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Thread: Matt Savoie at 2002 Worlds

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  1. #1
    Thank God for Stephane Lambiel and Matt Savoie! shine's Avatar
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    Matt Savoie at 2002 Worlds

    I just had a chance to watch his amazing LP from that particular event and went to check his result at IceCalc right after. OMG I'm in a complete shock. How on earth did he manage to place that low (11th!!!!!) in the FS with a performance, a program, and skating quality and presentation (though quadless) like that? Both sets of his marks were disgustingly low with the range from 5.0-5.4 (what the hell??). And to have Goebel so much further above him was just outrageous. Was Matt crawling over the ice on that particular day? I have no idea how the men from 5th-10th did, but some of the names just totally boggle the mind like Liu, Zhang, Dambier. Did they all land 3 quads or something??? Please, I need to be enlightened!
    Last edited by shine; 08-09-2003 at 01:53 AM.

  2. #2
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    He was in 14th place after the SP. I guess they didn't want to give him scores that were too high with so many skaters left to go?

    I'm not sure. I don't understand it either way. His LP was AMAZING. I am STILL very annoyed that he got chacked in the US.

  3. #3
    Tripping on the Podium
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    To have Goebel ahead of him wasn't outrageous to me. Tim had a 3 quad advatange over Matt, and Matt will never be able to come close to beating tim until he gets at least one.

  4. #4
    Learning to Fly
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    I don't think I saw Matt's programs @ World's... I only saw ABC's coverage. Now I'm intrigued! While he's not one of my favorites I do think his style is refreshing.

  5. #5
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    Matt landed: 3sal, 3x-3toe, 2x, 3f-2toe, 3loop, spread eagle into 3x, back hydroblade move into 3lutz.

    So he 'only' did 7 triples, lol. A 5.0 for 7 triples.

    Great edges and nice footwork sequence also, in addition to his great spins. I liked this LP a lot more than Ragtime.

  6. #6
    SkateFan4Life
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    Oh well, here we go again - the issue of reputation. Matt Savoie is a wonderful skater, and when he's on, he's a very fine combination of athlete and artist. However, he's prone to making mistakes, and since he does not have a consistent quad jump, he's just not going to receive the technical marks he needs to come close to the podium at any international events.

    That being said, I certainly hope Matt skates two great programs at US Nationals and qualifies for the 2004 World Team. I'd like to see him put together two absolutely outstanding programs at Worlds, and then see where the judges place him. Maybe in the top six?

    Good luck, Matt!

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    I actually don't think it's a reputation issue at all.

    since he does not have a consistent quad jump, he's just not going to receive the technical marks he needs to come close to the podium at any international events.
    I think being a bronze medalist at the 2001 Grand Prix Final (behind Yagudin & Plushenko, defeating Goebel & Ilia Klimkin) gives him a pretty good reputation internationally. He medaled (I think) at Skate Canada & COR during the 2000-2001 season and also medaled at Skate America behind Joubert & Abt the following season.

    The problem is he had a lot of ground to make up to come back from 14th place and I imagine there were a lot of skaters were left to go ahead of him. They had to leave room.

    I do agree that 5.0's for that particular performance are a little ridiculous.

  8. #8
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    I really really really like Matt Savoie... he's really starting to find his way into my heart LOL

    His skating reminds me of Brian Orser's skating... I don't know why... maybe it's the type of music... or the way he skates... *shrugs*

    I hope he makes it back on the podium along with Goebel & Weiss this season :D

  9. #9
    Procrastinating b/c of Worlds
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    Another reason I don't like quads, Goebel can place above Savoie, .

    TV

  10. #10
    Tripping on the Podium
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    I honestley wish people would stop looking down on Goebel and his quads. He has much higher diffulty than Savoie, and yes if it weren't for quads Savoie would probably beat Goebel in an heart beat, but doing a quad isn't easy and I think Goebel should be applauded for being able to do 3 in one program.

  11. #11
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    Originally posted by Smiley0884
    I honestley wish people would stop looking down on Goebel and his quads. He has much higher diffulty than Savoie, and yes if it weren't for quads Savoie would probably beat Goebel in an heart beat, but doing a quad isn't easy and I think Goebel should be applauded for being able to do 3 in one program.
    I think Tim's ok. He's still young and I think he'll improve.

    My issue was more with Matt moving up a grand total of 2 spots from 14th to 12th with that great performance and getting scores in the low 5's.

  12. #12
    Thank God for Stephane Lambiel and Matt Savoie! shine's Avatar
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    Exactly.
    I understand that the judges had to leave room for the skaters yet to skate hence the ridiculously low marks. But on the other hand if Matt was a better skater than those who placed above him, I can't understand why the judges would have a reason to hold him down. IMO the programs is one of the best from that season with beautiful moves in the field brilliantly choreographed to the music, difficult jump entrance, and good placement of elements. Matt's presentation is just a delight to watch. To me, he's sort of like the male and more mature version of Ye Bin Mok, with a lot of refined nuances and passion in his skating. He's a very musical skater IMO. His result at this Worlds will remain a puzzle for me.

    Re: Tim Goebel and his quads. I'm not saying Tim shouldn't have placed as high as he did; it's definetly justifiable under the current trend and judging system. After all, he's the only men who can consistently land 3 quads. But this is why this judging system is far from being perfect.
    Last edited by shine; 08-10-2003 at 06:37 PM.

  13. #13
    ~ Evgeni's Sex Bomb ~
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    I don't know that Tim can consistenly land three quads. I've seen a couple of performances
    where he didn't land ANY. And when his quads fall apart, there's nothing left. His triple axel is
    wonky, and his presentation, with the exception of Worlds this year, is appalling. How he gets
    presentation marks above 5.2 is beyond me. If he lands three quads, give him a 6.0, I don't care,
    but then balance it out with a proper presentation mark.

    You don't need a quad to place well at Worlds, I think Sergei Davydov proved that this year.
    Hopefully, the CoP won't screw this up too badly, and Matt's beautiful presentation, and VERY
    difficult entries into his 3A and 3lutz will keep his scores elevated. (I might argue that the spread
    eagle into 3A is equal in difficulty to quad toe?)

    Matt is the only American skater I like, so I wish him well.

    Laura

  14. #14
    Keeper of Michelle's Nose berthes ghost's Avatar
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    "I have no idea how the men from 5th-10th did, but some of the names just totally boggle the mind like Liu, Zhang, Dambier. Did they all land 3 quads or something???"

    Dambier:
    3x/2t, 4s, 3x, 3f(step out), 3r, 3z, spiral/frog/inside SE/3r(poped to double and 2 footed), outside SE/3t

    5.0 to 5.5 tech
    5.2 to 5.6 pres

  15. #15
    In the void
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    All in all - if I understand it correctly, the judging system we're talking about is completely relative. Which means that you can't compare a routine from one competition to one from another. You can only compare routines within a competition (and of course still criticise the results). So to find out if Matt's judging was fair you would have to list every routine from the one finishing 1 to - let's say 15 or 20 - to decide if it's correctly judged. And then set yourself in the position of judges who are advised to be able to fit in about 10 still coming skaters at the point when they're judging Matt Savoie... Of course the whole rest could have become splatfest and then perhaps Matt's marks should have been the highest in the free program (even though they're relatively low) - but iirc it wasn't a splatfest, was it?

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