We had a heated debate on 'flutz' under 'Jr. worlds' section. I am pulling out some of my thoughts to create this separate thread. I believe it's a very interesting topic. I am puzzled by the over-emphasis of die-hard figure skating fans on visually subtle things such as flutz, edge. I do believe the sharp different attitudes towards such things between die-hards and causual fans are really one reason that figure skating is dying.
There are some of my thoughts, welcome to join the discussion.
Red Dog, you're exactly right. I am one of those fans who can not tell lips, can not tell flutz, can not tell edge. I'm also one of those who're just tired of seeing performances with obvious mistakes such as stumbles, falls getiting placed above clean ones with flutz, without 'edge' etc, which, frankly, can not really be identified without microscope(literally).
The elitist attitude of some diehards is really killing figure skating market. There is another example. A couple of freaks on some other boards(won't name them since it's against the rule here) commented that shen&zhao's throws should receive a -2 GOE because they hate zhao kicking his free leg. I don't understand why certain diehards want to impose their own pet peeves to the more 'regular', shall we say, more 'normal' spectators? A flutz certainly won't kill the overall quality of a program, a fall certainly does.
I turned on TV this afternoon, and watched a bit gymnastics competition on NBC('Cup of America' or something). I was very very surprised about the size of the crowd. It was a big crowd, especially when you compare it to the empty arena of 4cc. Those folks don't necessary understand the subtle quality such as 'edge', 'flutz' or 'artistry' or whatever, they do, however, know how to enjoy an intense program with lots of difficult jumps, tumbles, all those things who can grab your attention, wow you. Caroline Zhang's performance has that quality, it can wow you. I certainly would be happy to tolerate her flutz.
If diehards continue to focus on flutz, the decline of figure skating is probably inevitable, and you guys will certainly pay more for a dwindling market with a couple of skaters who have no originality but can do so-called true lutz(in my untrained eyes, there is really no true lutz since almost everybody changes the edge during take-off).
The location is an important factor for the dismal audience size of 4cc. But my generally impression is that the crowd of gymnastics competition is much much larger than figure skating competition for a while. When u watched all the GP events such as Skate America across globe, you'll see more than half of the seats are empty(except maybe NHK Cup). From what I saw this afternoon on TV, the size of gymnastics competition is much larger. The arena is roughly filled.
I do believe one reason is that figure skating's scoring does not appeal to regular audiences. if you over emphasize on 'flutz', 'edge', and stuff like that, you really can't appeal to mass crowd. How can you actually tell from a distance whether a skater is flutzing or not anyway. Another good example is Suyra Bonaly. She is very athletic and definitely a crow pleaser. 'Regular' viewers just love her. But she's crucified by judges and diehards on skating boards for lack of edge, basic skating skills etc. The contrast is so sharp that 'regular' viewers just did not understand why she got low marks, and obviously they would no longer be interested in such a flawed sport.
I really believe the scoring system itself is very flawed with emphasis on subtle quality, instead of athletism, 'wow' factor. Maybe that's why figure skating only appeals to those picky women?, just kidding. I don't know.
A dying sport with picky flutz haters?
There are some of my thoughts, welcome to join the discussion.
But a large number of the viewing audience is casual fans, not die-hards. Casual fans can care less about the point stuff and jump stuff. Many are just tired of seeing performances with obvious mistakes getting placed above clean ones (in other words, controversial calls, colluding, judge anonymity, etc.)
Red Dog, you're exactly right. I am one of those fans who can not tell lips, can not tell flutz, can not tell edge. I'm also one of those who're just tired of seeing performances with obvious mistakes such as stumbles, falls getiting placed above clean ones with flutz, without 'edge' etc, which, frankly, can not really be identified without microscope(literally).
The elitist attitude of some diehards is really killing figure skating market. There is another example. A couple of freaks on some other boards(won't name them since it's against the rule here) commented that shen&zhao's throws should receive a -2 GOE because they hate zhao kicking his free leg. I don't understand why certain diehards want to impose their own pet peeves to the more 'regular', shall we say, more 'normal' spectators? A flutz certainly won't kill the overall quality of a program, a fall certainly does.
I turned on TV this afternoon, and watched a bit gymnastics competition on NBC('Cup of America' or something). I was very very surprised about the size of the crowd. It was a big crowd, especially when you compare it to the empty arena of 4cc. Those folks don't necessary understand the subtle quality such as 'edge', 'flutz' or 'artistry' or whatever, they do, however, know how to enjoy an intense program with lots of difficult jumps, tumbles, all those things who can grab your attention, wow you. Caroline Zhang's performance has that quality, it can wow you. I certainly would be happy to tolerate her flutz.
If diehards continue to focus on flutz, the decline of figure skating is probably inevitable, and you guys will certainly pay more for a dwindling market with a couple of skaters who have no originality but can do so-called true lutz(in my untrained eyes, there is really no true lutz since almost everybody changes the edge during take-off).
I have to believe a lot of that had to do with location. I and most from Denver Boulder area agree CO Springs is a nice town, but mainly in the summer. Also every snow we have there is going to be an accident near Castle Rock which is on the way south to the springs from Denver. If they moved the world arena and the FS hall o' fame I think the attendance would be greater. The person who drove last time I was there in the middle of Olys last year to see Sasha at the Broadmoore said that is the last time he would drive down in inclement weather. It was sketchy. And there was really nothing else to do down there that getting a head start on the 2 - 4 (due to weather) hour drive didn't take precedence over.
The location is an important factor for the dismal audience size of 4cc. But my generally impression is that the crowd of gymnastics competition is much much larger than figure skating competition for a while. When u watched all the GP events such as Skate America across globe, you'll see more than half of the seats are empty(except maybe NHK Cup). From what I saw this afternoon on TV, the size of gymnastics competition is much larger. The arena is roughly filled.
I do believe one reason is that figure skating's scoring does not appeal to regular audiences. if you over emphasize on 'flutz', 'edge', and stuff like that, you really can't appeal to mass crowd. How can you actually tell from a distance whether a skater is flutzing or not anyway. Another good example is Suyra Bonaly. She is very athletic and definitely a crow pleaser. 'Regular' viewers just love her. But she's crucified by judges and diehards on skating boards for lack of edge, basic skating skills etc. The contrast is so sharp that 'regular' viewers just did not understand why she got low marks, and obviously they would no longer be interested in such a flawed sport.
I really believe the scoring system itself is very flawed with emphasis on subtle quality, instead of athletism, 'wow' factor. Maybe that's why figure skating only appeals to those picky women?, just kidding. I don't know.
A dying sport with picky flutz haters?
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