Comments and Questions for Courchevel

Joesitz (RIP) · Aug 24, 2008

This is just in case my post gets bumped off The Edge:

My Questions and Comments for Courchevel

1,Will my favorite for the whole of Juniors - Michal Brezina (Czech) win it? or will America's Mahbanoozadeh rise to the occasion?

2. Will Kristine Musademba (US) do a clean skate? I do not know Bereswill, or the Canadians: McCulloch and Szmiett.

3. I really don't know these dancers except for the Sibutani's and I think they

dorispulaski · Aug 25, 2008

Joe, I think Becky Bereswill has a good chance to do very well here. Here's the two performances she did of this years programs at Liberty:

Becky Bereswill Liberty SP Carousal Waltz
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om6SElFHJN8

Becky Bereswill Liberty LP Nessun Dorma
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kR3iE8Lij0c

Musademba was there too. I liked Bereswill better, despite a tendency to try too hard to have nice hand positions-sort of over wrought.

Here's Musademba's programs for this year:

Kristin Musademba Sp Within
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNJYHtPkc5M

Kristin Musademba LP Queen of Sheba
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xvnRbJk2wg

I don't see anyone else in the ladies list of competitors that I recognize. But I'm not a huge fan of the ladies.

dorispulaski · Aug 25, 2008

On the men, I think it will definitely be won by Artur Gachinski from Russia , unless he defeats himself. Other than that, I expect Brezina second and
Eliot Halverson and Armin Mahbanoozadeh to fight it out for the bronze. Brezina has more style I think than Mahbanoozadeh. Neither had a triple axel in the spring, though.

On the ice dancers, I did a complete preview, with vids & photos, of the competitors in this folder. I think the top 6 will come from Ralph & Hill of Canada, the Shibutanis (USA), the 2 Russian couples, and Mysliveckova and Novak of Czech Republic (whom I love to pieces, but they have developed a habit of falling in competitions.

luckyguy · Aug 25, 2008

dorispulaski said:
.......
On the ice dancers, I did a complete preview, with vids & photos, of the competitors in this folder. I think the top 6 will come from Ralph & Hill of Canada, the Shibutanis (USA), the 2 Russian couples, and Mysliveckova and Novak of Czech Republic (whom I love to pieces, but they have developed a habit of falling in competitions.

The candidates for the podium are also Vykhodtseva/Shumski (Ukraine) and Findlay/Richaud (France).

C_T_T_ · Aug 25, 2008

I would also expect Yuki Nishino (Japan) to be one of the favourites. She won both her events last year, was 3rd at the JGPF and 5th at Junior Worlds.

dorispulaski · Aug 25, 2008

C_T_T_ said:
I would also expect Yuki Nishino (Japan) to be one of the favourites. She won both her events last year, was 3rd at the JGPF and 5th at Junior Worlds.

As I said, I don't follow the ladies very closely-from her bio, Nishino sounds very impressive!

luckyguy said:
The candidates for the podium are also Vykhodtseva/Shumski (Ukraine) and Findlay/Richaud (France).

Aren't FIndlay and Richaud a very new dance team? Wasn't Terra Findley a dancer & pair skater from Canada in a previous life, so to speak I looked at the youtube vid of their OD & FD, and frankly I don't see them medalling in this field unless they have improved a lot. They're a nice looking couple, but rather slow and with a lot of work to do on unison yet.

I haven't seen the team from Ukraine skate, but would expect them to do fairly well. Do you have a good link for them?

Joesitz (RIP) · Aug 25, 2008

dorispulaski said:
Joe, I think Becky Bereswill has a good chance to do very well here. Here's the two performances she did of this years programs at Liberty:

Becky Bereswill Liberty SP Carousal Waltz
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om6SElFHJN8

Becky Bereswill Liberty LP Nessun Dorma
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kR3iE8Lij0c

Musademba was there too. I liked Bereswill better, despite a tendency to try too hard to have nice hand positions-sort of over wrought.

Here's Musademba's programs for this year:

Kristin Musademba Sp Within
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNJYHtPkc5M

Kristin Musademba LP Queen of Sheba
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xvnRbJk2wg

I don't see anyone else in the ladies list of competitors that I recognize. But I'm not a huge fan of the ladies.

doris - Thanks for these links. I don't score early in the season, I just look for improvements and potential.

Musademba, I have been watching for a few years beginning in MidAtlantics. She is always worth watching because of her potential but she never seems to hit it off. Must say she did a beautiful Lutz take off in the SP but fell.

Bereswill, I did see before but where? She is a natural, perfect skating body, very musical and developing high tech tricks. If her coach knows what to do, I see her on the US podium within a few years.

luckyguy · Aug 25, 2008

dorispulaski said:
Aren't FIndlay and Richaud a very new dance team? Wasn't Terra Findley a dancer & pair skater from Canada in a previous life, so to speak I looked at the youtube vid of their OD & FD, and frankly I don't see them medalling in this field unless they have improved a lot. They're a nice looking couple, but rather slow and with a lot of work to do on unison yet.

I haven't seen the team from Ukraine skate, but would expect them to do fairly well. Do you have a good link for them?

FindlayRichaud are really a relatively new team, but Richaud was very good with his former partner Elodie Brouiller (they finished 7th at JrWorlds 2007). Vykhodtseva/Shumski were on the podium
at JGP Sofia last year.

The competitive history:

Findlay/Dougherty:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/planetepatinage/biographies/1_retraites/canada/findlay_dougherty.htm

Brouiller/Richaud:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/planetepatinage/biographies/1_retraites/france/brouiller_richaud.htm

Findlay/Richaud:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/planetepatinage/biographies/france/findlay_richaud.htm

Vykhodtseva/Shumski:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/planetepatinage/biographies/ukraine/vykhodtseva_shumski.htm

chuckm · Aug 25, 2008

Here are some scores for the Courchevel Ice Dance competitors. Some are a lot more recent than others, so take them all with a grain of salt and some common sense:

51.77 17.95 33.82 FNR JW '08 (30th) ASADCHAYA / LAMTYUGIN (BLR)
98.19 16.92 32.52 48.75 JGP CRO '07

132.62 28.18 41.95 62.49 Lake Placid '08 RALPH/HILL (CAN)
144.29 27.36 47.50 69.43 JW '08 (8th)

116.23 25.86 37.56 52.81 Lake Placid '08 VERMEULEN/DOLEMAN (CAN)
123.31 24.08 38.55 60.68 JGP GER '07 (9th)

122.02 22.12 39.89 60.01 JW '08 (19th) GUAN/WANG (CHN)

137.56 30.43 43.86 63.27 JW '08 (12th) MYSLIVECKOVA/NOVAK (CZE)
148.08 28.55 47.21 72.32 JGP GBR '07 (2nd)

117.05 23.14 38.48 55.43 JW '08 (23rd) KLIMOVA / PALOMAKI (FIN)

122.78 24.83 40.90 57.05 JW '08 (18th) GUIGNARD/PAULMIER (FRA)
123.00 25.16 41.32 56.52 JGP BUL '07 (9th)

113.91 21.47 36.25 56.19 JGP GBR '07 (14th) TUROCZI/MAJOR (HUN)
115.78 23.20 37.59 54.99 JGP ROU '07 (9th)

126.06 24.00 38.80 63.26 JGP EST '07 (7th) BATURINTSEVA/VOLOBUIEV (RUS)

144.86 27.58 47.86 69.42 JGP GBR '07 (5th) TCHETINKINA/SMIRNOV (RUS)
139.13 27.35 45.59 66.19 JGP AUT '07 (6th)

123.33 22.81 40.17 60.35 JW '08 (17th) VISNOVA/CSOLLEY (SVK)
126.74 23.76 41.23 61.75 JGP GER '07 (8th)

142.56 28.24 46.77 67.55 JGP BUL '07 (3rd) VYKHODTSEVA/SHUMSKI (UKR)
141.02 26.39 44.72 69.91 JGP AUT '07 (4th)

138.18 24.75 44.41 69.02 NRW '07 (4th Jr) YURCHENKO / LYUBCHENKO (UKR)

153.47 31.08 49.43 72.96 LK PLACID '08 SHIBUTANI/SHIBUTANI (USA)

119.19 26.87 38.06 54.26 LK PLACID '08 WOLF/AINSWORTH (USA)

NO COMPETITION SCORES AVAILABLE FOR:

FINDLAY / RICHAUD (FRA)
DIECK / ZENKNER (GER)

Based on available info, I'd say these are the competitive teams (in no particular order):

Ralph/Hill (CAN)
Mysliveckova/Novak (CZE)
Tchetinkina/Smirnov (RUS)
Vykhodtseva/Shumski (UKR)
Shibutani/Shibutani (USA)

samba · Aug 25, 2008

Before they split, Benoit Richaud and his former partner, Elodie Brouiller were 7th at JW'07.
Lucie Mysliveckova / Matej Novak did quite well at JW '08, was 6th at CD, then had unfortunate fall in OD and FD, ended up 12th. They are the team to watch this year.

chuckm · Aug 25, 2008

samba said:
Before they split, Benoit Richaud and his former partner, Elodie Brouiller were 7th at JW'07.

That isn't relevant to Richaud and his new partner, who was a former Pairs skater. This is her first try at ice dance and they are a brand-new team.

Lucie Mysliveckova / Matej Novak did quite well at JW '08, was 6th at CD, then had unfortunate fall in OD and FD, ended up 12th. They are the team to watch this year.

I agree that this is a talented couple, if they can overcome their tendency to fall, and they are A team to watch. I am not sure that they are THE team to watch, because there are quite a few others (Hubbells, Riazanova/Guerreiro, Agafonova/Dun, Ralph/Hill) who placed in the top 8 at JW '08 and look to be the top competitors.

Sylvia · Aug 25, 2008

Joesitz said:
Bereswill, I did see before but where?

Becky Bereswill finished 10th in her senior debut (and first-ever appearance) at 2008 Nationals in St. Paul -- she skated in the earlier Saturday morning FS group.

chuckm said:
That isn't relevant to Richaud and his new partner, who was a former Pairs skater. This is her first try at ice dance and they are a brand-new team.

According to luckyguy's link posted above, Terra Findlay/Liam Dougherty competed in Senior Dance at 2 Canadian Nationals in 2006 (8th) and 2007 (7th).

ETA link to ice-dance.com's Courchevel dance preview: http://www.ice-dance.com/events-results/previews/08jgpcourcheval.html

luckyguy · Aug 26, 2008

chuckm said:
NO COMPETITION SCORES AVAILABLE FOR:

FINDLAY / RICHAUD (FRA)
DIECK / ZENKNER (GER)

Findlay/Richaud
141.52 25.03 46.83 69.66 (France Jr Champ. 2008)

chuckm · Aug 26, 2008

luckyguy said:
Findlay/Richaud
141.52 25.03 46.83 69.66 (France Jr Champ. 2008)

I wouldn't include National championships, as the marks are inflated.

Look at these examples:

157.47 30.52 51.30 75.65 Hubbells, '08 JW (5th)
167.48 34.61 50.66 82.21 Hubbells, '08 US Nationals, Junior (1st)

153.47 31.08 49.43 72.96 Shibutanis, Lake Placid '08
157.80 27.66 52.32 77.82 Shibutanis, '08 US Nationals, Junior (4th)

dorispulaski · Aug 26, 2008

Well, what the National championship marks tell you is that the skater is unlikely to exceed that score, and will probably score well below it.

BTW, the US is not unusual in overscoring. They all do it.

chuckm · Aug 26, 2008

dorispulaski said:
Well, what the National championship marks tell you is that the skater is unlikely to exceed that score, and will probably score well below it.

BTW, the US is not unusual in overscoring. They all do it.

So true. That's why I prefer to ignore Nationals scoring, regardless of the source. It's tough enough to make comparisons using international data without muddying things further with bloated Nationals numbers.

ChrisH · Aug 26, 2008

C_T_T_ said:
I would also expect Yuki Nishino (Japan) to be one of the favourites. She won both her events last year, was 3rd at the JGPF and 5th at Junior Worlds.

ISU recognized personal bests of the ladies. Not a prediction.

149.42 Yuki NISHINO JPN JGPF
143.80 Kristine MUSADEMBA USA JGPF
130.59 Stefania BERTON ITA EC
119.63 Yuka ISHIKAWA JPN JGP
119.18 Miriam ZIEGLER AUT JGP
115.17 Alexandra ROUT NZL JGP
112.57 Isabel DRESCHER GER JGP
112.15 Julie CAGNON FRA WJC
108.18 Irina MOVCHAN UKR JGP
107.97 Bingwa GENG CHN WJC
103.86 Johanna ALLIK EST JGP
102.71 Diane SZMIETT CAN JGP
102.27 Anna WEINBERGER FRA JGP
93.56 Sigrid YOUNG TPE JGP
93.54 Manouk GIJSMAN NED JGP
91.64 Stasia RAGE LAT JGP
83.03 Mirna LIBRIC CRO JGP
80.19 Laurie LOUGSAMI BEL JGP
73.87 Victoria LIAKHAVA BLR JGP
72.37 Anita NAGY ROU JGP
67.10 Aida RYBALKO LTU JGP
Becky BERESWILL USA
Romy BÜHLER SUI
Susana CANTU MEX
Chelsea Rose CHIAPPA HUN
Dana Rut GUNNARSDOTTIR ISL
Alexandra KUNOVA SVK
Matleena LAAKSO FIN
Signe MAGNUSSEN DEN
Riley MCCULLOCH-CASARSA CAN
Mae Berenice MEITE FRA
Evgenia POCHUFAROVA RUS
Anine RABE NOR
Jasmina UZUNOVIC SRB
Sera VÄISTÖ FIN
Dinara VASFIEVA RUS
Yoniko WASHINGTON IND
Yea-Ji YUN KOR

Joesitz (RIP) · Aug 27, 2008

Scores from one year to the next will differ depending on how well the two skates are compared. Skaters do improve from year to year, imo. And with GPs and Worlds, one can sum up the pluses and get more realistic feeling for the skater's abilties. I just don't think using the last comp is the best way to sum up abilities. It should be cumulative, imo..

Sandra_persch · Aug 27, 2008

Joesitz said:
Scores from one year to the next will differ depending on how well the two skates are compared. Skaters do improve from year to year, imo. And with GPs and Worlds, one can sum up the pluses and get more realistic feeling for the skater's abilties. I just don't think using the last comp is the best way to sum up abilities. It should be cumulative, imo..

Yes we know that but it still maked for some very interestng statistics :biggrin:

Sylvia · Aug 27, 2008

And here are 2 scores from the Challenge Cup in the Hague (March 2008):

Becky BERESWILL USA (3rd, Senior) 127.08
Mae Berenice MEITE FRA (2nd, Novice) 101.50

Would someone like to compile a men's scores list?

Comments and Questions for Courchevel

Joesitz (RIP)

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

luckyguy

Match Penalty

C_T_T_

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Joesitz (RIP)

luckyguy

Match Penalty

chuckm

samba

chuckm

Sylvia

luckyguy

Match Penalty

chuckm

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

chuckm

ChrisH

Joesitz (RIP)

Sandra_persch

Sylvia

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