Sasha Cohen quote in IFS

registered · Aug 23, 2003

mzheng said:
However her jump entry edge and landing edge is not that secure. She has the wobbling edges on most of her jumps. May be the correct words should be lack of CONTROL OF EDGE?

To judge edges, you have to look at other elements, like spirals, some spins, Ina Bauer, etc.

There are certain reasons, why skaters don't land their jumps, and they are over rotating, or under rotating (Sasha tends to over rotate her jumps), position in the air, wrong timing, and so on. All of it has nothing to do with edges.

Yes, ultimately skaters needs to hold on to the edge, after landing, but what messes them up is a mistake in the jump technique itself, not having a not deep enough edge.

shine · Aug 23, 2003

RealtorGal said:
Even in still shots, Sasha's fingers look soft and fluid.

Are you kidding? Sasha and fluid in one sentence.

shine · Aug 23, 2003

Man this discussion is a mess. There's even someone mentioning that edges can hardly be judged unless photos of two skaters doing the same element are taken for comparison. I wonder how the judges judge and how competitions proceed then.

Mathman · Aug 23, 2003

Well, from small beginnings this has turned into a lively thread.

In that photo of Mao posted several times, I think her fingers, albeit separated, are stiff and tight--the position is forced.

?? You must mean Miki Ando, right? Twelve-year-old Mao Asada is holding her skirt out in a curtsey. About Ando's fingers, I would say that they are fully extended and very dramatic. No, they are not "natural" -- that's the whole point of this art, IMHO. These are not slouchy teenagers hanging out "naturally" at the mall, they are dramatic performing artists. They should blow you away with the beauty that they are able to express with little details like finger position. (Sorry about the "fetish" post. :laugh:

)

Sasha is getting up there in age. -- fanforlady2001

You make me feel ancient, Fanforlady2001. :laugh:

But I understand what you mean. Historically, most skaters who are destined for greatness have already achieved substantial success by their mid to late teens. Sasha, of course, had the bad fortune to have lost a crucial year to injury. Anyway, that's the past. Onward and upward!

And now, at the risk of being a party pooper, I wanted to comment on the original topic of this thread. Which was, um, let me look back to page one -- oh yes, what do you think of Sasha's innocuous and politically correct comment, "this season has taught me to look at my skating instead of looking at the competition and what other people are doing. I've learned to focus on just enjoying myself out there, not even worrying about having to skate perfect."

Yawn. I miss the old feisty Sasha.

(Hey GrGranny -- there's a word that violates the "i before e" rule -- as Spellchecker just told me, LOL.)

I wish she would have said, "I'm going to kick the other girls' butts this year."

But she didn't say that, and neither she nor any other elite level female skater ever will. (Alexei Yagudin, now, that's another story!) We insist that our ladies be ladylike and wholesome -- the better to snag endorsements, my dears.

And finally, about criticism and bashing, I agree with Lucy and Dee:

Sasha is held to a very different standard (of perfection), fairly or not

This is the price paid by everyone who aspires to be the very best. But it is also the reward. When people start bashing you about petty things, it means that you have made it into the inner circle of the sport's elite. As they say in Hollywood, "I don't care what you write about me, just spell my name right." That's S-A-S-H-A. :laugh:

(Now, pass the beef contract. Want to buy my fashion line?)

Mathman

fanforlady2001 · Aug 23, 2003

I was only kidding, I just think that many sasha fans say that about other skaters and sasha has been in competitions for awhile also, her profile at usfa has her winnings since 96. You are not ancient mathman.

rtureck · Aug 23, 2003

RealtorGal said:
That business about her not having deep edges is utter nonsense. Why the bashing? Maybe because Dick loves to GUSH about her in a way reserved only for her! That really rankles some fans!

I totally agree with Berthes Ghost, some people think Sasha is the best thing since indoor plumbing, and some people think she is not quite as great as indoor plumbing. It is a difference of opinion. Just because some posters here do not worship Sasha does not mean they are bashing at all. Gee.. give me a break. I understand why Mr. suspended, I mean Mr. registered could have such a misunderstanding, he is busy with 2 Sasha Cohen sites, the Sasha fans #1, and skate forum/ Sasha fan #2, he might not have time to read the definition of bashing here. But for someone who has more than 1000 post here to have such a misunderstanding????? :eek:

I think Sasha's edges are not the deepest, they are OK. At worlds QR she bobbled on simple stroking, call it whatever, I did not see that in any of the top ladies. So some posters here do not agree that Sasha has the deepest edges, that does not mean they are writing "non sense". They are just not praising/ worshipping Sasha to the same intensity.

If one wants to see DEEP, intimidatingly awesome hard edges, look at Irina. :love:

Pix said Miki is a "jumping bean with no art", I don't get all worked up about it, it is just her opinion.

rtureck · Aug 23, 2003

gezando said:
You mean Sasha's fingers are short and FAT?

I mean Sasha does not have naturally long, slender expressive fingers like Oksana, but she has tried her very best with what is given her. I agree with mzheng, Sasha has found some hand/ finger choreography, fist in / palm out, fist in/ palm out, it works OK for her. She is OK basic ballet level.

(This is just my opinion, please don't go after my opnion as "hand fetish" or "non sense")

Joesitz (RIP) · Aug 23, 2003

registered (from p.4).

That is not a wrong ballet picture of Sasha's hands. If it is posed, it couild have been better. If it is from a snap shot while she was skating, we don't know the context of the position.

If we are comparing Sasha with Yokina, then, imo, Yokina is the better (with hands), but Sasha is far and away better than most figure skaters.

As to edging, Sasha could work on this basic. When she spirals or ina bauers, she is comfortable with the edges of the position, but when she pepares for a jump, it seems to me that the concentration goes and the jump is rushed. And while doing connecting steps, she has a tendency to rush. There is much too much emphasis on speed in figure skating. Leave that kind of speed to the speed skaters.

From watching her at Worlds, Sasha is not bigger than life as she is on TV. My statement has nothing to do with 'best' or 'medals' but how she appears in person.

I believe she is the best hope for the USA in 2006 for a gold medal, but there are a few things she has to work on. Let's see how she does this year - not at Campbells but in the GP. - Irina may have come out of the slump she was in last year, we don't know. I see Sasha way ahead of the others except for Yokina and Irina.

Joe

rtureck · Aug 23, 2003

Mathman said:
And finally, about criticism and bashing, I agree with Lucy and Dee:This is the price paid by everyone who aspires to be the very best.

Criticism is not the same as bashing. If someone say Miki Ando needs to work on her choreography, relating to audiences etc, that is criticism. Dismissing her as a jumping bean with no art is not quite criticism. Anyway, I am still in 7th heaven that Miki Ando made skating history as the first woman skater to land a quad SAL in competition. She achieves that without any hype, just business as usual. So I say, whatever..........

ouridol · Aug 23, 2003

I hope Sasha can pull out some clean skates for the new season

Though on the other hand, artistry always comes first for me. I would much rather her double a jump or double-foot a landing than land all the jumps and be uptight. I think this season might be hers!! It sounds like she is getting better and better with more confidence after each event, her improvement is amazing. GO SASHA!

mzheng · Aug 23, 2003

Just come back to post a comment made by my daughter which I think directly related to the title of this thread.

We were just review 2003's worlds tape. And in the fluffy piece about Sasha, she basically said the same thing, then my daughter came out 'She never did what she said. Even she never keeps her concentration!'. Did anyone read her lips at her beginning pose of SP she mumed to herself 'keep concentration'. Then she falled on the flip. From the camera angle I saw her landed on inside edge then slip off.

Excidra2001 · Aug 23, 2003

mzheng said:
Just come back to post a comment made by my daughter which I think directly related to the title of this thread.

We were just review 2003's worlds tape. And in the fluffy piece about Sasha, she basically said the same thing, then my daughter came out 'She never did what she said. Even she never keeps her concentration!'. Did anyone read her lips at her beginning pose of SP she mumed to herself 'keep concentration'. Then she falled on the flip. From the camera angle I saw her landed on inside edge then slip off.

I think your being a little too hard on Sasha, don't you think? So she lost concentration in the SP, is that a crime? People always plan to do something but sometimes fail in the end. I guess we can criticize many of the top elite skaters because they aim to keep full concentration at every competition but some mess up, there is nothing wrong with that, they are human after all.

Irina(even add top female skaters) maybe my favorite, but she she'll have her work cut out for her if she skates after a clean and inspiring Sasha. Yeah, she's that good.

swannanoa54 · Aug 23, 2003

Well, let me see here

I think IF Sasha applies what she has echoed other ladies' before as saying to her skating she will succeed in skating her best. Maybe she will be consistent, maybe she won't. Only Sasha, her skates, and the ice hold the answer to that question.

For me, there are things I like and don't like about all figure skaters. With Sasha, it's her flying camel spin that travels. It's all her rounded back position on her sit spin but that is because of the back injury she had. It's the little things that add up.

And sometimes it seems that after she makes a mistake, she can't shrug it off. I'd like to see that change. I'd love to see her shine in that ONE program that will truly showcase her. I'm not so sure that I would agree that Sasha is our best hope for gold in 2006. There are other eager young women snapping at her heels.

Excidra2001 · Aug 23, 2003

Re: Well, let me see here

realistic51 said:
I think IF Sasha applies what she has echoed other ladies' before as saying to her skating she will succeed in skating her best. Maybe she will be consistent, maybe she won't. Only Sasha, her skates, and the ice hold the answer to that question.

For me, there are things I like and don't like about all figure skaters. With Sasha, it's her flying camel spin that travels. It's all her rounded back position on her sit spin but that is because of the back injury she had. It's the little things that add up.

And sometimes it seems that after she makes a mistake, she can't shrug it off. I'd like to see that change. I'd love to see her shine in that ONE program that will truly showcase her. I'm not so sure that I would agree that Sasha is our best hope for gold in 2006. There are other eager young women snapping at her heels.

I some what agree with your post, But I don't agree with you here.

I'm not so sure that I would agree that Sasha is our best hope for gold in 2006. [/B]

I don't want to sound rude but that's ridiculous. Other then Kwan, who else in the states(currently competing) can actually beat a clean Sasha? AP is getting there but Sasha will skate circles around her if the going gets tough.Turin is soon coming up(two more seasons excluding the upcoming season) and as of right now Kwan and Cohen are USA's best hope for a world title this coming season and it will probably remain the same the season after next.

Mathman · Aug 23, 2003

I don't know about that, Excidra. A lot can happen in two years in the life of a skater of the age, say, of Beatrisa Liang.

Mathman

Excidra2001 · Aug 23, 2003

Mathman said:
I don't know about that, Excidra. A lot can happen in two years in the life of a skater of the age, say, of Beatrisa Liang.

Mathman

Couldn't agree more. But I have' been hearing about Laing for a while now and i'm still waiting to see what she can do. Since last season i've heard Ye bin mok is the one to watch and i've seen pics of her and i'm still waiting to see what she can do next season at NHK.

Kwan and Slutskaya were favorites to win the Olympic title and they've been competing against each other(only god knows how long :laugh:

). The same thing can be said of Tara and Michelle. Tara made her case(created buzz around her skating) for Olympic gold since 96. Do you see where i'm going with this. I don't think our next female Olympic champion will pop out of no where and take the title.
If Sasha keeps improving she'll be a favorite to win the Olympic gold.

mzheng · Aug 23, 2003

Excidra2001 said:
I think your being a little too hard on Sasha, don't you think? So she lost concentration in the SP, is that a crime? People always plan to do something but sometimes fail in the end. I guess we can criticize many of the top elite skaters because they aim to keep full concentration at every competition but some mess up, there is nothing wrong with that, they are human after all.

First I don't mean to be too hard on her. If I sound to. I just repeat what comments my daughter said about her and try to gave the fact.

My point actually same as you and one of poster in this thread mentioned early. It is one thing you want to, it is another thing if you can actually do it. The same with jump, concentration, etc.

The word she mumered before she started the SP was 'keep focus on' as if she kept remind herself.

I do enjoy her skating. She is mine second faverate US lady.

Joesitz (RIP) · Aug 23, 2003

Exidira - As you say about MK and IS being favorites and losing the Olys. I can also see SC, who is aleady a favorite to win the Oly losing to Beatrisa or Yokina. Could be. It's that two year stretch which will take skaters to another level of competing.

Joe

rtureck · Aug 23, 2003

It is nice to see Excidra here. Hey look at my avatar.

Irina has nice lovely fingers

http://www.annpatrice.com/fan8.jpg

AP is getting there but Sasha will skate circles around her if the going gets tough.

Actually at US nationals AP was a double axel away from making the world team, and that would leave Sasha home. Sasha may beat AP, but I won't say she skates circles around AP.

I too hope Sasha will be the favorite to win in 2006.

shine · Aug 24, 2003

Excidra- there's a girl in the U.S. by the name of Ye Bin Mok. She's already as good of a skater as Sasha if not a better one. She's a skater with no weaknesses. All she needs is more senior competition experience and consistency. A 3/3 combo wouldn't hurt either. And there's also Angela Nikodinov- if she's ever going to get it together one day, SHE would be skating circles around Cohen.

Sasha Cohen quote in IFS

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shine

shine

Mathman

fanforlady2001

rtureck

rtureck

Joesitz (RIP)

rtureck

ouridol

mzheng

Excidra2001

swannanoa54

Excidra2001

Mathman

Excidra2001

mzheng

Joesitz (RIP)

rtureck

shine

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