ISU rule changes

antmanb · Jul 21, 2006

gkelly said:
It means that the steps can go back the way they came (along the same line or in a loop or zigzag). E.g., if you're doing a step sequence starting at the west end of the rink and heading east, it's now allowed for some of the steps to head west.

Oh ok that makes for fun directional cahnges in the step sequences which would allow the skater to satisfy the slowing down/quickening to enhance the difficult of the step sequence.

Thanks for the clarification.

Ant

Mafke · Jul 21, 2006

DORISPULASKI said:
Mathman, One thing I have noticed in all these pair rule changes is that they make me strongly desire to have a really fine tinfoil hat.

It is amazing how the changes parallel the strengths of the Russian champion pair at the time the rules are promulgated. It was first said (allbeit with great snark) that the original COP version was set up to insure that B&S would have clearly won in 2002.....

But wait! They retire. And the current Russian pairs of Murkhortova & Trankov, Petrova & Tikhonov and Obertas & Slavnov have very different strengths than either T&M or B&S- they have super twists, for one thing, and a throw triple flip. And now we have rules where twists have more points and more importance, and triple flips get more points.

Hey, don't bogart that tin foil, same some for me. ITA about the points you made except that I really don't think I'm the only one here who thinks that COP being so tough on underrotation might have a little to do with the ladies champion at SLC.

I really don't know if the new rules will help O&S unless they manage to tweak things so that falling gets you extra points (and I wouldn't put that past Piseev)

Mafke · Jul 21, 2006

Mafke said:
(and I wouldn't put that past Piseev)

To be completely clear, I don't really blame Piseev is that is what he's doing. He's supposed to look out for the interests of his federation's skaters and he does with a vengeance, it's not his fault if other federations aren't so ... assertive.

dorispulaski · Jul 21, 2006

Mafke, Exactly! I don't blame Piseev either. I just wish some of the other federations would buy a freakin' clue and protect their skaters' interests as effectively. If they did, we would actually end up with a system that was close to fair to all the skaters.

hockeyfan228 · Jul 21, 2006

DORISPULASKI said:
However, if I were the PetTikhs I would be miffed. No one ever changed the rules to make it easier for them!

How true! What Lakernik/Piseev give with one hand -- making repeated jumps illegal for pairs (Pet/Tik had 3T's, and 3S's) -- they take away with the other (Pet/Tik have superb death spirals).

Pet/Tik's in Tokyo -- I hope they show everyone.

Ptichka · Jul 21, 2006

Russian federation never cared about Petrova & Tikhonov. Piseev has made several public disparaging remarks about them over the years. Now, of course, them staying eligible is Russia's best bet to staying on the podium.

Mathman · Jul 21, 2006

These rule changes are put forward by the ISU Technical Committees, right? The Russian Federation seems to have the upper hand in both the Figure Skating technical committee (chaired by Lakernik) and the Ice Dance technical committee (chaired by Alexander Gorshkov).

Joesitz (RIP) · Jul 21, 2006

Pet/Tik did one heluva LP in Calgary and I am not one of their fans. Pet can land a throw jump second to none of them, and she's giving more in performance. A repeat of Calgary in Tokyo will definitely get them on the podium but gold? The Chinese with three teams are vying heavily for it. It'll all come down to a clean skate and Wow lifts and throws. What else is there in Pairs without B&S and S&P?

Joe

chuckm · Jul 21, 2006

Isn't it interesting that the rule giving so many extra points for Biellmanns came along when Irina was firmly back in the picture. The rule changes for Singles skating upgraded the point values for many of the skills Irina had always had, just in time for 2005 Worlds and the 2006 Olympics.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jul 21, 2006

chuckm said:
Isn't it interesting that the rule giving so many extra points for Biellmanns came along when Irina was firmly back in the picture. The rule changes for Singles skating upgraded the point values for many of the skills Irina had always had, just in time for 2005 Worlds and the 2006 Olympics.

yeah..... his best bet for a gold is O&S. Watch the level changes coming in to suit their best tricks or warn them of a special upgrade of a trick. all this before the Worlds.

Joe

dorispulaski · Jul 21, 2006

Joe, it's happened already. Read my original post on the pairs rule changes for this season. I am quite annoyed on behalf of the PetTikhs. After all, they are the ones who skated best at Worlds, by a country mile. Piseev should be politicking for them!.

gkelly · Jul 21, 2006

chuckm said:
Isn't it interesting that the rule giving so many extra points for Biellmanns came along when Irina was firmly back in the picture. The rule changes for Singles skating upgraded the point values for many of the skills Irina had always had, just in time for 2005 Worlds and the 2006 Olympics.

What changes took place just in time for 2005 Worlds or 2006 Olympics to favor Slutskaya? As far as I'm aware, nothing changed between the 2003-04 COP rules (which were in effect during a season when she was virtually absent) and 2004-05. She used the existing rules to her advantage, and some changes or clarifications were made afterward to make it harder for the same elements to score as high (or at all, in the case of her 2loop after the third 3loop in Moscow).

76olympics · Jul 21, 2006

Another vote for Doris Pulaski to write an in-depth look on the past, present and future of pairs skating! Sign me up for an autographed copy!

chuckm · Jul 21, 2006

gkelly said:
What changes took place just in time for 2005 Worlds or 2006 Olympics to favor Slutskaya? As far as I'm aware, nothing changed between the 2003-04 COP rules (which were in effect during a season when she was virtually absent) and 2004-05. She used the existing rules to her advantage, and some changes or clarifications were made afterward to make it harder for the same elements to score as high (or at all, in the case of her 2loop after the third 3loop in Moscow).

The rules surrounding the spiral sequence and spins were changed, going into detail as to what constituted a level 3 and level 4. Before that, level 3 was as high as you could go. The Biellmann of course, was given a level 4.

dorispulaski · Jul 21, 2006

Thank you, 76olympicsfan! :blush:

SeaniBu · Jul 21, 2006

76olympics said:
Another vote for Doris Pulaski to write an in-depth look on the past, present and future of pairs skating! Sign me up for an autographed copy!

I might like that as a read too. Start typing!

hockeyfan228 · Jul 21, 2006

chuckm said:
The rules surrounding the spiral sequence and spins were changed, going into detail as to what constituted a level 3 and level 4. Before that, level 3 was as high as you could go. The Biellmann of course, was given a level 4.

If I remember correctly -- I recycled the original GOE chart -- the value for the original level 3 was transferred to the new level 4, and new level 3 was added between the old level 2 and old level 3 scores. The rationale was that it was too difficult to get from level 2 to level 3, and the level 3's weren't being called.

Since they were called more for the skaters with reputation, this change actually helped the skaters without, because they could get new level 3, when the year before, they could never get beyond old level 2.

In addition, two rules were created for the 2006 season that would have resulted in downgrades for Slutskaya in 2005: as gkelly wrote above, in 2005-6, where there is a Zayak rule violation in combination, the entire combination receives 0 points, while in Moscow, Slutskaya's Zayak rule violation in the 3Lo/2Lo combination earned her points for the 2Lo; the second was that the Bielmann would not count in the upright spin unless a minimum number of revolutions had been performed in other positions.

jenaj · Jul 24, 2006

Do these revised rules for singles skaters mean that each position in a spiral sequence no longer has to be held for at least 3 seconds?

hockeyfan228 · Jul 25, 2006

jenaj said:
Do these revised rules for singles skaters mean that each position in a spiral sequence no longer has to be held for at least 3 seconds?

No. The changes are:

1. Change of edge and change of position/direction don't count as separate elements towards leveling unless the positions before and after the change are each held for 3 seconds.

2. At least one position must be unassisted.

dorispulaski · Jul 26, 2006

I started a new thread with small video clips of twists to start a discussion of the new pairs' twist rules, for those who might be interested.

ISU rule changes

antmanb

Mafke

Mafke

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

hockeyfan228

Ptichka

Forum translator

Mathman

Joesitz (RIP)

chuckm

Joesitz (RIP)

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

gkelly

76olympics

chuckm

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

SeaniBu

hockeyfan228

jenaj

hockeyfan228

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Similar threads

Connect with us