Highest Level Jump from an Adult

bondgirl · Mar 19, 2008

What is the highest level jump you have seen a "real" adult skater (not a professional) do? I'm talking like 25+ year old.

Natalie Shaby has 2Lutz and 2Axel was really close (just a step out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMvqmTCkK2w).
I think she is in her 40s. She's the highest I know of.

Does anyone have a triple?

dlkksk8fan · Mar 19, 2008

Larry Holliday was the first competitor to land a triple jump at the U.S. Adult National Championships.

Not sure what age he is.

bondgirl · Mar 19, 2008

Went to YouTube, but couldn't find Holliday. (Know you're right, though, because I remember reading that on the USFS site.) Did find two adult male skaters who were impressive: :clap:

Stephane Vachon: Step out of 2Axel, but really nice layback and 2Lutz. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q0lvHg98Pw
Jerome Poulin: Good 2Axel and 3Sal. Stepped out of 3Loop. Stepped out/fell on 3Toe. Possible 3Lutz (spectator's head in way).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZOhqcMGNwA
Poulin looks kind of young, but I think Vachon may be older (30ish).

Tinymavy15 · Mar 19, 2008

I saw a lady at my rink once landing huge, beautiful 2 axels. She had better jumps than most novice "ladies". I guess she was close to 40.

mskater93 · Mar 19, 2008

Last year's Masters Ladies Champion had 2 2A in her program. She's 30ish
Natalie Shaby landed a beautiful 2A in Dallas at ANs (06)
Liz Floriani landed 2As in KC in 05
Larry has landed 3S and 3T and he's in his 40s and has knee surgery a few times
Eric Shroyer landed 3Lz at LP ANs in 04
Deedee Reeves was the first lady to land 2A at ANs. She was early 30's at the time in Ann Arbor

bondgirl · Mar 20, 2008

So there are some triples, (though generally out of the men). Interesting......:think:

mskater93 · Mar 20, 2008

Each of these people have (had) lovely skating and appropriate spin/footwork/spiral skills to go with it.

bondgirl · Mar 20, 2008

Yes, if they are (were) competiting...and hoped to win...then, they would definitely need (have needed) the whole package.... Having said that, too bad there is not a "Jump Competition" at the National Level. It would be great if they just allowed everyone to compete who could complete the jump. And adding combo would be extra points. Of course, because the whole thing is geared toward the "whole package" one is not allowed to enter even a jump competiton without passing the MITF for that level.....Not very democratic is it? :disapp:
But then who said organized figure skating was a democracy?

mskater93 · Mar 21, 2008

The topic of the whole package came up this morning while we were getting our skates on. It was noticed that the skating skills in a group on video from a recent competition had a huge disparity from first to last. The first couple places had very nice skating skills, speed, flow, power, edge (all level appropriate) between their jump and spin elements; the jump and spin elements of the top couple skaters were not the "most difficult" that are allowed by level. Once you got past the first couple places, the skating noticeably degenerates to steppy stroking, flats, bouncing, etc and some of them DID attempt the more difficult elements. When you watch the group as a whole, you wonder how those at the lower end results-wise even managed to pass the tests associated with the level because of the disparity. Remember, this sport is called FIGURE skating not JUMP skating because the basis of the sport is in school figures (which, yes, have been dumped due to $$$).

passion · Mar 21, 2008

mskater93 said:
The topic of the whole package came up this morning while we were getting our skates on. It was noticed that the skating skills in a group on video from a recent competition had a huge disparity from first to last. The first couple places had very nice skating skills, speed, flow, power, edge (all level appropriate) between their jump and spin elements; the jump and spin elements of the top couple skaters were not the "most difficult" that are allowed by level. Once you got past the first couple places, the skating noticeably degenerates to steppy stroking, flats, bouncing, etc and some of them DID attempt the more difficult elements. When you watch the group as a whole, you wonder how those at the lower end results-wise even managed to pass the tests associated with the level because of the disparity. Remember, this sport is called FIGURE skating not JUMP skating because the basis of the sport is in school figures (which, yes, have been dumped due to $$$).

Sadly, figures is quickly becoming a long lost forgotten art. In response to your point about skating skills, speed, flow, power, and edge: after watching the World Championships in Sweden it is very evident that the top skaters are exceptional in the above. In Canada, there is no such thing as MITF and certainly no such thing as a requirement to also pass free skate levels. You can just imagine what the disparity is then.

bondgirl · Mar 21, 2008

Is that really true? So, in Canada, you would just take the freeskating portion. No required MITF or figures? Just the freeskating? (Along with fee health insurance, just another reason to move. :biggrin:

)
Also....In the Johnny/Evan Thread, it mentions Evan is promoting an "extreme" version of ice skating to focus on jumps, backflips etc....Now THIS might be the answer for those of us who don't like "artistic" aspects of this sport. :agree:
Well, yeah, technically it is "figure" skating, but I doubt too many people want to go back to those days were the ice tracings (on single jumps) were what counted. Maybe "purists" would like to see that, but I guarentee that you wouldn't sell to many tickets to ice shows or major competitions. Like it or not, the triples rule the sport. Eventually, it will be the quads. That's just how it is. (Except, of course, for ice dance.)
But the thread is kind of getting off course....
I was wondering if the lack of triple jumps out of adults was from lack of skill, bodyweight, fear of falling, general body breakdown due to age, adults focusing on the "whole package" in order to compete....What exactly it was. Did find some men doing triples, (no women though), which leads me to think maybe it is a strength/bodyweight thing...maybe.

eli · Mar 21, 2008

When you are talking about adult skaters who are doing high level doubles and triples, you probably need to clarify what kind of an adult skater -- at the adult level, you have 18 through 75 years of age. And, you have people who learned to skate as children versus those who started in their thirties or forties. I think Natalie Shaby skated as a child ( I might be wrong) -- she is a lovely skater and I am not taking anything away from her but someone who skated in their early years has that programmed into their muscle memory.....as opposed to someone who started a Learn to Skate program (just learning to stay upright and skate forwards/backwards) when they were 35 and then started landing doubles at 40.

bondgirl · Mar 21, 2008

Of course you are right. At that level, (triples) I just assumed that it would be an adult with a "history" (either on ice, roller, or, maybe, as a gymnast). Triples out of someone who started after age 25 without any "history" would be incredible :eek:

I'm not saying it couldn't be done, but, well .....WOW!!! :bow:

No, it would have to be someone with a "history" who was in very good physical shape, (low bodyweight, no/few injuries, good leg strength), with adequate skating skills to support the jump.....Don't think it's necessarily an "age" thing, because I've seen Browning land triples and Boitano land a "Boitano" 3Lutz at 46! So....it can be done (by the elite who stay in shape, anyway). Saw another (unnamed) Olympic champ, (Boitano's age) and he only could manage a 3Toe, (listen to me, "only"). But he had put on some weight.

eli · Mar 21, 2008

Hmmm, now that you asked, I wonder if anyone has landed any triples after learning to skate at 30????

silver.blades · Mar 22, 2008

bondgirl said:
Is that really true? So, in Canada, you would just take the freeskating portion. No required MITF or figures? Just the freeskating? (Along with fee health insurance, just another reason to move. )

I don't know about the competative stream, but for the test stream there is a program and elements part to pass the freeskate. The elements does include footwork and field moves, but you decide them yourself and it's not as extensive as the American MITF. Skills and dance tests as well as interpretives are used for testing edging and some MITF.

bondgirl · Mar 22, 2008

Really? I live within an hour of the border. Wonder if you have to be a Canadian citizen? Of course, I don't like competiting. Done it (on roller). Hated it.

I would rather have dental surgery without novicane. (And yes I have had dental surgery...) It would only be to get some kind of certification so I could possibly teach somedy if I ever wanted to. Is this your governing body and test program?http://www.skatecanada.ca/en/skate_for_life/programs/competitive_skate/
So you can choose the MITF you want? Nice! It also looks like you might be able to enter at your own level. (No bunny hops and singles for the first several tests.) WOW!!! I love Canada!!!!

silver.blades · Mar 22, 2008

I'm not sure about skipping test levels, but I don't think you have to be a citizen, just a skate canada member. So if you can skate at a skate Canada club I think you'd be fine. Here you only need the Jr. Bronze level in all 4 test sections to coach so it's not that difficult.

bondgirl · Mar 22, 2008

Cool.

Thanks for alll the info! :biggrin:

I just thought that you could "step in" at a certain level, so to speak, because of this line: (taken from web page referenced above)

What is CompetitiveSkate?
The Competitive Test Program is a testing program for skaters in singles, pairs and dance wishing to compete in qualifying events within Skate Canada. Skaters take tests specific to the discipline (Singles, Pairs and Dance) in which they wish to compete. A skater or team may begin testing at the level at which they wish to compete (there are no test pre-requisites)
Of couse, it is competitive tract, not just test tract. Still, good info to know.(Doubt I will ever use it), but good info to know.

mskater93 · Mar 22, 2008

I believe the intent is to move from the test stream to the competitive stream wherever you are ready. I believe you have to have passed the pre-requisite test stream tests.

silver.blades · Mar 22, 2008

I think that only applys to compeative test, not Starskate tests. So if you want to take your Sr. compeative test before the Jr. I think you can, but you can't take Sr. Bronze before Jr. Bronze, or I would have skipped a couple dances

Highest Level Jump from an Adult

bondgirl

dlkksk8fan

bondgirl

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win

mskater93

bondgirl

mskater93

bondgirl

mskater93

passion

bondgirl

eli

bondgirl

eli

silver.blades

bondgirl

silver.blades

bondgirl

mskater93

silver.blades

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