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Thread: The double Axel: is it the make or break point?

  1. #1
    it's olympic season :D bethissoawesome's Avatar
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    Question The double Axel: is it the make or break point?

    I was reading somewhere that the double axel is the make or break point if a skater can become competitive or not. Basically the argument was that to be able to do a double axel, as opposed to the other doubles and singles, is that the air time needed is about double-triple the amount of time of the jumps before and the minimum jump height to complete the double axel is also much higher. The end of the argument is that for some people (not speaking of adults... even just young skaters) will never physically be able to get the height or air time and that is the crushing point of competitive dreams. Does anyone know if there is truth to this?

    I'll link the article later if I can find it.

    EDIT: Here is the link. http://skatecoach.wordpress.com/2007...mp-statistics/
    Last edited by bethissoawesome; 07-07-2008 at 03:27 PM.

  2. #2
    Tripping on the Podium
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    You are 1/2 right. It is the make it or break it jump in a lot of ways. Mostly it is the make it or break it jump because you NEED it in order to pass certain tests (at least competitive tests in Canada). If you can't do it, you dont pass and therefore can't compete. Another thing is that people get frustrated and quit!!! I would say thats the biggest factor...frustration. I do know of people who got triples before they had a consistant double axel, BUT eventually they got that double axel. I've watched A LOT of skaters that I thought were decent coming up the ranks and then BOOM...they hit the point where the double axel was a must have, and they just couldn't get it and therefore ended up quitting after awile.

    QUOTE=bethissoawesome;324959]I was reading somewhere that the double axel is the make or break point if a skater can become competitive or not. Basically the argument was that to be able to do a double axel, as opposed to the other doubles and singles, is that the air time needed is about double-triple the amount of time of the jumps before and the minimum jump height to complete the double axel is also much higher. The end of the argument is that for some people (not speaking of adults... even just young skaters) will never physically be able to get the height or air time and that is the crushing point of competitive dreams. Does anyone know if there is truth to this?

    I'll link the article later if I can find it.[/QUOTE]

  3. #3
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    I think that what bethissoawesome read is generally correct. A kid of average ability who gets training in good technique and puts in the hours for enough years will be able to get double jumps and good basic skating. Average physical ability won't get you double axels or triples just on the strength of good training and hard work -- those jumps require certain kinds of natural physical ability well above average.

    Double axel is not required for any tests in the US testing system.

    It is a required element in the junior and senior short programs, though, so it is impossible to skate a clean short program at those levels if you don't have one. (Two triples are also required in the senior SP.)

    Double axel is not required in the novice SP, but there are enough skaters at that level who can do it, and/or at least one triple, that a skater who can't do any of the advanced jumps is unlikely to qualify for Nationals or in most cases for sectionals without them.

    That applies for singles skaters. Pair skaters might be able to last through junior level without the harder jumps. Ice dancers and synchronized skaters don't need double jumps at all, much less double axels and triples.

    For the most part the double axel does seem to be a barrier that separates the skaters who have hope of being nationally competitive in freestyle at novice level and above from those who either need to choose a different discipline or compete for their personal goals and satisfaction.

    It is true that some skaters do start landing one or more triples before they can land double axels cleanly and/or consistently, but that's less common than getting the double axel first. And even some who do get good double axels never get any triples.

  4. #4
    it's olympic season :D bethissoawesome's Avatar
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    Here is the link to the article. It's an interesting read.

    http://skatecoach.wordpress.com/2007...mp-statistics/

  5. #5
    Beliver in Sasha's Perfect Program Tinymavy15's Avatar
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    The general feeling here in southern CA is that there are 2 milestones. the axel and then the double axel. Once you get your axel and can land it in competition you have begun the USFSA circuit in ernest and are not just a "little beginner."

    The double axel milestones says "i am really serious about this sport." I guess this is because it is the easier required element for a senior lady and it is the base for all your triples.

  6. #6
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Check out this internet link:

    http://www.iceskating.org.uk/files/N...s%20Report.doc

    According to the National Ice Skating Association, the "ladies criterea for talent ID" a 13 year old should be able to do 4 of the 5 listed jumps:
    1. double Loop
    2. double Flip
    3. double Axel
    4. double Lutz-double Toe combination (or double Lutz-double Loop)
    5. double Axel-double Toe combination (or double Axel-double Loop)

    AND, be able to do a level 2 in the following elements:
    1. layback spin
    2. flying camel or flying sit spin
    3. step sequence, and
    4. spiral sequence.

  7. #7
    Figure Skater Music Editor singerskates's Avatar
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    What about the kid/teen that gets her triple Axel before any of her other triple jumps and/or a 99% consistant double Axel? I know one 13 year girl who got her triple Axel first and then went back to learn the easier triples afterwards. She'll be competing in Juniors this year even though she just took her Senior competitive test (don't know if she passed it as there are more than jumps to worry about on the test.). This girl/teen is a Canadian in WOS.

  8. #8
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    She's unusual.

    She obviously has the physical ability to do triples -- the fact that she got the hardest one first probably has more to do with her technique on the various jumps.

  9. #9
    Landing my axel..............again skatergirl45's Avatar
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    It is important but being able to land 5 doubles is an accomplishment in itself. You need the 2A to be competitive but it is not the make or break point as Trevor in beth's article guy said it was.(that is the same guy from skating jump secrets.............)
    So, you can have great success in skating, complete your tests, do synchro and dance and skate in some tours and have a great time with out a double axel. I do not think that i will ever get mine but it does not really matter. Skating is SO much bigger and more important than just one jump.
    Also, there is no real make or break point. I know some people who can't even do a single lutz. But they still love it and big jumps don't matter for them.
    For the competitive SINGLES non-test track skater the double axel is the break point. For everyone else below Novice or doing any one discipline, the 2A is not the breaking point.

  10. #10
    Custom Title antmanb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by princess-ice View Post
    Check out this internet link:

    http://www.iceskating.org.uk/files/N...s%20Report.doc

    According to the National Ice Skating Association, the "ladies criterea for talent ID" a 13 year old should be able to do 4 of the 5 listed jumps:
    1. double Loop
    2. double Flip
    3. double Axel
    4. double Lutz-double Toe combination (or double Lutz-double Loop)
    5. double Axel-double Toe combination (or double Axel-double Loop)

    AND, be able to do a level 2 in the following elements:
    1. layback spin
    2. flying camel or flying sit spin
    3. step sequence, and
    4. spiral sequence.
    Those are the NISA criteria for talent ID - they are put on the GB squad, as far as i know. As soon as the skater can no longer keep up with the talent criteria they are taken off the squad.

    Ant

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