Re: Legends and making deals
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Speak for yourself Frozetoes. As an USA American I look at Kurt as the Best Ever male skater. That, of course, is my opinion. I also know of many other Americans who feel the same.[/quote]
joesitz, I was speaking for myself. That's why I used the pronoun "I" instead of "we".
Re: "Legend" - who really is one?
I suppose "Legend" is not really the correct usage here. The dictionary defines legend as:
legend /ldnd/ n. 1 a story from the distant past, (syn.) myth: Each country has its legends about the past. 2 an explanation of the symbols on a map: The legend on this map shows that a star is the symbol for a capital city.
Legendary would be more apt:
legendary /ldndri/ adj. 1 based on legend, (syn.) mythical: Legendary stories are passed down from parents to children. 2 famous, (syn.) renowned: Great Olympic athletes have become legendary.
In other words renowned or famous. To me some one of Toller Cranston's fame could be termed as "legendary." Someone, like Toller, who is rather "larger than life" and has brought something to the sport and leaves a lasting impression is legendary. Of course, we are going to list our favourite skaters - perhaps to us personally they are legendary. Does it matter in the big scheme of things? Does it hurt anyone? I don't think so. Figure Skating is a wonderful sport not only to watch, but to participate in as well. I spent many years involved with figure skating and loved every moment of it. I have admired many skaters over the years - some more famous than others and some who never made it past club competition level - still wonderful skaters who helped me develop my skating along the way. The greatest thing with figure skating is the journey and experiencing the joy of skating. Even the skating greats we have named here would acknowledge that.
Re: "Legend" - what are we talking about
It seems to me every generation has a legend.
That is a whole lotta legends. 8o
Note to thyself - must strive for simplicity.
So, how about:
Who is the Number#1 skater of all times in the 20th century? simple and fitting of the status "legend":D
I believe Whitney Houston's legendary status is in question. She has really fallen apart and I would rather not watch her try to fake her way through an interview. She seems hollow and cold (I guess its the whole strung-out thing). I would never have imagined this in the 80s and early 90s. She was making inspired music with her beautiful voice and she appeared to be so together and admirable. Even in 98 I thought we got a glimpse of this with her album from that year but BAM! I hope she can pull herself out of this terrible rut and once again make music that brings back her magic.
Re: Whitney Houston....
Sorry to go off-topic:
Whitney Houston is arguably the greatest female vocalist of our time. When she sings her hit singles, specially 'I will always love you' everyone waits for her to hit that high note and bam everyone is screaming and cheering. I think Whitney can out sing both Mariah and Celine and I would go as far as to say that her place in music history is secured.
Almost every single artist has gone through major difficulties in their life. Monica, the one female artist who is always compared to Whitney because of her voice has witnessed the suicide of her first love and she went through a lot to put that behind her and now she is enjoying the success of her album which went to the top of the American album charts and around the world.
What I'm trying to say is Whitney is going through difficulties right now and she will whether the storm. I personally can't wait to buy her next album.
To me "legendism" doesn't automatically include "halloism"; in fact a nice, clean, perfect life isn't necessary, not even desirable. Just the opposite: I claim that the majority of legends (in almost every area), were/are - although brilliant in their professions and/or charismatic, fascinating personalities - quite complex, complicated human beings and in many ways the "bad" and always controversal girls and guys. Or they led/lead turbulent and difficult lifes at least.
BTW, I wouldn't call neither Whitney Houston nor Mariah Carrey "legendary" (more Judy Garland and Barbra Streisand). But IMHO the real "real" one's (in music) are types like Janis Joplin, Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain, to name only a few ...
Re: Hey eltamina
Thanks for the links to those pictures!
Just wanted to say this. Michelle looks gorgeous in those pictures but it's really true in person. And in person, you get to see the beauty within not just on the outside.
(I'm also trying to make mathman severely jealous. Is it working:rollin: . I can try harder if I have to)
As far as music legends, I don't consider Mariah or Whitney or even my fave, Celine, as legends. Barbra, Judy Garland, Ella Fitzgerald, Elvis, Beatles, etc., they are legends. Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison, yep, them too. Kurt Cobain is pushing it for me. But then again, I can think on that one.
Re: "Clean" legends?
Germanice makes an interesting point that we seem to want our "legends" to be a little bit bad. Oedipus murdered his father and married his mother. Janis Joplin, Jim Morrison, Kurt Cobain and Whitney Huston were druggies who allowed their addictions to destroy their lives. Sonia Henie is variously described as a Nazi sympathizer and as an unscrupulos business person (she is accused of cheating her own brother out of his fortune, e.g.). As the hip-hoppers say, these folks were "real."
Re: Legends and making deals
Really sorry Frozetoes. I should be more careful in my reading. It's been a lifetime problem.
LAD - Trust me, this thread will never answer the question of who is or not a legend. But it's fun anyway.
For some Whitney Houston is a legend; others Judy Garland is. Some have 38 legends today and maybe more tomorrow. Others just have one.
Re: Legends and making deals
Does being a legend in your own mind count? Because I have to add me to my list then!:rollin: :lol:
Re: Legends and making deals
This is my first post and I deliberately joined this board because of this thread.
Threads that call current skaters a legend have always irritated me, (mostly they seem to exist to explain by MK is great even without an Olympic gold metal) the fact that they skate now excludes them from legend status. A legend is story based on events that took place before the present generation. It is the accomplishment of skater that skated outside the memories of present viewing public that can be considered legends. So only those skaters prior to 1975 (I might even go before 1950) should be considered as legends.
Hi, Cats. I'm glad that you decided to post. I'm just sorry that we had to "irritate" you to make you join in! Anyway, welcome to the forum.
I absolutely agree with your take on the word "legend." We should save that designation for people long dead whose real accomplishments have been superceded by stories and tales that have grown up around them. Was there a real Hercules? A real Gilgamesh? A real Robin Hood? A real Kamapuaa? That is, were there actual heros whose exploits formed the basis of all the fantastic stories that comprise these legends?
I really don't think that any mere figure skater, living or dead, is a "legend."
But 1000 years from now, after the fall of civilization, children will be sitting at their grandfather's knee, huddled around the campfire, begging, "Tell us again the story of how Michelle Kwan saved the world by skating such a beautiful program that the invading Xenonians from outer space laid down their laser canons and wept."
Now <em>that's</em> a legend.
Real or Memorex?
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>"Look at the gorgeous earrings, beautiful ears, and the perfect symmetrical oval shape face." -- Eltamina
www.colesnet.net/michelle...100023.JPG[/quote]To Michelle: Her Ears
Beautiful auricles, beautiful lobes,
They're perfectly matched to her beautiful face.
Beautiful earrings, diamonds and gold,
And perfect illusion clear down to the waist!
legend? or simply great?
I've been hesitant to jump into this discussion, because it's pretty lively, and sneaking onto the board during work (oops!) makes it hard to fully participate, but here goes:
I agree with lots o' folks who says that current skaters cannot be considered 'legends'. But I also think that of current/recent skaters, MK is clearly a legend in the making. Her career has been long and successful enough to secure a huge note in skating history, regardless of what comes next for her; but the 'personality' of her career, including the elusive Oly gold, is what will ensure her legendary status, IMO.
Oksana Baiul, Tara Lipinski, Sarah Hughes - these are all phenomenal skaters, but 100 years from now, their careers will be encapsulated in 2 good seasons for Tara & Oksana, and a fascinating 4-year stretch for Sarah. All are notable for their youth in winning, and especially Sarah for her incredible come-from-behind win, but I don't see any of them as legends.
Just my thoughts. Carry on!