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Thread: Nebelhorn Results

  1. #16
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    I doubt very much that the caller has any contact or interaction with the audience.

    There is a discussion of today's Ladies results on the USFSA board which mentions that the caller in that competition (Katarina Kamberska) said Amber Corwin's triple flip was cheated, and counted it as an overrotated double flip, costing Amber a bunch of points.

  2. #17
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    Originally posted by Joesitz
    Also what exactly does the Caller do for the spectators attending?
    Does he announce anything to the Public? How does he reach the judges for his imput? What procedures does the Caller take in these competitions?

    Interesting that Urmanov was the Caller.

    Joe

    The caller does nothing for the spectators. He is part of the officials panel. He is the tech specialist for the judges.

  3. #18
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    Originally posted by euterpe
    There is a discussion of today's Ladies results on the USFSA board which mentions that the caller in that competition (Katarina Kamberska) said Amber Corwin's triple flip was cheated, and counted it as an overrotated double flip, costing Amber a bunch of points.
    Very, very interesting. This is very exciting actually. After all those years of having skaters with poor technical skills, specifically cheated jumps, incorrect edges, still being rewarded just because they didn't actually go down.

    No comment on Corwin, since I haven't yet personally seen or heard from anyone who was there.

    I can't wait to see how this plays out in the bigger competitions.

  4. #19
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    OD Results are in. Lots of placement-swapping here!

    Here are the overall standings after the OD:

    1- 74.42 KULIKOVA / NOVIKOV
    2- 74.16 MOXLEY / KIRSANOV
    3- 73.17 KHOKHLOVA / NOVITSKI
    4- 73.15 KAUC / ZYCH
    5- 72.35 KERR / KERR
    6- 71.06 MANON / O'MEARA
    7- 69.00 LONGPRE / ZUKIWSKY
    8- 60.89 DOHERTY / MILES
    9- 57.55 BINCZYK / TOMASZEWSKI
    10- 55.00 DULEJ / JANICKI
    11- 47.50 BUCK / NELSON-BOND

    Here are the placements in the CD and OD

    CD OD
    5 1 RUS KULIKOVA / NOVIKOV
    3 3 USA MOXLEY / KIRSANOV
    2 4 RUS KHOKHLOVA / NOVITSKI
    1 7 POL KAUC / ZYCH
    7 2 GBR KERR / KERR
    4 5 USA MANON / O'MEARA
    6 6 CAN LONGPRE / ZUKIWSKY
    10 8 CAN DOHERTY / MILES
    9 9 POL BINCZYK / TOMASZEWSKI
    8 10 POL DULEJ / JANICKI
    11 11 AUS BUCK / NELSON-BOND

  5. #20
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    Wow! Talk about a jump in placements between CDs and ODs. And I withdraw my previous comment about Kulikova & Novikov. Can't wait to see them in person, though.

  6. #21
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    Originally posted by Ptichka
    Wow! Talk about a jump in placements between CDs and ODs. And I withdraw my previous comment about Kulikova & Novikov. Can't wait to see them in person, though.
    Amazing isn't it. And especially in ice dance.


  7. #22
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    Question The Caller's job

    Thanks eurterpe and Nordlite for the info on the Caller!

    In the case of Amber, I presume the fans and judges have to have full faith in the honesty of the Caller. Are his/her observations just to point out faulty technical elements and report them to the judges? or do the judges request information from the Caller?

    One more question: In this particular competition, I can believe Amber overrotated her jump but that is not unusual in any given competition. There are many contestants who under or overrotate their jumps. Was she the only one the Caller pointed out?

    I'm trying to understand the COP thing in action. Amber is a good example as to the workings of the Caller. When the Caller was first presented as part of the COP, I wrote in the GS discussion that the Caller would be a powerful person in the competition. Most responses to my statement was that the Caller's input will be minimal because the computer will detect all the faults.

    I'm still confused. HELP!!

    Joe

  8. #23
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    The technical specialist, or caller, identifies each element as skated (vs. as planned) and assigns each its level. Then each judge .....................................oh heck, here are the descriptions from the ISU site: Communication 1207

    "Technical Specialist (Caller)
    Description
    • identification and call of performed elements;
    • identification and call of performed “levels”;
    • identification and call of “corrected elements”, like less rotation, different element of both partners (pairs), etc.
    • re-confirming additional elements;
    • re-confirming “wrong elements”;
    • re-confirming of forbidden repetition of elements;
    • identification of the highlight bonus;

    And........

    ISU New Judging System
    Basic principles of calculation Figure Skating:

    a) Technical Specialists determine the name and level (when necessary) of every element.

    b) According to this decision every element has a certain basic value indicated in the Scale of Value (SOV) chart.

    c) Each Judge identifies for each element one of the seven grades of execution. Each grade has its own + or – numerical value also indicated in the SOV chart."



    As for him (or her) being powerful or trusted, I'm sure he is, as much as anyone should be on the panel, but there is a Technical Controller who oversees everything he is doing, and at Nebelhorn there is an assistant tech specialist. Not sure if the assistant is just there because this is all new, or if there will always be one. We will just have to wait and see.

    All info on these new positions is listed in very plain english in communication 1207 on the ISU site. You have to get through alot of technical crap until page 15 where everything is explained easily.

    I am a little confused by this statement:

    Most responses to my statement was that the Caller's input will be minimal because the computer will detect all the faults.
    How the heck can a computer detect the fact that a skater flutzed her lutz???

  9. #24
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    Re: The Caller's job

    Originally posted by Joesitz
    One more question: In this particular competition, I can believe Amber overrotated her jump but that is not unusual in any given competition. There are many contestants who under or overrotate their jumps. Was she the only one the Caller pointed out?
    Was she the only one? I wasn't there but I would think not, since she was in third place instead of last.
    Last edited by Norlite; 09-05-2003 at 10:39 PM.

  10. #25
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    If the Caller has this much influence then he/she could have a bias for or against a certain skater.

    If Maria B. was the Caller.....How would she handle a competition when Irina was skating.

    Would a Russian Caller be more partial to the Russian skaters, a Canadian Caller be more partial to the Canadian skaters or a U.S. Caller be more partial to the American skaters.

    Couldn't a skating federation easily get the loyality of one person with so much influence rather than deal with a whole panel of judges.

    Or, am I still as confused as ever

  11. #26
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    OMG!!!!
    the british came 2nd in the OD. There free dance is amazing, won't be surprised if they move up.

  12. #27
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    This Caller thing is very scary to me and is, I think, the major flaw of the CoP. To take Amber's flip as an example: It was the judgement of one individual that the underrotation was sufficient that the jump should count as an "overrotated double" instead of an "underrotated triple." If a majority of the nine judges (or even all of them) disagreed with this assesment, too bad.

    This invests too much responsibility in one person. IMHO. I bet there will be a lot of controversial decisions when the stakes get higher in the Grand Prix.

    Mathman

  13. #28
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    LADIES FINAL SP FS FINAL

    Jennifer DON USA 143,07 1 1 1
    Lesley HAWKER CAN 131,46 2 2 2
    Olga NAIDENOVA RUS 119,54 9 3 3
    Miia MARTTINEN FIN 119,43 4 6 4
    Daria TIMOSHENKO AZE 118,62 5 7 5
    Denise ZIMMERMANN GER 118,35 6 4 6
    Amber CORWIN USA 117,87 3 8 7
    Sara FALOTICO BEL 113,64 12 5 8
    Katharina HÄCKER GER 109,92 7 9 9
    Kristin WIECZOREK GER 101,79 10 10 10
    Caroline GÜLKE GER 96,46 8 11 11
    Constanze KEMMNER GER 86,58 13 13 12
    Shirene HUMAN RSA 85,03 11 15 13
    Irina LUKIANENKO UKR 84,38 15 12 14
    Alenka ZIDAR SLO 83,77 14 14 15
    Withdrawn Idora HEGELCRO

    http://www.isufs.org/events/cat00004202.htm

  14. #29
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  15. #30
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    Am I to understand that now the SP and LP are equally weighted? It looks that way since the total of their SP and LP results are added to give the final total.

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