kimmie's ad

cassieandcheetah · Apr 10, 2008

This quote of hers really really bothered me. Did it bother anyone else? Well, it's okay if she "likes" that look...I guess it's rather convenient for her as she is one of the worst artists on the ice. But what bothers me is the way she views the sport. Is she just in denial, or is she promoting a certain attitude toward the sport?

"Figure skating is a very athletic sport," said Meissner. "As you watch, you can see the ladies division is getting even more technically demanding. We are jocks. I like that look."

Mathman · Apr 10, 2008

I think it's a great quote. For one thing, it's an ad for sports bras, not tutus.

I like "we are jocks" a lot better than if she had said, "I love to look pretty in my spangly dress."

Plus, she looks smashing in the picture, IMHO. :rock:

cassieandcheetah · Apr 10, 2008

Mathman said:
I think it's a great quote. For one thing, it's an ad for sports bras, not tutus.

I like "we are jocks" a lot better than if she had said, "I love to look pretty in my spangly dress."

Plus, she looks smashing in the picture, IMHO.

Yes she looks good, but in that picture she looks more like a soccer player than anything. That's not how I would view figure skating. I wonder what Kimmie thinks of Johnny Weir?

Particle Man · Apr 10, 2008

cassieandcheetah said:
I guess it's rather convenient for her as she is one of the worst artists on the ice.

Sounds pretty close to bashing there.

Kimmie's artistry has improved a lot this season. Unfortunately her jumps suffered. I bet if she had been clean while skating to Nessun Dorma this season, people (at least objective people) would have been praising her artistic improvements. Instead people just talk about her falls.

And it is an athletic sport, and certainly moreso now. Anyone who thinks it isn't is the one in denial. Heard of CoP?

Tonichelle · Apr 10, 2008

she's an athlete... if she's supposed to prissy in pink all the time then we're fooling ourselves thinking this is a sport.

even Johnny Weir is sick of the whole "I just want to do my best" stuff...

Sylvia · Apr 10, 2008

For those who may not have seen the Meissner article and print ad yet, I'll just repost the link here: http://web.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080410&content_id=47303&vkey=ice_news
I think it's a great quote and photo.

cassieandcheetah · Apr 10, 2008

Particle Man said:
Sounds pretty close to bashing there.

Kimmie's artistry has improved a lot this season. Unfortunately her jumps suffered. I bet if she had been clean while skating to Nessun Dorma this season, people (at least objective people) would have been praising her artistic improvements. Instead people just talk about her falls.

And it is an athletic sport, and certainly moreso now. Anyone who thinks it isn't is the one in denial. Heard of CoP?

I don't think I'm bashing Kimmie here. I remember how almost all articles I read about her short program from Nationals and Worlds last year ("snowstorm") pointed out how she would have skated the same if she had skated to a different piece of music. Little acknowledgment of music, just doing her job, going from one element to another., etc I think I am a fan of Kimmie, but it's frustrating after years of watching her she has not improved much at all in terms of artistry. And now she says figure skating is a sport of "jocks." It just sounded a bit alarming to me. I know during 2006-2007 she tried to improve on her artistry, but she's stopped making that her priority (as she spoke about it publically). I can't help but feel as though she's ignoring her weaknesses now in favor of concentrating on her strenghts.

And I was pointing out Johnny Weir simply because he's one of the ones that voiced his concerns about figure skating shifting more towards athleticism at the expense of artistry. I believe Stephane has said something similar as well. Am I wrong to think that this is concerning?

Tonichelle · Apr 10, 2008

It's a sport - it's supposed to be athletic.

You want art - that's what exhibitions are for.

Ladskater · Apr 10, 2008

I personally have not seen the ad but there is a reason the ladies discipline in figure skating has always been called "ladies." I am sure such lady like skaters as Barbara Ann Scott would be appalled to hear the term "Jock" applied to female figure skaters.

Particle Man · Apr 10, 2008

I agree that Kimmie has lacked artistry in the past, maybe you disagree about her programs this season, but it's clear that artistry is the last thing that should be on her mind NOW if she wants to make a comeback. Gotta land those jumps first...

cassieandcheetah · Apr 10, 2008

Tonichelle said:
It's a sport - it's supposed to be athletic.

You want art - that's what exhibitions are for.

I'm sorry but I beg to differ. If so, why is that half of the marks in both systems are devoted to artistry and presentation??? Except it seems as though the new system has kind of distorted the whole concept...

Tonichelle · Apr 10, 2008

the artistry mark is where you see most of the goofy judging... art is subjective. It's not sport.

cassieandcheetah · Apr 10, 2008

Tonichelle said:
the artistry mark is where you see most of the goofy judging... art is subjective. It's not sport.

Just because it's more subjective doesn't mean it can be judged objectively. The problem with the new scoring system is the second mark is greatly dependent upon the first (technical ) mark. I'm starting to feel even more alarmed about this. Have I been out of the loop lately, or do most people really think we should do away with the artistry marks altogether? Since when people started thinking that figure skating should be atheticism only?

Tonichelle · Apr 11, 2008

I think when it comes to olympic competition - any competition - the SPORT/ATHLETICS should be rewarded greatly...

I see nothing wrong with Kimmie saying she enjoys being athletic. Thank GOD for girls like her who would rather break the mold and not just fit the stereotype of a pretty little ballerina out there. Not all girls are like that and they shouldn't be told it's wrong if they're not.

If it's ok for Johnny to express himself and BE himself (which it totally 100% is - and I only use him as an example as he's already been part of the conversation and he's at the top of my head) then it should be ok for ANY female skater to be a 'jock'.

I'm not saying make it a jumping contest, and I don't think Kimmie is either. She's an athlete, and she happens to be in one of those 'pretty sports' that get debates going on if it's even a sport at all. It is, but with fans complaining that it's 'too hard' and not 'pretty to watch anymore' it's kinda hard to take it seriously as such.

Mathman · Apr 11, 2008

I think we are making too much of an ad-writer's blurb.

Kimmie didn't really say this, the Madison Avenue firm that handles the Under Armour account wrote it for her and paid her to pose for a picture over that supposed "quote."

cassieandcheetah · Apr 11, 2008

Tonichelle said:
I think when it comes to olympic competition - any competition - the SPORT/ATHLETICS should be rewarded greatly...

I see nothing wrong with Kimmie saying she enjoys being athletic. Thank GOD for girls like her who would rather break the mold and not just fit the stereotype of a pretty little ballerina out there. Not all girls are like that and they shouldn't be told it's wrong if they're not.

If it's ok for Johnny to express himself and BE himself (which it totally 100% is - and I only use him as an example as he's already been part of the conversation and he's at the top of my head) then it should be ok for ANY female skater to be a 'jock'.

I'm not saying make it a jumping contest, and I don't think Kimmie is either. She's an athlete, and she happens to be in one of those 'pretty sports' that get debates going on if it's even a sport at all. It is, but with fans complaining that it's 'too hard' and not 'pretty to watch anymore' it's kinda hard to take it seriously as such.

There has been several mention of "tutu's," but the thing is, artistry doesn't mean looking like ballerinas and looking pretty. I loved Katerina Witt's portrayal of Robin Wood in her tights, and I loved Stephanie Rosenthals hip hop number. By artistry, I mean expressing music, acknowledging the difference in rhythm adn flow of her music, and not just doing the elements in rote fashion. I think Kimmie tends to do the latter, and I just hope she doesn't think omitting artistry is smply a matter of style. also she said that "we" are jocks, not just herself, so that's also what concerned me. But if she didn't say it, well, then never mind. But Mathman, why do you think she didn't say it? It sounds like she had a full length interview ,and the first quote should be as valid as the other ones after that?

Tonichelle · Apr 11, 2008

but aren't they? I'm not an athlete, therefore I'm not a jock.

I have always understood a jock to be someone who is dedicated to sport(s). I think if you're at the level that Kimmie and the other big names are then it applies. Who cares if girls aren't socially supposed to be 'jocks', I say

to the stereotype!

Whether or not she actually said teh quote, she did put her name to it. I would hope that she at least felt it was a good representation of how she feels before she agreed to anything.

cassieandcheetah · Apr 11, 2008

Tonichelle said:
but aren't they? I'm not an athlete, therefore I'm not a jock.

I have always understood a jock to be someone who is dedicated to sport(s). I think if you're at the level that Kimmie and the other big names are then it applies. Who cares if girls aren't socially supposed to be 'jocks', I say to the stereotype!

Whether or not she actually said teh quote, she did put her name to it. I would hope that she at least felt it was a good representation of how she feels before she agreed to anything.

I love how we're keeping each other up through the night....If I remember I think you were also a student?

I hope this didn't cause any hard feelings, I'm just really passionate about the subject of artistry in fs, because, I know it's hard to capture it in numbers and scores, but when you see it, it's the most gratifying thing.....you know what I mean?

Kinga · Apr 11, 2008

Tonichelle said:
It's a sport - it's supposed to be athletic.

You want art - that's what exhibitions are for.

I totally disagree with you. In general sport is about atheticism, but, as everywhere, there are exceptions. Figure skating is DEFINITELY such exception.
We can argue, whether artistic part of the programs will ever be judged correctly etc, (I am not going to discuss that here) but artistic components ARE the part of the score and we all want to see beautiful programs in connection with good technique. Otherwise, lets just do the jump contest.
So, I have nothing to say about Kimmie's ad, she can think whatever she wants, I just wanted to comment on Tonichelle's statement.

Medusa · Apr 11, 2008

cassieandcheetah said:
Yes she looks good, but in that picture she looks more like a soccer player than anything. That's not how I would view figure skating. I wonder what Kimmie thinks of Johnny Weir?

In this Q&A she was asked something similar

Q: What is your opinion of male figure skaters wearing spandex, sequins and feathers?

A: My opinion is that is just what is done for the sport, and I think that there are a lot of male figure skaters that are great guys and not all of them are gay, but even the ones that are gay are so much fun. One of my friends said that they are a little bit insecure about it because they are stereotyped like that, but they know they have to [wear the costumes] and they kind of make a joke about it.

She probably should have left out the word "even" - but apart from that, good answer.

I think it's great that she considers herself a jock, it's an honest answer. Perhaps she can take some of that attitude into next year and into her next programs. I would love to see a top-lady try something different then "I'm pretty, I'm graceful, I look good in pink and I love flowers and cuddly teddy bears."

kimmie's ad

cassieandcheetah

Mathman

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Match Penalty

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Idita-Rock-n-Roll

Sylvia

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Tonichelle

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Ladskater

~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~

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Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll

Mathman

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