Changes in pairs skating

childfreegirl · Jul 10, 2007

Mods, if this belongs in the "old school" thread, I understand.

I was watching this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCN7e683GH8 clip of Maribel Owen and Dudley Richards at the '61 Nats and I got to wondering a couple of things.

1) She is almost as big and tall as he is. When did the trend start toward smaller ladies and larger guys?

2) In the program, they did a couple of what I'd call "dance-y" lifts, one lift that went up and resembled a lift that would be done today, but it didn't appear to have much ice coverage at all, and a couple (at least) lifts that looked like they never got up in the air. When the latter happened, the audience still applauded and the commentators didn't act like anything was out of the ordinary. My knowledge of pairs is not what it could be, but that didn't look right to me. So my second question is, when did the technique/style of lifts change?

3) The little jumps they did together (not the sbs ones), what was that called?

Or was I just seeing things? My contacts were bothering me today, so I just want to be sure I wasn't going off the deep end.

Ptichka · Jul 11, 2007

childfreegirl said:
She is almost as big and tall as he is. When did the trend start toward smaller ladies and larger guys?

I think it was really popularized by Zhuk and his students. Zhuk & Gorelik, Rodnina & Ulanov, Rodnina & Zaitsev, Cherkasova & Shukrai, Gordeeva & Grinkov - all those pairing were selected by Zhuk, and all of them had very tall guys with diminutive girls. I think this facilitated the difficult elements his school popularized; I mean, the girl has to be pretty light to be thrown around every which way.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jul 11, 2007

When the 'roar of the crowd' went for acrobatic lifts, the heights of the Pairs became very important for gold medals. Little girls being tossed around by taller men.

I still prefer Randy and Tai for the perfect rapport.

Joe

dutchherder · Jul 11, 2007

When did throw jumps become common? Rodnina and Zaitsev didn't have any throws in their winning Olympic program in 1980, but Babilonia and Gardner were doing them easy-peasy-fo sheezy in 1979.

Tinymavy15 · Jul 11, 2007

liike all skating in those days it was easier. the lifts were not half as difficult as today, no throw triple jumps. The men did not need to be strong to the extreme because there they were not always lifting the ladies over thier heads, hurling them across the ice etc. the women could be taller and heavier. as the sport eveolved to become more and more difficult it was only natural that it would be easier on the man if the girl was smaller so that trend started. As of late, most of the newer couples do not have drastic height diffrences, which looks better.

Ladskater · Jul 13, 2007

I was not aware that Miribel Owen was a pair skater. This is wonderful footage. Pairs skating has certainly evolved over the years. It started out almost like dance with pretty much the same set of rules - the lifts were limited. The skaters were often well matched in height. It was not probably until the 1970s that we started to see the tall guy with the "rag" doll type skater - as Debbie Wilkes used to call them. I think Russia actually started the trend. I think it added to the look of the pair and as the throws and lifts became more spectacular it probably made it easier for the male skater to execute the pair moves with a tinier partner. Just my theory of course!!!

Anyway, this was great footage from the old school of figure skating - the way I remember it. I loved the jump they did together. I acutally would not mind seeing some of the pair skaters today revisiting this old formula of pair skating. It is getting a little "ho-hum" at times with each pair trying to outdo the other pair with some over the top lift. Sometimes "less is more."

Great post.

blue dog · Jul 13, 2007

Ladskater said:
I was not aware that Miribel Owen was a pair skater. This is wonderful footage. Pairs skating has certainly evolved over the years. It started out almost like dance with pretty much the same set of rules - the lifts were limited. The skaters were often well matched in height. It was not probably until the 1970s that we started to see the tall guy with the "rag" doll type skater - as Debbie Wilkes used to call them. I think Russia actually started the trend. I think it added to the look of the pair and as the throws and lifts became more spectacular it probably made it easier for the male skater to execute the pair moves with a tinier partner. Just my theory of course!!!

Anyway, this was great footage from the old school of figure skating - the way I remember it. I loved the jump they did together. I acutally would not mind seeing some of the pair skaters today revisiting this old formula of pair skating. It is getting a little "ho-hum" at times with each pair trying to outdo the other pair with some over the top lift. Sometimes "less is more."

Great post.

lad, I'm with you--I'm not a big fan of the flea/gorilla pairs that we see today, but I think the elements have gotten so that the girl almost has to be a full foot shorter than the male (especially with the overhead lift/scoop dismount). One of my favourite pairs, Kazakova and Dmitriev (and Jamie/David) were both pairs that were better-matched, than some flea-gorilla pairs, like Cherkasova/Shakhrai, and Chichkova/Naumov.

But, yes, the Russians began this trend with Cherkasova/Shakhrai, who were the first to attempt the split quad twist.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jul 13, 2007

One of my favourite pairs, Kazakova and Dmitriev (and Jamie/David) were both pairs that were better-matched, than some flea-gorilla pairs, like Cherkasova/Shakhrai, and Chichkova/Naumov.

Good choices! Shen and Zhao are a nice size, too. Much better than watching the man on stilts lifting a dwarf from a side show.

Joe

Changes in pairs skating

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