View Poll Results: Should judges watch/be influenced by practices

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  • YES: They should take practice sessions into consideration when judging

    6 12.77%
  • YES: They should watch. But it should have no bearing on the judging

    25 53.19%
  • NO: They should not watch practice sessions

    13 27.66%
  • It doesn't matter one way or the other

    3 6.38%
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Thread: Should judges watch/be influenced by practices?

  1. #1
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    Should judges watch/be influenced by practices?

    Judges usually watch practices to get a feel for the skaters. There are some who say that judges are too influenced by these practice sessions-what do you think?

  2. #2
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    They should watch, but shouldn't have their marks influenced by them. Pratices are just practices.

  3. #3
    On the Ice
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    YES: They should watch. But it should have no bearing on the judging

  4. #4
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    I don't think they should watch the top tier skaters' practice. They already know how they skate so it doesn't make any sense for them to watch the practice. But they will anyway.

    For lower tier skaters (and there are many), I can understand them wanting some sort of familiarity.

    But the bottom line is how they skate THAT NIGHT.

    Joe

  5. #5
    Arm Chair Skate Fan show 42's Avatar
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    If the "body of work" of a particular skater is not to be taken into consideration by the judges, there is no need for them to watch the practices. To say it's okay to watch, but not let that influence their judging is like telling a panel of jurors to disregard inadmissable evidence during a trial.......42

  6. #6
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    I agree with Joe on this one. It all comes down to how a skater performs on a given night. For me, it doesn't seem that this is a major issue. If I were a judge I would want to see what everyone was doing. I would want to have some idea about what to expect from a field of 30. I remember reading that US judge Joe Inman attended practices and would close his eyes and imagine what he thought should be taking shape to such music...then during the competition he would judge the performance based on those thoughts versus how the skater actually performed. I think this is a novel and wonderful idea.

  7. #7
    Yep It's me!
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    They certainly should attend practices, most importantly at the highest levels. It is very difficult to watch, and evaluate at the same time. Judges use practices, to study a program, note where (they actually take notes) particular attention should be given during the actual competition (I.E. "don't have my head down writing after the triple lutz because a very difficult footwork sequence is next") and where there is just "filler" which would be a great time to jot down a couple notes. No, judges don't know all programs of the top competitors anymore than they have the programs memorized of every skater at their home rink.
    They probably don't catch alot of competitions (that they are not working) on TV. They're probably at a cold rink somewhere evaluating Gold tests at the time.



    When not at competitions, judges also attend regular practice sessions at various training centres on behave of their federation to give valuable feedback to coaches and skaters on what judges are looking for, and how any particular skaters programs are coming along. And to report back to the federation on their team members' progress.
    Last edited by Norlite; 08-24-2003 at 08:39 AM.

  8. #8
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    I agree completely with Norlite.

  9. #9
    Moving Forward
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    Originally posted by Norlite
    It is very difficult to watch, and evaluate at the same time. Judges use practices, to study a program, note where (they actually take notes) particular attention should be given during the actual competition (I.E. "don't have my head down writing after the triple lutz because a very difficult footwork sequence is next") and where there is just "filler" which would be a great time to jot down a couple notes.
    Thanks for this insight, I never really thought of this. It gives me a whole new perspective on this issue.

    Nan

  10. #10
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Sorry Norlite, have to disagree. Taking notes is even worse then just watching. example:

    Skater A is at practice and does a triple combo and it was noted by the watching judge. In the Long Program that night Skater A does a triple lutz and then either a popped up single toe or skipped the entire second part of the combo.

    That judged who watched the practice, and madea note of the triple combo, will consider this a grave error (unless, of course, he is a fan of the skater). Subjectively, he will not think that no error was committed. It was not that way at practice!

    It is the Free Skate, and the Skater A has the right to a triple lutz, single toe or a triple lutz alone.

    I'm sure you are thinking ideal situations but do they exist?

    Joe

  11. #11
    Yep It's me!
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    Originally posted by Joesitz
    I'm sure you are thinking ideal situations but do they exist?

    Joe
    It is standard practice and part of the judges responsibility at competitions. The event ref will ask why they were not at practice if they miss it.
    Last edited by Norlite; 08-24-2003 at 11:27 AM.

  12. #12
    Yep It's me!
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    Originally posted by Joesitz
    Skater A is at practice and does a triple combo and it was noted by the watching judge. In the Long Program that night Skater A does a triple lutz and then either a popped up single toe or skipped the entire second part of the combo.

    That judged who watched the practice, and madea note of the triple combo, will consider this a grave error (unless, of course, he is a fan of the skater). Subjectively, he will not think that no error was committed. It was not that way at practice!
    Even if for some reason they are not at the practice, now under COP, they will all been given a list of elements for each skater's program anyway, so they are going to know that the combo was missed. Plus, even now, without GOP, most federations hand out lists of their skaters elements in programs. It is not meant to be a secret.
    Last edited by Norlite; 08-24-2003 at 12:14 PM.

  13. #13
    On the Ice LilyBerg's Avatar
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    Results should be based on the performance the skater had at the event. At least I think so, it feels funny if judges bases a part off their results on the practice sessions. They cannot be as focused under all of the skaters sessions now and under the event now or can they?
    Because if they aren't the results ain't fair to the other skaters that are competing.

    /Lily

  14. #14
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    Just adding to Norlite's comments about the list of elements.

    The judges had a list of the skaters elements before they skated during 2003 Worlds. In fact, I was sitting with some photographers and a lady who had connections. She gave me a copy of the ladies free skate and who planned what in the program. Still have it in fact. It was very interesting to look through. Everyone pretty much had the same planned elements, just in different places. Michelle stood out as the only top tier skater with no 3/3 planned.

  15. #15
    Da' Spellin' Homegirl Grgranny's Avatar
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    I'll probably get into trouble for this. It always bothers me when a judge misses some of the program because he has to make notes. Why couldn't they have a little private microphone (no
    one else could hear) and make their voice notes and play them back in their own ear after the skater finishes?

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