American Idol 5/6

American Idol 5/6

Bee Gees Night. Each of the final 4 had to sing 2 BeeGees songs of their choice. Sorry if I don't have the precise names of the songs.

Josh: Sang Jive Talkin and To Love Somebody. He did a pretty good job at Jive Talkin and a nice job with the 2nd song. Of course, both were countrified. Best he's been so far which is still better than Carmen's best.

Clay: Sang To Love Somebody and Grease. Great job on the 1st song - typical theatrical faces which still bug me. Grease didn't do it for me - the hip shake was downright embarrassing. Give me Frankie Valli's version.

Kim: Sang To Be Your Everything and Emotion. Hardly sang the lyrics - mostly vocal gymnastics except the chorus. She's been much better.

Ruben: Sang Nights On Broadway and How Can You Mend A Broken Heart. Loved both performances. You could tell he was trying to look more serious and not smile throughout. I think it's tough for him because he enjoys singing so much.

Guest judge Robin Gibb: Again - guest judges are too nice. Lionel Richie is still the king of guest judges.

Although I'd be kinder than Simon, I agreed with him totally tonight with regards to his opinion of the performances. He's the most honest judge and the contestants are wise to consider his suggestions (i.e. need to hear something different, get rid of the facial contortions, etc.)

So, tonight, Ruben gets all my votes because I enjoyed both his performance.

My bottom 2 for tonight: Kim and Clay (for Grease). Kim should go based on only tonight.

My bottom 2 of 4 overall: Josh and Kim. Josh should go if based upon all shows.

Re: American Idol 5/6

What can I say other than the fact that I enjoyed tonight's show.

I thought that Josh did do better, but he did nothing for me at all. His voice irritates me sometimes, and in the first song tonight, I felt it to be a tad irritating. Kudos to picking better songs this week, but he's no where near the other 3 in terms of raw singing talent.

OMG! How cute is Clay?! His first song BLEW me away. It was so well done. The second best song I've heard come out of that boy. The second song wasn't as good, but I give him props for trying new things. Plus, that outfit helped a lot too!<img border=0 src="http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/happy.gif" /> I was thinking some naughty thoughts when he was on the second time. <img border=0 src="http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/embarassed.gif" /> I didn't think he was horrible like Simon said. If it had been a skating test, he would've gotten a Satisfactory/Good from me, or about a 4.1ish.

Kim sang well tonight, but she did nothing for me. She has a nice voice, but I don't think she was singing at the level she was in previous weeks. I did enjoy her second song though. I loved her outfits. That girl has class, and I hope she's not in the bottom 2 again, but I don't think she has the same fan base as the other 3 boys.

Ruben desperately needs to take a risk. I enjoy his singing, but I'm getting tired of hearing the same thing each week. I liked his second song better. I thought that the back up vocals in the first song drowned him out, it was good, but the back up was a little extreme.

Is it just me or is Ryan really short, or are the other 3 guys really tall? When watching today it looked like Clay had a good 5 inches on Ryan. It might just be the camera angles though.

I think the bottom 2 will be Josh, with it being tight between Kim and Ruben. Josh should get the axe.

Re: American Idol 5/6

Wow, I do love everything about American Idol, except Simon. I have a theory.....Simon purposely "knocks" different singers each week because he knows the audience will rally around these singers and call in the votes. (I haven't been able to get through yet!) Simon keeps the show interesting with his sometimes controversial comments!

Clay......He was awesome, both songs. There was nothing wrong with his version of "Grease" and I thought the hip "wiggles" were in perfect character for the the music. (Hasn't Simon ever seen the stage or movie versions?) He did two different types of songs with costume changes!)

Josh......By far his best night, even though he tends to shout the songs instead of singing. His second songs was his best and I have a feeling he'll still be here after tomorrow night.

Kim......Nice song choices, but she was a little off tonight, not always on key. She's a very gracious lady, but I have a feeling she'll be voted off tomorrow.

Rueben......He keeps getting better and better, and I have a feeling he'll find some agent who will hawk his talents even if he doesn't become the next "American Idol".

As much as I hate to agree, I think the bottom two will be Clay and Kim, but I think Kim will be the one who gets the "boot" tomorrow night....... 42

Re: American Idol 5/6

I really enjoyed tonight's show. Love the BeeGees's music; and, for the most part, I thought everyone really *stepped up to the plate*. So, here's how I would rate them:

1st Round

Josh - Jive Talkin' - I never would have picked this song for Josh to do. But, he managed to give it a country twist (doesn't he always?) and I didn't hear any pitch problems. I agreed with Simon that he seemed to be "yelling" thru parts of it; but, all in all, it was NOT BAD.

Clay -To Love Somebody - My favorite BeeGees song of all time and Clay just blew me away with his rendition of it. FABULOUS ... I don't even know what else to say. I think he's got this contest "in the bag."

Kimberly - I Just Want To Be Your Everything - It was OK .... I agreed with Simon (even though he got soundly booed). It didn't do it for me. But Kimberly seems to have the momentum going for her with the voters, so she'll probably be OK.

Ruben - Nights on Broadway - Once again, I NEVER would have picked this song for Ruben to sing. But, he did a much better job on it than I thought he was going to. Kudos to him for going uptempo and showing some variety. In my books, he a solid #2 in this competition.

2nd Round:

Josh - To Love Somebody - Well, after hearing Clay's rendition, this one was somewhat PALE. But ... he made it *country* again and that's Josh's forte; so, overall, it was pretty good. However......in the recap at the end ... we heard Josh's version immediately followed by Clay's ... NO COMPARISON, folks.

Clay - Grease - I liked it but he was definitely out of his "comfort zone" with this song. But kudos to him also for trying something different. I think he's going to need a wee bit of help in the choreo department for the videos; but, hey ... it was NOT "horrible" (as Simon said!).

Kimberly - Emotions - I don't know exactly what it was about Kimberly tonight; but, as Randy wuold say, she "just didn't do it for me " again. Once more, I agreed with Simon .... just OK. I STILL expect the voters to vote for her in droves.

Ruben - How Can You Mend A Broken Heart - FANTASTIC. He really delivered on this one. I thought Ruben was the best of the second round.

I think Josh should go tonight. But ..... he has a very strong fan base (obviously, since he stayed in the last couple of weeks when he was horrible). This week, he DID give 2 pretty solid performances that will allow his fans to defend their decision to vote for him yet again. So, we'll see what happens. Nevertheless, if Josh stays, I will be very disappointed because I think the other 3 are clearly better than him.

Re: American Idol 5/6

<span style="color:red;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Clay: Loved the first song--he was BRILLIANT. I was lukewarm about the second. Even Clay's lukewarm is better than most of the others at their best.</span>

<span style="color:blue;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Kimberly: I was just not blown away at all. The song choices were poor. She is a classy lady--absolutely nothing pretentious about her.</span>

<span style="color:maroon;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Josh: I did not like the first at all (he was off key). The second was pretty good actually--but singing a song that Clay has just sung was SUCH a big mistake.</span>

<span style="colorurple;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Ruben: Totally agree about him being drowned out by the background singers. What the hell was so brilliant about that mediocre performance? I can understand Randy being hesitant about offering any kind of constructive criticism because he's so caught up in his own Ruben lovefest that he can't be objective, but I cannot understand Simon AT ALL. Perhaps he wants to make sure Ruben doesn't end up again in the bottom two. He deserves to be in the final two. Anyhow, Ruben just sounded lost in this song. The second song was wonderful. My big complaint against him this week is that he is getting lost in the vocal gymnastics. He is trying to hard to impress with them.</span>

<span style="color:green;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Vocal gymnastics need to be displayed with discretion. Too much does not impress. It's like getting to eat chocolate at every meal. What's left to appreciate? This is definitely a trend in popular music nowadays--I personally find it over the top and just plain annoying in its overuse.</span>

<span style="color:teal;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Bottom 2: Josh & Kimberly

I'd like to say "adios" to Josh but he seems to have 9 lives. 0]

BTW, it's now 10:45 and I have been unable to get through even once to vote for Clay. The line is busy all the time. That's a good sign, right? Last week I voted for him five times and had no problem getting through.</span>

Re: American Idol 5/6

Josh: Josh keeps missing notes and his voice and persona just don't draw me in. It's not like he hits screeching clunkers; he's just always off on a couple of critical notes and I just can't forgive that at this stage of the game. Somebody said to note his eyes because s/he thought they were wonderful. I noted. Did nothing for me.

Clay: I was surprised the first or second week when I found myself thinking (or rather feeling) that Clay was sexy. I really felt it tonight with "To Love Somebody," which was also a superb song choice for him. I don't know what the bug up Simon's a** with "Grease." I was having fun listening and watching. I liked the self-deprecating style and irony--I mean, it's not like "Grease" is a serious song. And after doing so many heartfelt ballads, I thought it was smart of Clay to choose something light and to be playful with it. So Simon was wrong. He's usually right, but this time he was wrong. At least he gives usable feedback (usually). "Horrible" was not useful:lol:

Kim: I like her so much more than Josh, but she needed to be really good tonight and she wasn't. Not bad, but not good enough to overtake the Josh fan base. Last season the guests worked with the contestants. I remember them showing scenes of them working with people like Burt Bacharach and the guests making comments on how it was working with certain singers--like they all loved Tamyra. But they didn't judge. It seems they didn't do that this year and instead went to the guest judge thing, which I think is a shame and a mistake. To have a "master class" with someone different every week is really useful to these singers and I saw the results in the improvement of the better singers last year. Using these people as guest judges has been worthless, IMO. I think Kim is someone who could have really benefitted tremendously from working with different songwriter/musicians. The others too, but Kim for me is a classic case of not knowing what to do with her talent. I know they have arrangers to help them, but the guests last year really raised the bar for these people.

Ruben: I think being in the bottom two last week encouraged Ruben to stretch himself. The first song, "Nights on Broadway" didn't work for me--I agree that he got drowned out or didn't work with the back-up vocals right or something. But his second song "How Can You Mend a Broken Heart" was the first time I saw him put some effort into exploring his range. Unfortunately, the effort was noticeable, but I'd rather hear him trying than staying in his comfort zone.

I'd like to see Josh go, but like I said, he's got a mega fan base. I'd be surprised if Clay was in the bottom two, but who knows how huge this Josh thing is. As of this week I'd put them from worst to best:
Josh
Kim
Ruben
Clay

Another thing, I think Clay is going to get better looking and as he gets older and although I have no problem with a guy who is naturally big, I'm afraid that as Ruben gets older and less fit (once you're out of college...) that his weight is going to negatively affect his voice. Ruben could stay healthy and big; he'd have to eat right and exercise. But as an investment and thinking long term (although how long term is any pop star), it would be a concern for me.

Slightly off topic: Tonight on "Entertainment Tonight" one of the teasers throughout the show was "Kelly Clarkson reveals how much she weighs!" I kid you not. The piece finally came on near the end of the show and it was your basic "pressure to be thin in Hollywood" thing and Kelly said, "I don't want to get into that whole 'I have to be thin' thing. I'm 5'4" and weigh 125 pounds. I'm normal, I'm healthy, and I think I look fine. Besides, it's mostly in the back anyway (laughed)." I thought she looked rather out of shape when she was on AI about a month ago, but I think the intensity of press junkets, appearances, and touring are tough on a first timer. I think her weight is fine too. I'd just like to see her look like she's getting more exercise (whatever works for her) for a better look of well-being. But like Kate Winslet and Whoopi Goldberg, I'm glad to see another entertainer, especially a young female who is a role model for many her age, who refuses to become obsessed with her weight. JMO.
Rgirl

AI 5/9

I'm in.

Josh-I predicted he would sing "Jive Talking" and darn it, he did. And a little off-key! And what was with the running around in the audience? I'm sorry, I couldn't understand him when he did that. His country version of "To Love Somebody" was the best I have heard of him in weeks. But his facial expressions are just as bad as Clay's used to be. In other words, he always looks like he's grimacing when he sings.

Clay-One of my two favorites!!! And his rendition of "To Love Somebody" (one of my fave BeeGees songs) was absolutely amazing. What a voice! I, too, wonder what the heck was wrong with Simon? I liked Clay's version of "Grease" and his little hip shakes. Hmmmmmm....'nuff said....:rollin:

Kim-Ok, I thought she had very poor song choices. They were so poor I can't remember them...LOL!! She was very pitchy and it also sounded as if she was straining to bring those babies home. This was probably THE worst I have seen her sing. But she certainly is a class act.

Ruben-Well, I don't get what the rest of you are saying about the background drowning him out during "Nights on Broadway". The song is like that even with the BeeGees singing it. However there was one part where he was lower in his tonal range and I couldn't quite hear him. Otherwise, he really went out on a limb last night. "How Do You Mend A Broken Heart"? Listen to Ruben....:rollin: That was a fabulous song for him to sing although it's not the one I thought he would do.

Bottom two: Josh and Kim with either of them living.
What will probably happen: Kim and Clay because I agree, Josh has 9 lives.
What would really floor me: Kim and Ruben with Ruben leaving. Then I'd not watch the show EVER again.

rgirl181, once again I have to disagree with just one little thing you stated.:rollin: Are we going to get through this and eventually agree on everything about AI?:rollin:

As far as weight goes, there are too many outstanding singers out there who have been Ruben's size and it didn't slow them down one bit. Aretha Franklin was never svelte. Luther Vandross (prayers still going out for him) lost tons of weight with Oprah Winfrey which caused him to not be ABLE to sing for awhile and then put it back on. Barry White comes to mind. Bo Diddley. Pavarotti. Kate Smith. Ok, I'm showing my age here. Fats Domino. I mean, sometimes when you are used to singing with that weight on you, losing it can cause changes that affect your voice. Oh well, I don't really see that weight is the main issue here anyway.:rollin:

What I see as a real problem is people NOT voting for Clay because of what Simon said about his Grease performance. That will just suck!!!

Re: AI 5/9

<span style="color:maroon;font-family:helvetica;font-size:small;">Based on my inability to get through last night AT ALL to vote for Clay, I'd say just the opposite is likely. People were afraid that because of Simon, Clay might end up in the bottom two, so they voted in DROVES.</span>

Re: AI 5/9

Realistic......"What I see as a real problem is people NOT voting for Clay because of what Simon said about his Grease performance. That will just suck!!! "......I think the opposite will be true. Simon's comments will MAKE people want to vote for Clay. Look what Simon's negative comments did for Josh last week....he survived and is "Stayin Alive"... 42

AI 5/6

Hello.

Last night was very interesting to me - I thought everyone tried to raise their game with varying results, but not one of the performances really stuck out for me (although one of them came close). Maybe it's that all four of them are trying to 'bring it', but to me it seemed that the astonishing raw talent we had in Kelly and Tamyra last season just isn't there. Don't get me wrong, I think these singers are very talented, but I just wasn't floored by these performances, whereas the last few weeks of last season always contained at least one jaw-dropping performance.

<strong>Josh</strong>: Jive Talkin' - he seemed to be working <em>really really </em>hard to hit all the low and high notes. Hated the run through the crowd biz, seemd fake. But way better than last week. I'll talk about his 2nd song in a sec

<strong>Clay</strong>: To Love Somebody - I actually thought this was what Simon would call a "so what" performance, until he let loose at the end. At that point I thought he had it in the bag. But Simon's comment that this was the best performance from all 3 "Idol" shows he's done was way off base (to me). Grease - Simon is high. This was the <strong>perfect</strong> song for Clay's voice. His little dance action was sad, but I think he was trying to do something that he's not comfortable with (move on stage), and this song is campy enough that he could do it and look silly and it would be ok.

<strong>K.Lo</strong>: I Just Wanna... I liked the style she gave to this song, but my girl was pitchy throughout the song :| For Emotions, however, I thought she was brilliant. This was the one performance that made me sit up and take notice. She was both controlled and loose, made the song sound contemporary. I had forgotten that Destiny's Child had recorded this song, and as soon as Robin mentioned it, I realized that I hate their version, which made me love K.Lo's version even more.

<strong>Ruben</strong>: Nights on B'way - I agree, he sounded a little lost in the backing track, his voice sounded a little stressed to me, but otherwise a typical Ruben good performance. How Can You Mend... I thought this was one of Ruben's best performances. For the first time I could really sense the depth of his voice. What's up with paula always saying Ruben makes people feel warm inside? It's really starting to creep me out.

Now back to Josh: when I heard that Josh chose a song that Clay had already sung, I thought "oh no". Odd, because Josh also chose the same Motown song that someone else sang on the very first Top 12 ep - and wasn't it Clay who also sang that song? Anyway, I thought at the very least that they should have let Josh sing his version first, because he would get creamed by comparision. And then Josh did the unthinkable: he came out and sang the best he has sung all competition. Simon was right: it was a huge risk, and it worked. Actually, when they showed the highlight clips of the 2 versions right next to each other, I thought Josh's version was BETTER than Clay's.

Josh has become the Nikki of this season, and like last season, I would guess that he would be voted off now (Nikki got voted off after her best performances of the competition). But Josh's massive fan base tells me that won't happen.

I was worried about Clay falling through the cracks, like Ruben did last week, but hearing about the phone lines assures me he'll still be here. Ruben is in no danger this week, I'm sure.

Regretfully, I fear that it is my fabulous K.Lo who will be taking that walk tonight. She needed to be her absolute best this week and she wasn't. She's combating the Power of Clay, Ruben's re-energized fans, and the Marine Machine. I would rather see Josh go based on overall talent, but I don't think it's gonna happen. |I

guinevere

Re: AI 5/6

wow... I don't think I saw it the same as most

Josh and Clay were the best last night... and Clay just BARELY stayed ahead... Ruben almost impressed me more. The toushie shake was cute and I think he was just trying to shut Paula up once and for all :lol: Josh was amazing. So WHAT if he country-fied the stupid songs. He did a great job and did WAY better on the song that both he and Clay sang during the comp. He's my number one singer of the night.

my rankings for the night
1. Josh
2. Clay
3. Ruben
4. Kim

over all rankings
1. Clay
3. Josh
3. Ruben
4. Kim

Kim and Ruben really fell flat last night... and Clay didn't improve over last week(I don't think even HE could top that Solitaire performance)

Re: AI 5/6

I agree with most that Josh was much better than he has been. That said, he still isn't as good as the other 3.

Ruben and Clay were great, and Kim had an off night.

With the way things are going, I'm predicting Kim goes tonight. I hope that Josh goes.

Re: AI 5/6

<span style="color:navy;font-family:georgia;font-size:small;">Okay, no surprises here: Josh is OUT.

That bit with him singing while holding his little girl was beautiful.

I don't feel sorry for Josh. Within a year he will have a country album out.

I wonder where Frenchie Davis would be right now had she not been booted off for her porno activities... </span>

Re: AI 5/6

I agree, no surprises, but with Kim still in the running, I am now convinced that the final two will be one female and one male. It makes sense. I also agree that Josh will have some kind of recording or perhaps "acting" career ahead of him...42

AI 5/6

:lol: Realistic:lol: The day we completely agree with each other we'll have to start a special thread, "WARNING! Realistic and Rgirl Totally Agree!" It will probably be a sign that the end is near:lol: Anyway, I thought about singers like Aretha, Pavarotti, Luther Vandross, the late Biggie Smalls, BB King, etc. (btw, I'm 47, so I even remember Rosemary Clooney) when I wrote that about Ruben. My concern is that Ruben is this big at this age and that while he may be healthy and fine at this size, if he gains weight as he gets older, it increases the chances for sleep apnea. Although a little snoring is no problem, serious sleep apnea where you actually stop breathing for up to 600-700 times a night is. I just meant it as a concern from an investment point of view. But like I said, I don't know how long one considers a pop star investment to be. Plus you are correct that many singers get used to singing at a certain weight. Like I said, I don't have a problem with Ruben's weight; it's more a concern about the possibility of future weight gain. But what would a thread be if you and I didn't disagree on something ?

Twinnie,
Re your question about Frenchie: I don't know where she'd be on AI, but I just saw that she has started a six-month contract in the Broadway production of "Rent." She sang a little bit and from what I heard, my guess is she would be in the last three and a strong contender to win. I'm so glad she got a good gig and hopefully more to come. Although I still think there was a double standard with the way the producers kept Trenyce with her shoplifting conviction but not Frenchie, who broke no laws. I agree that Josh will have a country record out next year, but how well it will do without that patriotic fervor behind him, I have to wonder. Doing the "close your eyes" test with Josh, to me, his problems with pitch just really grate. Also, I don't find anything special enough about his voice to overcome his technical problems. Holding his daughter and singing was a very nice moment and a classy way to go out.

In general,
I forget who brought up the issue of nobody being as jaw-droppingly good as Kelly and Tamyra last season and except for a couple of Clay's performances, I have to agree. Kelly and Tamyra looked and sounded like seasoned pros during the last six weeks of the competition, with the exception of Tamyra's "Runnin' Hot, Runnin' Cold," which was just a flukey bad song choice and bad performance, IMO. Those girls could really work with their voices in a lot of different colors and I haven't seen anybody do that this season. Clay has come closest. Plus, a lot of people have said that this group overall was better than last year's and, boy, I don't know. They seem about even to me.

Clay is my favorite to win, then Ruben, then Kim. Of the three, I think Kim would have the hardest time making an impact if she won. Beautiful girl, great potential, but can't see enough people getting excited enough about her to by CDs just by her. I can see her as the lead in a three girl group doing spectacularly well. Somehow I just don't get enough energy from her alone on the stage to do it. JMO.
Rgirl

OH NO...IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!!!

rgirl, I totally agree with your last post......with the exception of last year's AI because I didn't watch anything except the last two shows.

No fainting allowed!!!

I forgot about sleep apnea (and my daughter just had a sleep study done this past Monday....duh me):rollin:

And, I agree that Clay will win. AND I agree that Kim would be spectacular in a trio of women or even a quartet with awesome harmony. AND I bet Ruben, whether he wins or not, will have a recording contract as well.

AND I'm glad Josh is now gone although I did get a little misty-eyed when he held is daughter. That was really a sweet moment for the Marine dude.

Re: OH NO...IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!!!

It's good to see that the voters finally got it right by eliminating Josh.

As for Frenchie, I've heard her perform on a few shows and she's not as good as Kim L or Trenyce. All Frenchie did was scream out the songs rather than sing them.

I would still really like to see Ruben win, although I've got a feeling that it's gonna be Clay in a cakewalk. It doesn't matter anyway--both are going to get recording contracts.

Re: OH NO...IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!!!

I would gladly pay NOT to have to see Clay shake his hips any more.:lol:

Re: OH NO...IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!!!!

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>It's good to see that the voters finally got it right by eliminating Josh.[/quote]
maybe instead of ragging on the voters maybe you should vote... otherwise don't complain...

I voted hard for Josh... but I guess it wasn't good enough I'm gonna miss him next week... this was Kim's second week in a row where she was off. If she has another off night she better get booted. I'm not happy with the way things went... Clay / Kim fans are starting to unite JUST to bump off Ruben, and I don't think it's right... vote for your favorites and if Ruben's the big competition then just don't vote for him don't bounce from Kim or Clay just to make sure

AI 5/7!

Wow, I don't know if it's because I was at a party and came home to watch the show after having a couple of glasses of wine, but I really enjoyed the results show (no, not just because of the result!!)

- BeeGees medley - I thought this was the best medley this season (although there were some in the beginning where I was impressed by this season's ability to blend voices). I actually enjoyed all of the songs, and thought everyone sang their bits pretty well.

- Only 30 minutes, no dragging back past contestants, no Kelly making this year's group look unpolished, no Justin sounding like any other R&B singer out there, no gawd-awful trailer for the Kelly/Justin disaster flick, no "Proud to be an American" - just the results - hooray!!

- I even laughed at the stupid embedded car commercial!! Seeing Clay all geeked out was a hoot!

But did anyone else think it was totally bizarre at the end, how they cut from commercial and Ryan just says "Josh, you're out; Kim, you're safe" with no preamble, no nothing? I had to rewind it because it was so abrupt.

I'm glad Kim is in the Top 3, but unless she really has a spectacular performance next week (or 2 - are they doing the favorite song/judges pick format again?), I think it'll come down to Clay and Ruben. I agree with above posters who said that Kim probably wouldn't have as big of a pop star pull as the boys, but I disagree that she should front a trio - I think she could have a very good career as a solo artist, just not the crazy phenomenal up-the-charts kind of career they're trying to build here.

ps last season Kelly was the only contestant to never be in the bottom 3/2. This season - Clay is the only one. Hmmmm....

guinevere