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Thread: The VP Candidate from Alaska

  1. #16
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    I think Medusa's list of quotes about Palin are fascinating.

    Most politicians will avoid the WMD cause of the Bush invasion and the subsequent notion that Hussein was dealing with Niger for plutonium. So many lies. By the standards of Nixon Bush was worse. It's honest Abe's quote "You can fool all of the people some of the time".

    and she did avoid anything about Bush, but speaks out for the right to arm. and take control of her grandchild?

    Joe Biden is looking so much better.

  2. #17
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Sex-ed in the public school system (or explicit sex-ed) means that abstinence is not taught and I'm not sure how it's taught in other school systems but here in Alaska you're not just taught 'safe sex' you're pretty much taught how to do it. I was 14 and basically got introduced to porn.

    I know that's probably not as shocking in other parts of the world, but it is a little much for here in the US (and I would think in Alaska, but maybe not lol).

    I live here in Alaska and she hasn't waged war on the sex ed in that we don't know what safe sex is. I agree that it needs to be taught and like others have said I'm one of those uber conservatives for the most part (I'm not sure I fit the evangelical right, but I guess I sorta fit). Where she's fought is to allow abstinence to be one of the parts of sex ed that's taught. When I was a freshman in high school (when you get 'true' sex ed up here) it wasn't an option. The teacher came out the first day and said each and everyone of us will have at least three sexual encounters by our high school graduation. And I guess I failed that.
    Abstinence was never a part of the equation until my parents fought to have me opt out of a 'manditory' video on sexual positions (no joke). I had to do a presentation on abstinence. It has been part of the curriculum since then (and I think the video is no longer used in her class).... it was just WAY too much for my 14 year old brain to deal with.

    I think so long as there is a balance it works... I know a lot who have just had one or the other (safe sex or abstinence) and they all end up pregnant or stuck with an STD anyway, so obviously it's not 100% effective on either side.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sillylionlove View Post
    She just makes voting for Obama more and more easier every day!!
    I have the same feeling. Even though I am too conservative, and didn't like the democrats' view about the same sex marrage at all, The Obama-Biden team looks a lot better, and more convincing.


    Quote Originally Posted by sillylionlove View Post
    The problem is that she promotes abstience (spelling???) and didn't want schools to have sex education. Well apparently she's not very convincing is she?
    I think that abstinence should go along with sex education.

    On the issue about the right to own guns, I really don't understand the Americans. A policy cannot rely on an ideal that everyone who own guns actually take the responsibilities. If the government have the gun control, the US will be a lot safer.
    Last edited by jennylovskt; 09-02-2008 at 10:57 PM.

  4. #19
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    funny thing, a lot of the "McCain - Palin" tshirts that are circulating have been... modified... up here. On the back "Go Sarah!" has been added
    Last edited by Tonichelle; 09-02-2008 at 11:02 PM.

  5. #20
    Forum translator Ptichka's Avatar
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    The whole thing about sex ed is tough. When it's taught too early, kids will sometimes actually develop problems as a result. I've talked to more than one little boy who started wondering if he was gay because he wasn't yet attracted to girls. Yes, I do think it's good to pass on the message that homosexuality is not "wrong", but it shouldn't quite go that far.

    And yes, I do agree that abstinence should be a part of the equation. What's more, it should go hand in hand with female empowerment. Sexual revolution was originally partly driven by liberation of women. Now, though, we see girls (and we are talking little girls, still in middle school - scares the heck out of me, frankly!) engage in various sexual activity. Don't tell me they do it because they really want to - they do it because they are too afraid not to do it for fear of not being the popular ones! The only way I see of fighting this is to promote self confidence and self reliance in girls. The only "talk" that has ever worked to make me delay certain activity was along that line - it came from a family friend who explained to me how attractive the girl "with restraint" is. (I unfortunately do not know of any effective way to promote abstinence among boys.)

    Having said all that, I still think it's very important to talk to kids about birth control and protection from STDs. Even for girls who will abstain from sex while in school, it doesn't hurt to know about the different types of hormonal birth control out there and how it works; this knowledge can come in handy when the time comes for the girl to discuss those options with her doctor.

  6. #21
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    completely agree, Ptichka!

    I am not for sex for teens. much less the 'sleeping around' thing that was and is promoted in those popular young adult shows (Friends, which I love that show, had Rachel own a revolving door... as did Joey... does that really teach SAFE sex even if they do use protection - though they did sort of work that in with Rachel and Ross having Emma but still!)... but at least let the kids know the options just incase they decide to ignore the advice and go their own way.

  7. #22
    Figure Skating Is A Dangerous Sport Dee4707's Avatar
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    This thread is a great read, thanks everyone for your comments. Toni, I was anxiously awaiting your views on the VP nominee.

    Dee

  8. #23
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Another Alaskan Another Voice

    This has been floating around the internet.

    From: Voicefixer
    To: Voicefixer
    BCC: GreeleyWalker
    Sent: 9/3/2008 1:20:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Just in case you need more information on this "candidate"


    This is from a Bryn Mawr college grad to her fellow alums :

    Dear classmates -

    As an Alaskan, I am writing to give all of you some information on Sarah
    Palin, Senator McCain's choice for VP. As an Alaska voter, I know more than
    most of you about her and, frankly, I am horrified that he picked her. The
    most accurate description of her is red neck. Her husband works in the oil
    fields of Prudhoe Bay and races snow mobiles. She is a life time member of
    the NRA and has worked tirelessly to allow indiscriminate hunting of
    wildlife in Alaska , particularly wolves and bears. She has spent millions
    of Alaska state dollars on aerial hunting of these predators from
    helicopters and airplanes, dollars that should have been spent, for
    example, on Alaska 's failing school system.We have the lowest rate of high
    school graduation in the country. Not all of you may think aerial predator
    hunting is so bad, but how anyone (other than Alaska wolf-haters, of which
    there are many, most without teeth), could think this use of funds is
    appropriate is beyond me. If you want to know more about the aerial hunting
    travesty, let me know and I will send some links to informative web sites.

    She has been a strong supporter of increased use of fossil fuels, yet the
    McCain campaign has the nerve to say she has "green" policies. The only
    thing green about Sarah Palin is her lack of experience. She has
    consistently supported drilling in ANWR, use of coal-burning power plants
    (as I write this, a new coal plant is being built in her home town of
    Wasilla ), strip mining, and almost anything else that will unnecessarily
    exploit the diminishing resources of Alaska and destroy its environment.

    Prior to her one year as governor of Alaska , she was mayor of Wasilla, a
    small red neck town outside Anchorage.The average maximum education level
    of parents of junior high school kids in Wasilla is 10th grade.
    Unfortunately, I have to go to Wasilla every week to get groceries and
    other supplies, so I have continual contact with the people who put Palin
    in office in the first place. I know what I'm talking about. These people
    don't have a concept of the world around them or of the serious issues
    facing the US . Furthermore, they don't care. So long as they can go out
    and hunt their moose every fall, kill wolves and bears and drive their snow
    mobiles and ATVs through every corner of the wilderness, they're happy. I
    wish I were exaggerating.

    Sarah Palin is currently involved in a political corruption scandal. She
    fired an individual in law enforcement here because she didn't like how he
    treated one of her relatives during a divorce. The man's performance and
    ability weren't considered; it was a totally personal firing and is
    currently under investigation. While the issue isn't close to the scandal
    of Ted Steven's corruption, it shows that Palin isn't "squeaky clean" and
    causes me to think there may be more issues that could come to light.
    Clearly McCain doesn't care.

    When you line Palin up with Biden, the comparison would be laughable if it
    weren't so serious. Sarah Palin knows nothing of economics (admittedly a
    weak area for McCain), or of international affairs, knows nothing of
    national government, Social Security, unemployment, health care systems -
    you name it. The idea of her meeting with heads of foreign governments
    around the world truly frightens me.

    In an increasingly dangerous world, with the economy in shambles in the US,
    Sarah Palin is uniquely UNqualified to be vice president. John McCain is
    not a young man. Should something happen to him such that the vice
    president had to step in, it would destroy our country and possibly the
    world to have someone as inexperienced and inappropriate as Sarah Palin.
    The choice of Palin is a cheap shot by McCain to try to get Hillary
    supporters to vote for him. when McCain introduced her today, Palin had the
    nerve to compare herself with Hillary and Geraldine Ferraro. Sarah Palin,
    you are no Hillary Clinton.

    To those of you who, like me, supported Hillary and were upset that she did
    not get the nomination, please don't think that Sarah Palin is a worthy
    substitute. If you supported Hillary, regardless of what you think the
    media and the democratic party may have done to undermine her campaign, the
    person to support now is Obama, not Sarah Palin. To those of you who are
    independent or undecided, don't let the choice of Palin sway you in favor
    of McCain. Choosing her shows how unqualified McCain is to be president. To
    those of you who are conservative, I guess you have no choice for
    president. But please try to see how the poor choice of Palin tells us a
    great deal about McCain's judgment.

    While the political posturing inherent in the choice of Palin is obvious,
    the more serious issue is the fact that the VP is, literally, a heartbeat
    away from the presidency. Sarah Palin is totally and unequivocally
    unqualified to be vice president, let alone president. I know this is a
    lengthy and emotional email, but the stakes are high. I thought it might
    help for all of you, regardless of political affiliation, to know something
    about Palin from someone who has to live with her administration in Alaska
    on a daily basis.

    Here's some basic background from MoveOn.org:

    * She was elected Alaska 's governor a little over a year and a half ago.
    Her previous office was mayor of Wasilla, a small town outside Anchorage.
    * Palin is strongly anti-choice, opposing abortion even in the case of
    rape or incest.
    * She supported right-wing extremist Pat Buchanan for president in 2000.
    * Palin thinks creationism should be taught in public schools.
    * She's doesn't think humans are the cause of climate change.
    * She's solidly in line with John McCain's "Big Oil first" energy policy.
    She's pushed hard for more oil drilling and says renewables won't be ready
    for years. She also sued the Bush administration for listing polar bears as
    an endangered species she was worried it would interfere with more oil
    drilling in Alaska.

  9. #24
    Figure Skating Is A Dangerous Sport Dee4707's Avatar
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    When I heard the news of the McCain - Palin ticket, my immediate thought was.......what a ploy!!

    I think the below quote is just a put down to women in general.

    The choice of Palin is a cheap shot by McCain to try to get Hillary
    supporters to vote for him. when McCain introduced her today, Palin had the
    nerve to compare herself with Hillary and Geraldine Ferraro. Sarah Palin,
    you are no Hillary Clinton.
    Dee
    Last edited by Dee4707; 09-04-2008 at 10:53 AM.

  10. #25
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee4707 View Post
    When I heard the news of the McCain - Palin ticket, my immediate thought was.......what a ploy!!

    I think this is just a put down to women in general.

    Dee
    Hardly. It's very clear that John McCain wanted to make a splash at his convention. His campaign has been unable to generate any excitement among the conservative base of the Republican party, and worse, the media, while it generally likes him pretty well, has found his campaign so boring that he is unable to get coverage. His preferred method of making a splash, we are told, is to go with a bipartisan ticket, in this case with Joe Lieberman. I can believe this of McCain, but I simply cannot see the Republicans going with it in any case. Joe is hugely prowar, and he is in agreement with McCain on energy policy, but he has had an 100% rating (or close to it) from NARAL and PP for years and years. Obviously, he is not a choice that is going to excite the Republican base.

    McCain's personal area of crusade has always been cutting pork (which is why he voted against the Cheney Energy Bill for example), being one of the very few Republicans who believes in global warming, and put together a bill with Lieberman to combat it, and trying to make government less corrupt (which is why he collaborated with Russ Feingold (D) on the McCain Feingold election laws. He cherishes the 'maverick' image he gets for this activity. However, the Obama forces have been trying to sell him as 4 more years of Bush. Palin is known for vetoing pork in 300 cases and for doing some hard negotiations with energy companies. Her views (except on the cause of global warming) fit in with McCain's.

    But most important, she is not a Washington insider and had no connections to Abramov, DeLay or Gonzales or any of the Bush scandals. And if you think about it, there are very, very, very few Republicans that meet those requirements.

    And she's young and relatively unknown outside of political afficianadoes--of course the media will show interest, something the campaign has not been able to generate.

    I'm sure McCain would love to have ex-Hillary supporters, particularly amongst Republicans and Independents, to vote for him, but I truly doubt that he expects it.

    And I fail totally to see how choosing a woman is an insult to women. That is a huge crock to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz View Post
    This has been floating around the internet.
    And therefore you should take it with a grain of salt, like all of these internet screeds and letters from Nigeria that I receive daily.


    From: Voicefixer
    To: Voicefixer
    BCC: GreeleyWalker
    Sent: 9/3/2008 1:20:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
    Subj: Just in case you need more information on this "candidate"


    This is from a Bryn Mawr college grad to her fellow alums :
    However, she is unwilling to sign her name to it. Therefore I distrust it's accuracy at once, much as I approach the letter from the gentleman from Nigeria



    Dear classmates -

    As an Alaskan, I am writing to give all of you some information on Sarah
    Palin, Senator McCain's choice for VP. As an Alaska voter, I know more than
    most of you about her and, frankly, I am horrified that he picked her. The
    most accurate description of her is red neck. Her husband works in the oil
    fields of Prudhoe Bay and races snow mobiles. She is a life time member of
    the NRA .
    Elitist much? Not to mention, using the class slur "Redneck". Perhaps this is from a Republican trying to undermine Democratic support /snark/ . Republicans are usually much more savvy about this. But if it's from a Democrat, it is also shaping up to be a huge FAIL.

    and has worked tirelessly to allow indiscriminate hunting of
    wildlife in Alaska , particularly wolves and bears. She has spent millions
    of Alaska state dollars on aerial hunting of these predators from
    helicopters and airplanes, dollars that should have been spent, for
    example, on Alaska 's failing school system.
    I don't know how much she spent on it, but this program has been going for a long time.

    http://www.adn.com/news/alaska/wildl...ry/410461.html

    This article from the Anchorage Daily News is about the wolf hunt in 2008. The hunt has been going on since 1994 at least and is a method of saving caribou and moose populations. The amount shot is determined by state biologists, just as the amount and size of striped bass taken here in CT is, and for the same reasons--to balance the needs for predators and prey when they share environmental space with humans.

    The program runs as long as conditions allow or until state biologists decide wolf-kill quotas have been met. The kill has been low this year because of a March that lacked the fresh snow and good light needed for optimum hunting conditions.

    The exact number of moose or caribou saved by thinning wolf populations is hard to determine. Fish and Game's ungulate survival calculations are based on an average consumption of approximately 12 moose or 24 caribou per wolf per year.
    We have the lowest rate of high school graduation in the country.
    Alaska's educational system is not great. It ranks 44th to 46th in the country. However, it's position precedes Palin's governorship.

    She has been a strong supporter of increased use of fossil fuels, yet the
    McCain campaign has the nerve to say she has "green" policies...
    .

    Well you could say the McCain campaign has nerve, but then the Obama campaign has nerve, too. One of Palin's main achievements has been negotiating with Exxon and Canada over a natural gas pipeline to the US. Before her nomination, Obama was praising this activity. For those that are watching, it also demonstrates the

    http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache...lnk&cd=1&gl=us

    Anchorage Daily News again

    http://www.adn.com/news/alaska/story/486170.html
    Story:

    Obama included the project in the energy plan he announced this week, calling for working "with the Canadian government to finally build the Alaska natural gas pipeline, delivering clean natural gas and creating good jobs in the process."

    That brought the Democrat kudos from Gov. Sarah Palin, who some pundits are pushing as a possible vice presidential running mate for Republican John McCain.

    Two of Obama's top advisers repeated the theme in a teleconference with Alaska reporters Wednesday. They said Obama would encourage a federal partnership with Alaska to further the project and try to prevent Exxon Mobil from having a "disproportionate influence over the timetable over the construction of this pipeline,"

    http://www.politicalforum.com/electi...ses-palin.html




    Prior to her one year as governor of Alaska , she was mayor of Wasilla, a
    small red neck town outside Anchorage.The average maximum education level
    of parents of junior high school kids in Wasilla is 10th grade.
    Unfortunately, I have to go to Wasilla every week to get groceries and
    other supplies, so I have continual contact with the people who put Palin
    in office in the first place. I know what I'm talking about. These people
    don't have a concept of the world around them or of the serious issues
    facing the US . Furthermore, they don't care. So long as they can go out
    and hunt their moose every fall, kill wolves and bears and drive their snow
    mobiles and ATVs through every corner of the wilderness, they're happy. I
    wish I were exaggerating.
    No, it's almost 2 years. But this person can't even tell the truth about this. Plus the word elitist does not suffice to cover this example of intellectual snobbery and stupidity. I'm speechless. I'd like to know why this Bryn Mawr alumni didn't stay in the lower 48 and not move to a town that must be smaller than Wasilla since she has to go to Wasilla for groceries.


    Sarah Palin is currently involved in a political corruption scandal.
    I hope Toni will speak to this--there's so much crap on the Internet, it's hard to scope out the truth on this.

    When you line Palin up with Biden, the comparison would be laughable if it
    weren't so serious. Sarah Palin knows nothing of economics (admittedly a
    weak area for McCain), or of international affairs,
    Well, McCain knows plenty about international affairs. However, Palin did negotiate the pipeline with Canada. It would be nice if we had a candidate that actually knew how to deal with our closest neighbor, and the source of most of our energy, both oil, and here in New England, from Hydro Quebec, not to mention most of the nuclear fuel that we are not generating from recycling Russian bombs. I'm happy that Palin knows energy and Canada.

    knows nothing of
    national government, Social Security, unemployment, health care systems -
    you name it.
    Trust me, you can't be the governor of a diverse rural state without knowing about the problems of Social Security, unemployment & health care. I doubt Biden knows as much, since his areas of expertise are judiciary & foreign policy and he never worked in industry or State government, having been a Senator since he was 30 and a lawyer before that.

    The idea of her meeting with heads of foreign governments
    around the world truly frightens me.
    It shouldn't. When I think of Merkel putting up with Bush's back rubs and Putin putting up with being called Pooty Poot, I would think she'd be an improvement for them.

    In an increasingly dangerous world, with the economy in shambles in the US,
    Sarah Palin is uniquely UNqualified to be vice president. John McCain is
    not a young man. Should something happen to him such that the vice
    president had to step in, it would destroy our country and possibly the
    world to have someone as inexperienced and inappropriate as Sarah Palin.
    which is why it's even more questionable to have Obama in the higher office of president. Are you sure this wasn't written by a Republican?

    The choice of Palin is a cheap shot by McCain to try to get Hillary
    supporters to vote for him. when McCain introduced her today, Palin had the
    nerve to compare herself with Hillary and Geraldine Ferraro. Sarah Palin,
    you are no Hillary Clinton.
    Well, no. It's a shot to shore up the base.

    Here's some basic background from MoveOn.org:
    Which has how many Alaskan members??? Why is moveon an expert on Alaska? BS.

    Going through these one at a time:

    However, this is almost true, but contradicts the assertion at the top of the letter.

    * She was elected Alaska 's governor a little over a year and a half ago.
    Her previous office was mayor of Wasilla, a small town outside Anchorage.


    This is true. She is only for abortion if the mother is in dire risk of losing her life.
    * Palin is strongly anti-choice, opposing abortion even in the case of
    rape or incest.


    This is BS. She was the head of the Alaska campaign of Steve Forbes, not Pat Buchanan.

    * She supported right-wing extremist Pat Buchanan for president in 2000.

    Toni should speak to this one. I believe that Palin's position is that parents should have input into what is taught in schools and that if they want creationism taught along side Biology, they should have that option. I don't agree.

    * Palin thinks creationism should be taught in public schools.


    I think she has said this, but she does believe in not adding to climate change, and she believes in energy independence. However, I imagine we will hear more of this in her speech tonight.

    * She's doesn't think humans are the cause of climate change.

    This is laughable. This is not John McCain's energy policy. John McCain thinks, last I heard, that we need to drill for oil, pipe natural gas, build lots of nuclear reactors and support wind and solar. McCain voted against Cheney's Energy Bill, because of the huge pork in it to big oil. BTW, Obama voted for it. You can check it on votesmart.org It was Bush & Cheney who are Big Oil first. And Obama is very questionable, and is all too friendly to coal interests, via Lehman brothers, majority owners of Peabody Energy, the nation's largest coal company.

    * She's solidly in line with John McCain's "Big Oil first" energy policy.

    She's pushed hard for more oil drilling and says renewables won't be ready for years.
    She is absolutely right on this one. For one thing, the entire electric grid is totally unable to deal with more than about 15% from erratic sources like wind and solar. That's before you get into the scarcity of materials for solar panels, the low energy density of sunlight so that you have to kill states worth of ground and desert environments to make it a major source. And the storage issue is totally huge. There. Is. No. Absolutely No. Storage. On. The Grid. Wind is better, but the best you can do with wind is 15% or so, due to wind's intermittent nature, transmission line losses, etc.

    She also sued the Bush administration for listing polar bears as
    an endangered species she was worried it would interfere with more oil
    drilling in Alaska.
    I think this one is true.

    & so forth. The Democrats must be terrified of her to waste so much time sending letters about a VP candidate.

    I'm sure Snopes will have a field day with this one.
    Last edited by dorispulaski; 09-03-2008 at 07:16 PM.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post

    This is BS. She was the head of the Alaska campaign of Steve Forbes, not Pat Buchanan.

    * She supported right-wing extremist Pat Buchanan for president in 2000.
    Somebody needs to tell Pat Buchanan He's been singing her praises all over the airwaves for her support of him starting in 1992 after his speech in Houston, claiming she joined the "pitchfork brigade."

    I realize she was definitely a Forbes director in 2000, when Buchanan ran on the Reform ticket. But I don't think she's "officially" listed for either Forbes or Buchanan in 1996, when both tried for the GOP nomination. So depending on whether she does or does not wish to be associated with Buchanan, she might want to issue her own statement on the issue.

    Susan

  12. #27
    Forum translator Ptichka's Avatar
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    Doris, thank you so much for that breakdown of the anti-Palin allegations!

  13. #28
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by decker View Post
    Somebody needs to tell Pat Buchanan He's been singing her praises all over the airwaves for her support of him starting in 1992 after his speech in Houston, claiming she joined the "pitchfork brigade."

    I realize she was definitely a Forbes director in 2000, when Buchanan ran on the Reform ticket. But I don't think she's "officially" listed for either Forbes or Buchanan in 1996, when both tried for the GOP nomination. So depending on whether she does or does not wish to be associated with Buchanan, she might want to issue her own statement on the issue.

    Susan
    Forbes was on CNBC (Kudlow's show) when Kudlow was airing clips from 2 interviews that he did with Palin in July. He had Steve Forbes on there. He seemed mightily amused at anyone suggesting Palin supported Buchanan as she was his director and he apparently knows her well.

    However, other than his racist side, about 1/2 of what Pat Buchanan says actually seems to make sense to me these days==he hates Bush more than I do, I think. It's a case of the far right wrapping around so far that it begins to look like the far left.

    As a rather far leftie ( ACLU supporter ), I can't stand to see people vilified for stuff that isn't true, especially when there are plenty of true things to hold them accountable for. So here I am, standing up for Palin because I can't take teh lies, basically.
    Last edited by dorispulaski; 09-03-2008 at 07:14 PM.

  14. #29
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    However, other than his racist side, about 1/2 of what Pat Buchanan says actually seems to make sense to me these days==he hates Bush more than I do, I think. It's a case of the far right wrapping around so far that it begins to look like the far left.

    As a rather far leftie ( ACLU supporter ), I can't stand to see people vilified for stuff that isn't true, especially when there are plenty of true things to hold them accountable for. So here I am, standing up for Palin because I can't take teh lies, basically.
    I am nearly too scared to ask but: Which half of what Pat Buchanan says makes sense to you? After reading through his Wikipage and some Blog-entries I found like one thing that made sense to me (Iraq-war-issue). If half of what Buchanan says makes sense - than at least half of what Franco (also insert: Hitler, Stalin, Salazar, Mussolini...) said made sense too.

    And about the supporting Buchanan thing - the internet is flooded with all kinds of shady and unfounded information by the way - this is the best I could find: http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=U9rZkJfKoEU.

    I don't really think that you spent much time pointing out the lies in the text about Palin, you mostly accused the author of elitism, said that the problems in Alaska existed before Palin arrived, had some points about energy, wildlife and that's about it. I have to admit, the text is certainly crudely written, it mostly lacks substantial evidence and it is void of any kind of rhetoric. But your statement lacks some evidence too.

    I'm happy that Palin knows energy and Canada.
    She negotiated a pipeline - does that really mean that she knows Canada and energy? Does it mean that she knows how to deal with Canada? That would be like saying "Obama had an audience of 200 000 people in Berlin - oh, he knows how to deal with Germany / Europe".

    Trust me, you can't be the governor of a diverse rural state without knowing about the problems of Social Security, unemployment & health care.
    That's your reasoning - Trust me? Even if you were a governor (perhaps you are) I wouldn't accept that as an argument, because it's always possible that you are an exceptional governor and Palin isn't. And just because someone knows about those problems - it doesn't mean that the person has actually done something against it - or has an idea about these problems outside of Alaska.
    It shouldn't. When I think of Merkel putting up with Bush's back rubs and Putin putting up with being called Pooty Poot, I would think she'd be an improvement for them.
    Yeah well, perhaps we want more than just an improvement.
    Last edited by Medusa; 09-03-2008 at 09:44 PM.

  15. #30
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    I am nearly too scared to ask but: Which half of what Pat Buchanan says makes sense to you? After reading through his Wikipage and some Blog-entries I found like one thing that made sense to me (Iraq-war-issue). If half of what Buchanan says makes sense - than at least half of what Franco (also insert: Hitler, Stalin, Salazar, Mussolini...) said made sense too.
    The part about staying out of Iraq and what an incompetent f-up Bush is. For quite a while, that has constituted about 1/2 of what he talked about.


    I don't really think that you spent much time pointing out the lies in the text about Palin, you mostly accused the author of elitism, said that the problems in Alaska existed before Palin arrived, had some points about energy, wildlife and that's about it. I have to admit, the text is certainly crudely written, it mostly lacks substantial evidence and it is void of any kind of rhetoric. But your statement lacks some evidence too.
    which statement? I didn't just accuse the author of elitism. The author demonstrated it all on her own.

    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/elitism

    Elitism was a word first added to M/W dictionary in 1947.

    1: leadership or rule by an elite
    2: the selectivity of the elite; especially : SNOBBERY <elitism in choosing new members>
    3: consciousness of being or belonging to an elite
    Elitism covers a wide range of snobberies, including snobbery due to wealth, intellectual snobbery where a person believes their training, education, or general mental prowess makes them a member of an elite class and thus entitled to look down on others.

    The author considers herself vastly superior to the inhabitants of Wasilla because she is a member of the class of Bryn Mawr graduates and neither fishes, hunts nor owns a snowmobile (if in fact there is any author. Since the work is not signed, I imagine it is a typical internet broadside distributed to influence the credulous, a tactic used by all parties) So she fits the definition.

    She negotiated a pipeline - does that really mean that she knows Canada and energy? Does it mean that she knows how to deal with Canada? That would be like saying "Obama had an audience of 200 000 people in Berlin - oh, he knows how to deal with Germany / Europe".
    No it wouldn't. When Obama finished being cheered by the Germans, there was nothing left but the words in the newspapers. Nothing had been negotiated, nor had changed. A pipeline is a solid accomplishment. Whether she can do stuff like that again, we shall see. However, George Bush did not know the name of the prime minister of Canada before he took office. And total ignorance of Canada is not unusual among Americans and American politicians. I'm glad she has some experience. No she's not Madelyn Albright. And I'm not saying she is.

    Energy she actually knows something about, at least the regulatory and business side. She chaired the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission from 2003 to 2004. No she is not the CEO of Exxon.



    That's your reasoning - Trust me? Even if you were a governor (perhaps you are) I wouldn't accept that as an argument, because it's always possible that you are an exceptional governor and Palin isn't. And just because someone knows about those problems - it doesn't mean that the person has actually done something against it - or has an idea about these problems outside of Alaska.

    Yeah well, perhaps we want more than just an improvement.
    I'm not a governor. "Trust me" was a throwaway rhetorical device. I don't expect you to trust me in real life. I do, however, sign my real name to what I write, unlike the author of this screed. However, if you ever read the region section of your state newspaper, you will read endless articles about the governor and what he/she does.

    One of the largest tasks of the governor is the state budget. Huge line items in that budget are Medicaid (or what passes for it in your state) and unemployment compensation. I do not see how a governor could have gone through a single year and not know the budgetary process and some of the details behind the largest line items.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/...n4413727.shtml

    There may be fewer than 700,000 people in Alaska's wide open spaces, but the state budget is more than $12 billion, and there are nearly 25,000 state employees. Many Alaskans don't want to hear that being their governor is no big deal.

    "We got big issues up here," Moore said. "Gas pipeline is huge, of national importance."
    Particularly with a 12 billion $ plus budget.

    However, I have met 3 governors and know one more than cursorily. VT is a small state and because it is all town meetings and retail politics, you get to know quite a bit about them and what they do, even if you don't meet any of them. If you volunteer for a campaign (and I have) you meet a lot of people.
    However, there is little going on in VT and the small doings of state business are the stuff of daily news & conversation. I lived there for 22 years. I lived in NY for 12 years and wouldn't have a clue what the governor did there (other than chase prostitutes, because that makes the paper) and never met a governor, let alone knew one. However, Alaska is much more similar to VT except that it actually has a couple of real cities whereas VT has no real cities, Burlington it's largest has less than 50,000 people last I knew.

    A typical VT article about the Vt governor struggling with a budget.
    http://www.benningtonbanner.com/ci_1...e=most_emailed

    In fact, dealing with a budget and being responsible for it is one of the reasons that governors are generally credited with more executive experience than Congressfolk. (This is not true, sadly, of TX, which has a week governor form of government.)

    In any case, I probably will not vote for McCain/Palin, but I think a day or 2 to let the woman speak for herself might be a good thing. In any case, she's running fo VP, not president.

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