Page 3 of 8 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 116

Thread: The VP Candidate from Alaska

  1. #31
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,752
    However, if you ever read the region section of your state newspaper, you will read endless articles about the governor and what he/she does.
    Eurotrash here. We actually have states in my country - but it's a different system and I don't think that our state-leaders have that much to say concerning the overall budget.

    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    No it wouldn't. When Obama finished being cheered by the Germans, there was nothing left but the words in the newspapers. Nothing had been negotiated, nor had changed. A pipeline is a solid accomplishment. Whether she can do stuff like that again, we shall see. However, George Bush did not know the name of the prime minister of Canada before he took office. And total ignorance of Canada is not unusual among Americans and American politicians. I'm glad she has some experience. No she's not Madelyn Albright. And I'm not saying she is.
    Hmm, actually there was something left. The irrational hopes by lots of Europeans that there might come a change in the transatlantic relations. But on the one hand I somehow don't believe anymore that Obama will win this - and even if he does, I think that we put way too much hope into him. We often misunderstand your politics - people often think your system is the same as ours, but that's not true. Bush, McCain and Palin make guys like Merkel, Cameron and Sarkozy look like a bunch of big ol' lefties.

    In fact, dealing with a budget and being responsible for it is one of the reasons that governors are generally credited with more executive experience than Congressfolk.
    And I think that is a valid point. Then again, what are advisors for? It would be interesting to review the past presidents - were former governors and mayors more successful and more popular?

  2. #32
    The burr up Speedy's Butt! visaliakid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Central California
    Posts
    438
    I wish to congratulate Barack Obama on becoming the first ever African-American nominee for the U.S. Presidency. With that being said, I cannot vote for this elitest, egotistic empty suit.

  3. #33
    Custom Title Tigger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    100 Acre Wood
    Posts
    782
    You know what bothered me about her speech tonight?

    The continual digs at someone who had been a Community Organizer. That's a volunteer thing, right? So when did it become such a horrible thing to have that on your resume? Oh...Right...I forgot, when you're running for Public Office.

    You want to impress upon the voters that Obama may not have as much experience as McCain, that's fair. However the way that Sarah, whomever wrote that speech tonight, went about it sickened and insulted me. Rudy was no better.

    Of all the things they could have possibly picked to single Obama on, they pick that? It didn't sit well w/me and it won't w/others either. Not only that, but that speech didn't win anyone over that wouldn't be already be voting Republican in November. That's not what Sarah needed to do tonight. She needed to reach out to those Undecideds or those who are wibbling. I don't think she did that at all tonight and that in such a tight race, they missed a real chance to make some inroads.

    However, the tone of both speeches tonight destroyed that. As you can tell, I was less than impressed. I'll be interested to see what Obama's camp says tomorrow about the speeches tonight.

  4. #34
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,752
    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    That's not what Sarah needed to do tonight. She needed to reach out to those Undecideds or those who are wibbling. I don't think she did that at all tonight and that in such a tight race, they missed a real chance to make some inroads.

    However, the tone of both speeches tonight destroyed that. As you can tell, I was less than impressed. I'll be interested to see what Obama's camp says tomorrow about the speeches tonight.
    Interesting that you said that - one of the reporters of The Guardian analysed it in a similar way:

    Quote Originally Posted by The Guardian
    ...Well, this election just got a whole lot nastier, I think, if the Republicans are indeed giving up on any attempt to win over the centre, and instead returning to the base-focused strategies of 2000 and 2004, and declaring war on the media, and on the coastal elites, and an big city dwellers, and on liberals (even though Rudy Giuliani is most of these, and McCain in many respects, for that matter). Questions: will it work? How do the calls for bipartisanship we've seen over the last few days fit with that? They don't, obviously, but will the contradiction be problematic for the Republicans? And how does the Obama campaign respond — get fiercer, or reach for moral high ground?
    Or are you and that guy the same person?

    Well, if the strategy worked twice, the third time might be possible.

  5. #35
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Detroit, Michigan
    Posts
    28,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    It would be interesting to review the past presidents - were former governors and mayors more successful and more popular?
    In the last half century, four U.S. prsidents were state governors before becoming President.

    George Bush (Texas). His presidency was a disaster for the nation and the world. Very possibly the worst president in U. S. history.

    IMO this election is about one thing and one thing only. Do we want four more years or have we had enough?

    Bill Clinton (Arkansas). A good ol' boy from the South.

    By and large the U.S. enjoyed peace and prosperity during Clinton's terms (although detractors give credit to economic reforms put in place by Reagan which were just beginning to pay off when Clinton came around.) We had a balanced budget (even a surplus) and, in general, a position of respect among the nations of the world. Our economic soundness and our international reputation among both friends and foes have now been squandered by the Bush administration.

    Bill Clinton is personally charming (a contrast to Hillary) and remains fairly poplular despite the scandal at the end of his service (which cost Al Gore the Presidentcy in 2000.) Through it all, he remains a big "Bubba."

    Jimmy Carter (Georgia). A peanut farmer who became governor of Georgia (the U.S. state), Carter is perceived as a compassionate man who was a great ex-president, involving himself in community improvement and helping poor people, especially through his orgnization Habitat for Humanity.

    His presidency is usually viewed as a failure. He inherited a big mess and the mess was worse four years later. He was criticized, perhaps unjustly, for being weak and indecisive.

    Ronald Reagan (California). Reagan was a movie actor, noted especially for playing cowboys. He was "The Old Ranger" on the hit TV show Wagon Train for many years, before moving on to the governorship of California (a path followed most recently by body-builder/actor Arnold Schwartzeneger. Ah, California! Who's next, Michelle Kwan? )

    But the Presidency was Reagan's biggest role. He looked great on TV. (John Kennedy was his only rival in terms of looking good on TV. ) He looked you straight in the eye, had a firm handshake, folksy yet Presidential with a capital P. As far as I could tell, he neither knew nor cared much about the actual workings of government at any level. He napped a lot. His detractors complained that there was no hand on the tiller of the Ship of State.

    No hand on the tiller, perhaps -- but the good ship Ronald Reagan had a deep keel. He set the nation on a new tack of patriotism, optimism and good old-fashioned conservative principles (except on fiscal matters). His Presidency was sufficiently popular to snag an extra term for George Bush senior. Reagan is remembered with great affection. Thousands of people came out to view the pomp and grandeur of his funeral procession, fit for a Roman emperor.

    Only one American President of the last 50 years came to the Presidency directly from service in the Senate. That was John Kennedy. Nixon, Johnson and Truman all served in the senate before becoming vice president, then became president later.

    Kennedy is another, like Reagan, whose personal charm made people want to forget his relative political inexperience and personal flaws. He was the "Camelot President." He had a classy, sophisticated and stunningly beautiful wife (not to mention Marilyn Monroe on the side.)

    (OT: Comedian Bill Maher recently quipped that Michelle Obama is a mix of Jackie and Jackee. Jacqueline Kennedy and a character on an old television sitcom, a black actress whose role was an exaggerated caricature of a "hot momma.")

    Anyway, many, many people look back on Kennedy as a great president, although when asked what exactly he did that was so great, the details seem a little vague.

    That's my take on it, anyway.
    Last edited by Mathman; 09-04-2008 at 10:24 PM.

  6. #36
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    1,560
    Talking about personal charm, I watched Palin's speech last night, she didn't add anything new to the feeling I had the first time I heard that she was going to be on McCain's team.

    John McCain is a cancer survivor and continuously doing the regular follow ups, and he is 72. The real possibility is that Palin might be the next president if McCain has any health problems. Do people want Palin to be the leader of this country? I cannot imagine that.

    There was one thing that Palin said made me laugh. She said that the victory of Iraq war is in sight. Where?! How?! It was totally wrong to attack Iraq in the first place, and the longer and deeper US goes into there, the more difficult to get out of that mess.

    Both sides attacked each other in their speeches in the conventions. I think Obama and Biden's speeches had more class and hit the points. They praised John McCain as a person, but they pointed out that his views were incorrect. Obama's audience grabing speeches ( especially his speech in Germany ) were part of his personal charm. In my mind, Obama has won in this round battle.

    Mathman, thanks for the analysis! Basically I agree with what you said. I never figured out where did the JFK's personal charm come from? I personally don't think he was charming. Maybe because he was shot and died so young and tragically, people added the personal charm by their imagination to his characters.

    The funny thing is that the worst president has served two terms. I like his father, George Bush Sr. very much, though.
    Last edited by jennylovskt; 09-09-2008 at 12:34 AM.

  7. #37
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Birmingham, Alabama, US
    Posts
    162
    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    You know what bothered me about her speech tonight?

    The continual digs at someone who had been a Community Organizer. That's a volunteer thing, right? So when did it become such a horrible thing to have that on your resume? Oh...Right...I forgot, when you're running for Public Office.
    Actually, larger charities often have paid "lead" organizers. I believe Obama was such a leader, not a volunteer. But he may well have volunteered, too. And I can tell you, having worked 4 years at a 501(c)3 myself, that a lot of what you do is effectively volunteering because you do what needs to be done even when you're not paid or reimbursed.

    I've been saying for a while that the GOP's real problem with Obama's resume is not that it's short in length. It's the content. He actually went into a bad situation, on the front lines, and tried to help people rebuild their lives after the steel mills shut down. To me, that's very pertinent experience for a person running for office in hard times.

    Of course the main titles on my resume are journalist, PR and grant writer, and public health project assistant. Now I'm trying to get the PH degree so I can create and administer the programs. I'm just a liberal do-gooder.

    Susan

  8. #38
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    20,185
    My feelings at this point is that the Republicans have the edge over the Democrats. Hillary would have been a more formidable opponent against McCain.

    The fact that Ms Palin could become President scares me. She will lead the country in terms of the judeo/christian scriptures. She will not adhere to the founding fathers of the United States unless they come up to those religious standards. It's god, country and family.

    Oh well, if McCain gets elected maybe he can survive the next 4-8 years.

  9. #39
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Kenai, AK
    Posts
    18,728
    she doesn't run ALASKA that way, why would she run the country that way?

    as for the personal digs - they were way more classy than Obama's dig on her hometown of "Wasilly" (I'm getting so sick of him misprouncing it. Either he doesn't care enough to research what he's talking about, or he knows and doesn't care.) He brought it up, and she responded. Her comment about community organizer was in response to him basically saying being a mayor of 6500 people isn't enough, much less governing a state with a small population. Basically Alaskans count for nothing. If that were truly the case, then, Obama, why the heck are you even campaigning up here. You want our votes, but you also want the nation to think we're a bunch of idiots (okay so that's how I think most people in Anchorage are, but Anchorage is not really Alaska to begin with!).

    As a mayor she had the 'regular joe' able to walk in and talk with her, she couldn't hide behind suits or anything, and the policy in Juneau isn't much different.

    Is it weird that the VP noms on both sides seem more intune with the general public that they represent at the moment than the dudes running for pres?

    hope Toni will speak to this--there's so much crap on the Internet, it's hard to scope out the truth on this.
    It's a smear campaign that is being referred to as "Troopergate" by the national media. She fired Monneghan (I can never remember what position he held, but he was in charge of the state troopers) and - according to those who are still upset that she's shaking things up in Juneau - she did it because she wanted him to fire her ex-brother in law and he wouldn't. Now, there were others that are 'close' to Sarah (including, apparently, the First Dude) who supposedly called to pressure him on behalf of her. However! Monneghan (and I can't spell his name either lol how sad am I?) has come out and stated point blank that he was never pressured to fire her brother in law.

    She replaced him with the Kenai Chief of Police (former, now) Kopp (seriously) and then he resigned after two weeks on the job because of the ADN digging up a 'sexual harrassment' complaint on him from eons ago that was dropped and the ADN started screaming that Sarah didn't do her homework. Kopp was a very divisive choice to begin with, he wasn't very popular by most... and basically it's gone out of hand...

    The whole thing is being investigated but Sarah has asked that they investigate using the correct branch of the state government and not have the senate overstep its bounds...
    Last edited by Tonichelle; 09-04-2008 at 01:55 PM.

  10. #40
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,752
    http://www.thatminoritything.com/?p=53193

    I love those "comparisions" on that page. Best are:
    If you grow up in Hawaii you’re “exotic.”

    Grow up in Alaska eating mooseburgers, you’re the quintessential “American story.”
    If you say that for the “first time in my adult lifetime I’m really proud of my country” it makes you “unfit” to be First Lady.

    If you are a registered member of a fringe political group that advocates secession that makes you “First Dude.”
    I know that the Edwards guy messed it up royally with his affairs etc. - but this still kind of fits:

    And, finally, if you’re a man and you decide to run for office despite your wife’s reoccurrence of cancer you’re a “questionable spouse.”

    If you’re a woman and you decide to run for office despite having five kids including a newborn with Downs Syndrome… Well, we don’t know what that is ‘cause THAT’S NOT A FAIR QUESTION TO ASK!
    ----------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle
    I'm getting so sick of him misprouncing it. Either he doesn't care enough to research what he's talking about, or he knows and doesn't care.
    Or it's one of those names that people have different opinions about and everybody tells you something else. Perhaps some of his advisors told him the wrong pronunciation... Plus, do you really need to get worked up about that? I never met one US-American (granted, didn't meet more than 60 in my life - but hey, even your politicians or your TV-news don't care) who cared enough to pronounce a German / French / Dutch name (be it a family name, or the name of a town or region) properly, why should they be able to pronounce the names in their country?
    Last edited by Medusa; 09-04-2008 at 03:26 PM.

  11. #41
    The Zamboni Rocks!!! sillylionlove's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    East of the Pacific, West of the Atlantic, South of Canada and North of Mexico
    Posts
    1,896
    First off, I appreciate everyone's comments. It's really great to see everyone's point of view. And Mathman...thanks for the overview with the govenor's.

    It's funny because Ronald Regan was president of the screen actors guild before he became governor of California. I wonder what people would say about that now?

    I am reading John Adams biography right now..(I haven't seen the miniseries yet and won't until I read the book.) Funny how even back them, they attacked people's character which had nothing to do with how they could run a country!!

  12. #42
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Kenai, AK
    Posts
    18,728
    Medussa - Wasilla is pronounced just as it's read. "Wah-sill-uh" Just like Obama isn't Obamy. If you're going to attack someone's experience or person, at least have the decency to say the name correctly of the town she's always lived in. And yes, as an Alaskan I can and will take offense to it. He's been campaigning up here (by surrogate) for months saying how much he understands about our culture and how much he wants Alaska to feel a part of his grand scheme of things, and then he comes up with this? Um, no. It was a put down, pure and simple.

    It's one thing to have a hard times with places outside of your country and language, and if it's a BIG DEAL that the current president can't pronounce nuclear than it's a big deal that the one running for the position can't say Wasilla. and it's all in context. I cannot believe that Obama doesn't know how to pronounce it. Wasilly is a putdown term of the town that is well known and common up here. So either he was entirely ignorant and therefore does not need to bother commenting on the subject, or he knew and that just shows how little respect he has for us up here. (and no, I'm not from Wasilla, I'm from Kenai...which is always mispronounced and I don't get as upset because I get why it gets mispronounced - for the record it's keen-eye)


    In the big scheme it doesn't seem like a lot, but I think Sarah had everyright to stand up for her town and state last night. The nation has never given a rip about us up here, and if Obama has his way they won't after this is all over either. We're just as much a state as the other 49 (or in a lot of cases 48 since I guess Hawaii gets it even worse than we do, from what I understand anyway)

    and the quote about mooseburgers is unfair (one because moose burgers are dry and not good, moose burger is good for stuff like tacos lol) because Native Alaskans continue to get the short end of the stick by our national government. They just closed a massive portion of the beaches on the Kenai peninsula for no better reason than "homeland security" to protect a natural gas refinery - that is no longer operating. They closed it off not just to whites, blacks, and non-Natives... but to the Alaskan Natives who fish off those beaches for subsistance - ie as a way to survive.

    Not as big an issue as the crap that goes on to the natives in the 'bush' which is even more rural than the Kenai... but still a huge blow. Most traditional native hunting grounds were taken away due to the Antiquities act... that both Carter and Clinton used in order to close off those portions of the land. Gore fought long and hard as VP to keep Alaska Natives from living a life they've always lived (al biet with use of new technologies) and saying that if they (and we) just understood how the real world works it would be so much better. The REAL WORLD up here is a different REAL WORLD than that of MTV or Washington DC. But no one seems to care to hear that.

  13. #43
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,752
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Medussa - Wasilla is pronounced just as it's read. "Wah-sill-uh" Just like Obama isn't Obamy. If you're going to attack someone's experience or person, at least have the decency to say the name correctly of the town she's always lived in. And yes, as an Alaskan I can and will take offense to it. He's been campaigning up here (by surrogate) for months saying how much he understands about our culture and how much he wants Alaska to feel a part of his grand scheme of things, and then he comes up with this? Um, no. It was a put down, pure and simple.

    [...]

    The REAL WORLD up here is a different REAL WORLD than that of MTV or Washington DC. But no one seems to care to hear that.
    But aren't there lots of different real worlds? What about this? Has Palin ever mentioned anyone who is not living in her real world? What about all the other real worlds? By the way, what's MTV?

    Your entire post is a good example why democracy might be a failure to begin with. Because humans are egocentric, it's about their lives, about their homes, about their jobs, about their traditions, about their values - they are the ones that are important, they are the ones that are being ignored, they are the ones that suffer. And that's natural - and at the same time absolutely frustrating.

    And not knowing how the name of a town is pronounced, that has about 8000 inhabitants is a put-down and deliberate insult to Alaska? Interesting. I am originally from a rural district with about 221 000 inhabitants in a state that mostly consists of big cities (Cologne, Dusseldorf, Dortmund, Essen) and no politician (except for the ones from the district) has ever been able to pronounce the capital of our district correctly. But I never felt put down by that, or had the feeling that the politicians are indifferent towards the rural areas and only care about the big cities just because they can't pronounce that name.

    This Washington Post article has an interesting take on the "community organiser" story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Washington Post
    After all, Obama was an organizer from roughly age 24 to 26 -- after he graduated from Columbia University but before he went to Harvard Law School -- and Palin, at that age, was working as a television sports broadcaster.

    If Palin's two terms as mayor are chronologically equivalent to anything in Obama's biography, it is to his eight years in the Illinois State Senate, which occupied roughly the same stretch in his late 30s and early 40s as did her time running Wasilla.

    That, however, is comparison that shapes up a bit differently. Wasilla's population during Palin's tenure as mayor was roughly 5,000; Obama's Senate district held about 200,000 constituents, or about 40 times as many as Palin's Wasilla.

    Slightly more than 1,000 people voted in Palin's reelection contest in 1999, which she won 826-255. Slightly more than 50,000 voted in Obama's 1998 reelection, which he won with about 45,000 votes.
    PS: Medusa is written with one "s", like the monster in the Greek mythology.
    PSS: Thanks Mathman for that interesting overview about the presidents!
    Last edited by Medusa; 09-04-2008 at 06:29 PM.

  14. #44
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Detroit, Michigan
    Posts
    28,827
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Just like Obama isn't Obamy.
    Obamy? As in, Oh-balmy (=crazy)?
    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa
    By the way, what's MTV?
    Music Television -- a cable television network that shows mostly music videos for teenagers and fluff on rap singers.

  15. #45
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,752
    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Music Television -- a cable television network that shows mostly music videos for teenagers and fluff on rap singers.
    Ohh, I know that - we have that in Germany too. I thought it might be some cool political abbreviation I didn't know. Never watched MTV though, I generally prefer music that was composed before 1943 and the guys on MTV never seem to broadcast that (that's what I call censorship!).

    If you want to read really hilarious (and absolutely snobbish-European, elitist, sarcastic, mocking...) reports about the elections - read The Guardian, it's amazing. But The Guardian tends to write like that about lots of stuff, not just Americans - so I don't think it's really insulting. Favourite part tonight so far

    8.59pm: Warning: Republicans dancing! Or shuffling to left and then to the right, in an embarrassing but socially conservative way. It's not pleasant, even though Johnny B Goode is a very good tune.

    9.03pm: OK please stop now.

Page 3 of 8 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •