What puts the “sport” in the sport of figure skating? | Golden Skate

What puts the “sport” in the sport of figure skating?

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Just some idle musing…

Traditionally, the “sport” of figure skating comprised the tracing of school figures. To do this at the championship level required fine muscular/nervous/motor control that is beyond the physical abilities of all but a few superbly talented athletes. It took years of study to hone the proper techniques (edges, turns, etc.) required to participate in this sport.

Judges were not always unanimous, but at least the skaters were judged against an objective standard (the template of the perfect figure). The difference between a well-drawn figure and a sloppy one was obvious.

Alongside this “sporting” aspect of skating, in the 1870s Jackson Haines introduced the idea of “artistic” skating – performing for an audience. Haines was a former ballet dancer from New York. He traveled to Austria and introduced his ideas to Europe. Drawing on his background in ballet, Haines introduced such novelties as skating to music and punctuating his performance with various crowd-pleasing tricks (like the sit-spin, which he invented.) Dare-devil antics like barrel jumping were also included in early ice shows, as comic relief.

In the 1970s the ISU decided that no one was interested any more in the sport of figure skating. People did not want to watch it, and the skaters themselves were more caught up in the “show” aspect of the endeavor. Figure skating became exclusively “performing for an audience.” Nowadays, the skater wins who does the most dramatic and crowd-pleasing quads, the most contortionist spins, the most frenetic footwork, and who presents the best choreography, costume and emotion.

Is this sport? Or did we leave sport behind on the figures patch? :)
 

silver.blades

Medalist
Joined
Jan 4, 2007
Country
Canada
It's still a sport because skaters are still judged based mainly on an athletic standard. Without the difficult spins, jumps and footwork, the quality of the performance won't effect the result. Plus if archery, curling, motor cross and car racing are concidered sports, figure skating is much more athletic than any of those so if they're sports, so is figure skating.
 

~tapdancer

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
I think it's definitely sport still. I am amazed at the fitness of skaters. They are fine athletes and every time I see a skater take flight on the ice, it impresses me very much. Even the ice dancers thrill me. Actually ice dance is my favorite discipline and when I see them do their lifts, twizzles, turns and dance moves, I can only dream of being that fit!

Skating is beautiful, artistic and exciting. It's also very much a sport and I admire every athlete that straps on a pair of figure skates. They are just as committed and dedicated as anyone who ever dreamed of being stronger, faster or higher.
 

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 28, 2006
landing triples and quads takes just as much control, both mental and physical and figures. It is still a sport, as people like Brain Joubert and Sarah Hughes proved.
 

blue dog

Trixie Schuba's biggest fan!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Ok--this is how my friends found out that figure skating is a sport. I had never taken lessons (will start as an adult this summer yay), but one day at the rink my friends and I were skating during a public session, and one of my friends who considers himself a know-it-all (graduated with a degree in physics at UCSD) said figure skating is not a sport. So I challenged him to skate like a figure skater for the required 2 min and 50 seconds for a short program. With the same speed, edge control, etc--

Lord knows he barely made the 1 minute mark before calling figure skating a sport.

I think (completely my opinion) what makes it a sport is the fact that there is a contest attached to it. Baseball, softball, water polo, roller skating, gymnastics, figure skating, even ballet--at the root are athletic activities. By attaching a competition to it (someone will most likely correct me here), they become sports. Without the competition aspect, they are athletic activities. This is why an athletic activity like...bowling...is a sport, and ballet is not. Consequently, having a contest does not make an activity a sport (parliamentary debate and baking competitions are not sports, even if we have panels of five judges or more for final rounds).
 
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passion

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 17, 2005
Ok--this is how my friends found out that figure skating is a sport. I had never taken lessons (will start as an adult this summer yay), but one day at the rink my friends and I were skating during a public session, and one of my friends who considers himself a know-it-all (graduated with a degree in physics at UCSD) said figure skating is not a sport. So I challenged him to skate like a figure skater for the required 2 min and 50 seconds for a short program. With the same speed, edge control, etc--

Lord knows he barely made the 1 minute mark before calling figure skating a sport.

I think (completely my opinion) what makes it a sport is the fact that there is a contest attached to it. Baseball, softball, water polo, roller skating, gymnastics, figure skating, even ballet--at the root are athletic activities. By attaching a competition to it (someone will most likely correct me here), they become sports. Without the competition aspect, they are athletic activities. This is why an athletic activity like...bowling...is a sport, and ballet is not. Consequently, having a contest does not make an activity a sport (parliamentary debate and baking competitions are not sports, even if we have panels of five judges or more for final rounds).

According to what I'm hearing you say is that sport involves some type of athletic activity plus an associated competition/contest. If that's the case, then sometimes ballet is a sport and sometimes it's not depending on whether it's in the context of a ballet competition. Piano could also be a sport because it involves athleticism of the hands and fingers (both which require agility, coordination, and endurance) within the context of a music competition. I think sport involves some sort of formal organization where there are specific rules that define the athletic activity and also some sort of formal organization on a global or regional level such as a federation. I've always wondered how the IOC chooses what is deemed an Olympic sport and what is not. I believe one of their criteria is there has to be some sort of World championship for the particular activity. This is creating havoc internationally for women ski jumpers.

According to the way I see sport, figure skating will always be a sport because we have the formal organization on the international level and there are numerous countries with skating federations, and there are (too) many rules governing skating! I think sport involves more than athletic prowress and can involve varying degrees of that as in the case of doing figures, or doing quads and contortionist spins. Incidentally, fishing is called a sport and the only athleticism involved is reeling the line.
 
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summervie

Rinkside
Joined
Aug 5, 2007
I definitely can't think of any sport that is "more" sport than figure skating. The others are not even close in this regard.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
Whenever 2 people oppose one another with the expectation of one topping the other. That goes for 2 or More Teams as well. The word also covers any pastime outdoor activity such as fishing and hunting. Figure Skating when it was first attempted - the outdoor activity of past time When the Hollywood Ice Revue came to town indoors, there was frozen ice and all the tricks were performed.

Joe
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
A little OT, but if you are looking for a spring/summer sport to follow after the figure skating season is over, here is what Wikipedia has to say about the sport of kite-flying.

Developments in multi-line kites in recent years has allowed forms of kite flying to develop into a sport. Kite competitions have much in common with figure skating, with competitors being judged on their performance in compulsory figures as well as a “ballet”, which involves artistic interpretation of music.

Performances are done as individuals, a pair of pilots, or as a team. Team flying is typically the most spectacular, with up to eight pilots and stacked kites with tails flying within inches of each other and narrowly averting disaster, while performing all manner of figures and formations in the air.

Competitions are held nationally and internationally under the auspices of STACK (Sport Team and Competitive Kiting).

The 2008 World Champions are team Air-Rex, representing Japan. In the CoP of kite-flying they scored 73.81 in “Precision” and a whopping 87.24 in “Ballet.” Here are the World Championship results, from the web site of the team from Argentina, the Freaks. Alas, the Freak Team finished in eleventh place. My personal favorite, the Scratch Bunnies (UK) were fifth.

http://www.freaksteam.com/english/festivals/france-2008-world-championship.htm

And if that’s too tame, there are also “Fighting Kite” (patang-baazi) competitions (the hockey of the kite word. :laugh: ) This sport is most popular in India. The objective is to use the fiberglass string of your kite to cut the other kite’s string in the air. :rock:
 

Winnipeg

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
I think the definition of sport has become so broad, I don't see how FS could not be considered a sport..............look at some of the new sports at Olympics......equestrian, archery, shooting etc. It sure takes a lot of effort and physical endurance to complete a SP and/or LP - just look at the perspiration on the skaters faces in the K and C area.............
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I think figure skating competitions as usually organized -- emphasizing athleticism and technique, technical difficulty and technical quality -- are definitely sport. In this context, the artistic components of skating movement are at the service of the athletic and technical; the reason they're there is because it shows greater mastery of the technique to be able to perform moves with control and good form and with control of the rhythm of the movements to make them fit the rhythm of the music.

Skating can also be organized to emphasize the art/entertainment side, with the athletic and technical requirements subordinate to the ideas and feelings the skaters/choreographers want to communicate to the audience. Skating designed for shows, Theatre on Ice, even artistic competitions would fit under this performing arts rubric rather than a sports rubric.
 

fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
all long time ago, they use to define between a "sport" and a pasttime. i don't remember what it was because in the old days--golf, racecar driving, bicycling including tour de france was consider pasttimes. most of the what we call sports today was consider pasttime.
i don't know what it was though.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
Look no further than Ancient Greece. If the Spartans and Athenians had ice maybe it would be considered sport. Present day pugilism works.

Joe
 

fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
i think back then , figure skating was consider more of a
Show Sport, but a sport none the less. I think more recently it wasn't consider a sport by alot of the media especially in the so called only sports channels. like because they didn't watch it -consider because of its all female audience. The sports channels, sports radio stations consider it a joke not a sport. And it didn't help that some figure skaters acted like figure skating is a joke --the movie (blades of glory)only maded it more agreeable that figure skating is a joke not a sport.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
i think back then , figure skating was consider more of a
Show Sport, but a sport none the less. I think more recently it wasn't consider a sport by alot of the media especially in the so called only sports channels. like because they didn't watch it -consider because of its all female audience. The sports channels, sports radio stations consider it a joke not a sport. And it didn't help that some figure skaters acted like figure skating is a joke --the movie (blades of glory)only maded it more agreeable that figure skating is a joke not a sport.
Good post. That movie (blades of glory) confirmed in the minds of all who saw it (except skating fans,) that it should be a little girl's sport only. Skating fans got the elaborate joke, but the nonfans got a message, unfortunately.

Joe
 

blue dog

Trixie Schuba's biggest fan!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Good post. That movie (blades of glory) confirmed in the minds of all who saw it (except skating fans,) that it should be a little girl's sport only. Skating fans got the elaborate joke, but the nonfans got a message, unfortunately.

Joe

Not necessarily. Some nonfans at the rink by my house decided to try skating, because they found it interesting, and yes, perhaps easier than the usual sport after watching Blades of Glory. However, many of these nonfans quit immediately after learning that skating isn't as easy as they thought.

But, of course, if the nonfans truly got the message that this is just a girl's sport, then maybe that would drive up the interest with boys, since they will realize that they will have the opportunity to be around beautiful women, and not smelly men, when they're practicing and competing.

But back to the original topic--anything can be defined a sport, because according to the root of the word, sport (the old French word for leisure), anything we find leisurely can be termed sport. It doesn't have to be an Olympic sport for it to be a sport (baseball and softball were recently removed, IIRC). But perhaps the sport part comes from the crowd itself, rather than the skater. Everyone knows skating is athletic--however, the ability to bring a crowd to its feet through a perfect (now rare) performance makes this a sport. The ability of skating to bring an audience of 8,000 people together the way only a home run or Kerri Strug's vault in '96 is what makes it a sport.
 
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rochettefan

Rinkside
Joined
Nov 17, 2006
Figure skating is a sport. I think anyone that follows it would agree. We all know the kind of skill and strength it takes to complete triples and quads, do fast well centred spins and exciting footwork sequences. Figure skating takes a tremendous amount of technical ability that takes many years to develop and the ability to perform under extreme pressure. It is just you on that ice. How can that not be considered a sport? The fact that it is done to music merely makes the sport more pleasant but does not detract from the sports qualitites of it.

And this is coming from someone who likes many other more traditional sports such as football equally. I don't know how anyone can disagree that figure skating is a sport. It is the judging that is ruining figure skating's image to the general public. These are tremendous athletes, we all know it. The number of skaters who go through their lives never completing a clean program when it counts on the big stage is even more of a testiment to the nerves of steel that the top competitors possess. There is a special kind of excitement that proceeds the start of a new season that is different then with other sports and I always feel a void when the season is finished. I just wish it was on every weekend like other sports.
 

Mafke

Medalist
Joined
Mar 22, 2004
As I always say, figure skating is a sporting discipline. That means, it's not just faster, higher and more that counts but how you do it. You can have the ugliest form in the world in swimming or running or jumping, but as long as you don't actually break any rules and you cross the finish line first (or jump higher than anyone else) you win. It isn't (or shouldn't) be that way in skating.

The athletic component in skating has been defined differently at different times. Even in free skating there was a time when spins were far more valued than mere ... jumps.

Under 6.0 (from 1991 till 2004, the 1973-90 period functioned somewhat differently) the sport component of free skating couldn't be separated from anything else very easily, the whole program was supposed to be looked at holistically. A podium contender was supposed to have a certain amount of jumps and spins and footwork of a certain quality as well as a high quality of basic stroking and transitional movements, but there was also a big intangible (what the Italians call il fuoco sacro - the sacred fire). The elements had to be presented in time with the music and create a kind of harmony with it. Yes, you had to reach a certain level with athletic ability but that could only take you so far, the heights were reserved for those who could mold the athletic display into an aesthetic experience that had no exact counterpart anywhere else in sports.
You can argue that some individual elements of this kind of skating were neglected (and I'd agree) but it did produce most of the most memorable performances to date, awesome spectacles when the total was much greater than the sum of its parts and drove performers and audiences alike into altered states (Kwan's 2000 worlds lp, Yagudin's 2002 Euro sp, Arakawa's 2004 worlds lp etc etc etc).

At present, under CoP the 'sport' component is determined by abstract notions of 'difficulty'. In theory, a lutz is harder than a flip so it gets more points and never mind that in the highest levels of competition more elite skaters actually fall on the flip than the lutz (for a relatively recent example see SLC 2002 ladies lp).
A slow, travelly spin with lots of changes of position with 'features' is considered to be more difficult than a classic very fast well-centered spin so it gets more points and so on down the line. While individual elements are categorized in a most anal fashion, the holistic approach to the LP has been junked and memorable performances that stand out as wholes (as opposed to a lot of impressive tricks performed one after the other) are pretty much gone. On the other hand, and breaks that would destroy one's presentation mark under 6.0 don't really matter anymore (see Kostner at 2008 worlds) even major breaks due to catastrophic failures of technique don't really matter (Z/Z in Turin 2006, Asada in 2008 worlds) as long as the skaters haven't injured themselves out of the competition and can still rack up 'difficulty' points.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
As I always say, figure skating is a sporting discipline. That means, it's not just faster, higher and more that counts but how you do it.
I really like this distinction.

And I do think that Mafke's post zeros in on what's wrong with the CoP. Whatever you are rewarded for, that's what you will do. If the CoP gives 5.5 points for a flip and 5.0 points for a loop, skaters will do more flips and fewer loops. If you give a level three for a step sequence that "works the upper body," and only a level two for a sequence that leaves out the back-bobbing and flailing arms, all the skaters will do "level threes."

Yes, we saw uninteresting and badly performed programs under the old judging system, too. But I find myself more and more put off by the ISU's micromanagement of the content of everyone's program.
 
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