russian judge to have voted for A/P, because this would have confirmed collusion, unless nearly the entire panel voted the same way.

    Also, it was the judge from France who spilled her guts. Usually when one side blows a deal, the other side feels neither obliged nor condusive to fulfilling its end of the bargain.

    LeGougne victimized B/S. If I were Sheshtakova, and it were remotely close in the FD -- which I think it was -- I would have flipped the bird to A/P in response.

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