Do "Looks" matter in scores / points?

SeaniBu · May 17, 2007

If a skater is "attractive, good looking, beautiful, pretty....." more so than any other skater, Does it at all reflect in the points scored?

Should it at all reflect in the points scored?

~*invisible subconscious emoticon :no: *~

This does not account for "beautiful attributes" in the skating it's self, but the "physical attractiveness" of any said skater opposed to any other being given any advantage in scoreing.

I am sure someone else could post this question better than I

And a side note, does it account for skaters being promoted when starting out??? ...in the longevity of their career??? :scratch:

Mathman · May 17, 2007

I would say no, it doesn't matter very much.

For one thing, the "magic of hollywood" can make anyone look glamorous. The skaters that look so fantastic on the ice, if you saw them walking down the street in real life without their makeup, costumes, etc., they would be ordinary people.

(Take Tanith, for example -- OK, bad example, LOL)

morninglight · May 17, 2007

Having long legs and arms and a slim body helps the overall line and seem to affect the PCS

Even if the skater does not stretch enough, it looks less pronounced if he/she has a slim body line.

But it doesn't seem that having a beautiful face matter in getting higher scores in an obvious manner.

Yet it certainly helps an already successful skater to appeal more to the public and become more popular, which would help his/her career as a pro skater in the long run.

Personally, I would not mind top skaters not being as beautiful as a model, so long as they present their movements beautifully. Additionally, it would be nice if the skaters have wonderful aesthetic sense in their choice of costume and makeup etc. I always looked forward to seeing Sasha's costumes and makeup

I wonder if any of the skaters use a make-up artist before the performance

I think that it would be really nice if they did. Some young skaters are not necessarily skillful in make-up, perhaps because it may be difficult for them to do make-up that looks nice both in camera zoom-up and in person.

Mathman · May 18, 2007

Michelle Kwan credits Oksana Baiul and Nancy Kerrigan for teaching her how to do make-up, when she went on her first COI tour at fourteen.

gio · May 18, 2007

Looks do matter in FS. Beautiful dresses, make up, hair do... all counts.

SK8LUVR · May 18, 2007

Looks certainly do matter. It is the whole package that make people drawn to a certain person not just in skating but life in general. We have all witnessed the senerios on tv where they make the same person 'ugly' and then 'pretty' and see how they are treated both ways. Just terrible that our society is like that but it is the truth.

Jimmy Hoffa · May 18, 2007

Looks matter. They shouldn't but they do.

dancindiva03 · May 18, 2007

They shouldn't, but sometimes they do.

Ptichka · May 31, 2007

Looks do matter, but much more so for ladies than for men.

JonnyCoop · Jun 1, 2007

Yeah, looks matter. Think about it; how many unattractive skaters do you see on medal podiums?? (Yes, I know "unattractive" is in the eye of the beholder, but I'm not talking about "unattractive" as in "not YOUR particular type" I'm talking "unattractive" as in UNATTRACTIVE.) Are we supposed to believe that there aren't any talented UGLY skaters out there? (for definition of 'UGLY" see definition of "unattractive" above). That would rather defy the law of averages, would it not?

And please, for the type of poster who shows up on this board on occasion and needs to be told stuff like this: PLEASE DO NOT USE THIS POST AS A SPRINGBOARD TO DISCUSS THE LOOKS OF TOP SKATERS PAST AND PRESENT. You may read this and think "Oh, ugly skaters never win? How about so-and-so" and you have a right to this opinion, but please do not POST it. I don't want this to lead to an invitation to bashing, as posts like this have led to in the past.

JonnyCoop · Jun 1, 2007

Ptichka said:
Looks do matter, but much more so for ladies than for men.

OK. I'll agree with that, within the criteria of my post above. But y'know, it seems to me, IMHO, that the top guys just seem to get cuter and cuter every year.... :laugh:

Ptichka · Jun 1, 2007

JonnyCoop said:
OK. I'll agree with that, within the criteria of my post above. But y'know, it seems to me, IMHO, that the top guys just seem to get cuter and cuter every year....

All right, I will give you that. However, it appears to be almost a self-fulfilling prophecy - guys who are physically unattractive are perhaps unwilling to go into a sport where they have to put on a tight fitting sequin costume in the first place.

tully · Jun 1, 2007

I don't buy it (that looks matter), not under COP anyway.

Bebe, for instance, is not the best looking of the elite ladies, not even close. (She is certainly attractive among the general pop. of course.) But she could easily contend for Nats title, if she were clean. Her inconsistency has held her back-- not her looks.

JonnyCoop · Jun 1, 2007

Ptichka said:
All right, I will give you that. However, it appears to be almost a self-fulfilling prophecy - guys who are physically unattractive are perhaps unwilling to go into a sport where they have to put on a tight fitting sequin costume in the first place.

Good point. Then again, when you see some of the "bad audition" tapes from "So You Think You Can Dance" and "American Idol" and things like that.... :laugh:

Wolfgang · Jun 1, 2007

Looks matter a great deal, but not always the way you think.

In FS, there is a certain 'look' that the Powers That Be like, and that always has and always will be favored over others.
Only a truly HUGE difference in skating skill has any hope at all of overcoming a deficit in this 'look'.

There's also the reverse - the 'I hate Barbie' effect - where a truly pretty girl will be boycotted by mainly the female (and some male) judges, coaches, etc. precisely because she is so pretty and they are jealous.
Whether or not she can skate better than anyone else or not doesn't matter.

Exactly like in real life, the way you look has a MASSIVE effect on just about every breath you take.

No one will admit this, least of all the ladies, but the same applies to men, just not quite as overtly.
In this case, only fame, money and power can truly overcome a deficit in looks.

yougot2go · Jun 2, 2007

Do looks matter in scores and points?

I think many of the Senor ladies from this years nationals are beautiful! So, who do you consider good looking?

passion · Jun 6, 2007

Wolfgang said:
Exactly like in real life, the way you look has a MASSIVE effect on just about every breath you take.

Not just in skating, but in life in general people's attitudes are affected by the way you look. I don't think it can be changed because that is human nature. I think anybody who puts down skating for this phenomenon is being hippocritical because all people do it whether they are aware of it or not in even the most subtle ways in life. It is so internalized and socialized, and may even have an evolutionary component to it.

Click to expand...

SeaniBu · Jun 7, 2007

yougot2go said:
I think many of the Senor ladies from this years nationals are beautiful! So, who do you consider good looking?

:agree: As for who???...I would classify 90% of the lady skaters as "good looking." 70% of the men IMO.

It seemed this took a turn of "in real life general comparison" where as I was thinking more of regarding points given for skating. As in, do they inflate a skaters scores solely due to their physical attractiveness? I am sure this a factor in "opportunities in life" but is or should it be a factor when regarding the points given directly regarding the programme it's self?

It is kind of like saying, does a person who has a job, get raises or everyone overlooks their mistakes purely based on their looks? I have seen situations where say a administrative assistant was chosen for a job role over another candidate with equal qualifications, but once they have the job are they / should they be given "extras" based on their looks.

JonnyCoop · Jun 7, 2007

SeaniBu said:
do they inflate a skaters scores solely due to their physical attractiveness? I am sure this a factor in "opportunities in life" but is or should it be a factor when regarding the points given directly regarding the programme it's self?

I think one should only need to truly analyze most of the programs of Elena Sokolova to realize that on occasion they do inflate the scores -- if Elena wasn't "so darn cute" she'd never have cracked the top 10 in anything outside of Russia, IMHO. And one can make a pretty good case that Oksana Baiul, never much of a technician, made an entire career out of being "precious." And I think that Nicole Bobek also got away with more (or, in the context of technical content, LESS) because she had a "look" that the judges really responded to.

SHOULD it be a factor? Absolutely not. But it does certainly help to market your sport these days if there's a lot of hotties at the top. (Not that either the ISU or USFS has done much in the marketing department lately.) I do have to say, tho, that by and large, I think it's pretty much a coincidence that most of the top people (especially in Dance) are just so darn good-looking. Perhaps all that cold air exposure starting in early childhood does something for the skin... :laugh:

(Then again, in the case of many of the ladies, we actually have NO idea what they look like without makeup.....) [Actually, that's an unfair comment. There's probably a lot of the MEN we have no idea what they look like without makeup, either.... :laugh:

]

gio · Jun 7, 2007

It is difficult to find a non attractive girl competitor. It is true that we don't know how they look without make up (but I've seen some and they are pretty also without it), but make-up can help just a bit. I'm positive that Kiira, Tanith, Domnina, Navka and Sasha are beautiful even without make-up. :yes:

Now that I think about it... In practice they don't use make-up, so we've seen some photos of them without it and they look pretty also.

Do "Looks" matter in scores / points?

"Looks" get higher scores?

looks do matter

looks do not matter

looks matter only when a skater is starting

looks matter only in the longevity of a career

looks should not matter

looks should matter

SeaniBu

Mathman

morninglight

Mathman

gio

SK8LUVR

Jimmy Hoffa

dancindiva03

Match Penalty

Ptichka

Forum translator

JonnyCoop

JonnyCoop

Ptichka

Forum translator

tully

JonnyCoop

Wolfgang

yougot2go

passion

SeaniBu

JonnyCoop

gio

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