Why does Caroline Zhang bore some people?

museksk8r · Sep 24, 2008

feraina said:
(In contrast, much as I adore Michelle Kwan's skating, I can't recall a single program that was "sexy" as opposed to beautiful or elegant or emotional or even passionate. Nothing wrong with not trying to be "sexy", but to do that takes a certain amount of extroversion and diva-esque quality, which I felt like the very private Ms. Kwan didn't really have in her personality.

I think Michelle got her sexy groove on in numbers like The Feeling Begins SP, Rush SP, A Day In The Life SP, and her Miraculous Mandarin LP. She showed in these numbers that she is very much capable of exotic/flirty/fun movement. The way she uses her arms and hands in her choreography and the way she can seduce an audience with her eyes is very visually stunning, IMO. It's true that Michelle has a quiet, subtle sexuality, which is what I prefer personally. She's not going out of her way to prove she's sexy, she just is naturally.

kittyjake5 · Sep 24, 2008

I thought Michelle's 2004 World's Exhibition to I Keep on Falling by Alicia Keyes was pretty darn sexy.

feraina · Sep 24, 2008

Well, what is "sexy" is certainly subjective. That's why I used the word "sexy" in quotes in talking about Miki Ando's Carmen program. I meant that particular type of personality out on ice. I didn't feel like Miki was completely acting out there. She made me feel like she really does have a little diva-esque component to her personality deep inside, and she's just letting it out in that program.

I'm not saying Michelle didn't have personality in her skating. She had tons, and she let it out freely. But it was a very different kind than Miki's.

Caroline, on the other hand, still doesn't really let her personality shine through in her skating, especially the competitive ones (I think she had two really great exhibition programs the last two years, with a good bit of personality). You get the feeling that she's still holding herself back. I only meant to say that Caroline may have a diva-esque component to her personality as well, more similar to Miki Ando's than to Michelle Kwan's, and one day, when she does start to bring out her personality more, I would not be surprised if she chooses to display this quality in a program.

feraina · Sep 24, 2008

Kwanford Wife said:
His postion being that real sexy (ala Michelle & Joanine) is different from skating sexy (ala Tanith)

I don't know any of these skaters personally and only get an indirect glimpse of their personalities through the media, but I do tend to believe that Tanith has more of a diva-esque quality in her personality than Michelle and Joanne. I think Tanith skates the way she feels like skating, just as Michelle & Joanne skate like the way they feel like it.

Mafke · Sep 24, 2008

I personally think "sexy" is a completely over-rated quality for skaters to have. I really don't watch skating for imaginary sex-partners (and am very creeped out that apparently some people do).

The only female skater to do "sexy" well was Witt (never a big fave of mine though my respect for her as a competitor knows no bounds). No other need apply ... pleeeease.

Male skaters trying to do "sexy" are liable to give anyone with taste and/or standards chest pains. Plushenko scarred me for life with his various sex-bomb programs .... (cringe, whimper).

Yes, some skaters are very attractive people, but there's no reason for them to bump and grind.

I blame Ice Dance and to some extent the Russian school of pairs skating.

Mathman · Sep 24, 2008

^ That's interesting about Katarina Witt. I always thought she was deliberately doing mock-sexy as a joke on the audience -- or rather, as a joke shared with the audience.

DragonPhoenix · Sep 24, 2008

Mafke said:
The only female skater to do "sexy" well was Witt (never a big fave of mine though my respect for her as a competitor knows no bounds). No other need apply ... pleeeease.

Not for me at all.

Of course, everyone just has different taste.

Miki Ando and Tatyana Navka, now that's sexy :love:

museksk8r · Sep 24, 2008

I think Stephane Lambiel (Sexy Back-Gimme More/Poeta) and Jeremy Abbott (Faith) have pulled off sexy/flirty in good taste.

museksk8r · Sep 24, 2008

Mafke said:
I really don't watch skating for imaginary sex-partners (and am very creeped out that apparently some people do).

There's no exact prescription for what is or is not sexy. Every person has individual preferences and tastes in terms of who they are attracted to. Prepare yourself to be "creeped out" at just about every figure skating forum you visit if you are creeped out by people who find skaters attractive and sexy. I see nothing wrong with expressing that as long as the talk is age appropriate. An adult finding Caroline Zhang to be "sexy" would certainly classify as wierd. Certain skaters are some of the most beautiful athletes in the world, IMO. I think the sport's hot factor is right up there with gymnastics, swimming/diving, football, baseball, rugby, soccer, and tennis.

Mafke · Sep 24, 2008

Mathman said:
Katarina Witt. I always thought she was deliberately doing mock-sexy as a joke on the audience -- or rather, as a joke shared with the audience.

I think that's what made it work for her, she didn't take herself-as-siren so completely seriously (as opposed to winning which she did take absolutely seriously).

vlaurend · Sep 24, 2008

Mafke said:
I personally think "sexy" is a completely over-rated quality for skaters to have. I really don't watch skating for imaginary sex-partners (and am very creeped out that apparently some people do).

The only female skater to do "sexy" well was Witt (never a big fave of mine though my respect for her as a competitor knows no bounds). No other need apply ... pleeeease.

Male skaters trying to do "sexy" are liable to give anyone with taste and/or standards chest pains. Plushenko scarred me for life with his various sex-bomb programs .... (cringe, whimper).

Yes, some skaters are very attractive people, but there's no reason for them to bump and grind.

I blame Ice Dance and to some extent the Russian school of pairs skating.

I think people may mean different things by "sexy" and your definition sounds like it is more literal than others' might be. Personally, I simply see "sexy" as a type of charisma. It doesn't always mean overtly sexual, and I usually find the less overtly sexual more "sexy." It's just an "it" factor that is connected to a certain feminine or masculine energy, and I agree that T. Navka, M. Ando and S. Lambiel are good examples. I would also add B. Joubert and J. Rochette to the list.

jimreuter · Sep 25, 2008

There is no "sexy" mark in the Program Component Scores for IJS. I guesss you could find a small amount of Performance and Execution there if the program was appropriate, but hardly a major factor.

Sorry, but when I am judging I am looking more at their feet, and nobody has sexy feet in figure skating boots.

princess-ice · Sep 25, 2008

Caroline is very genuine!!

I skated on the ice with Caroline this weekend in So Cal. She is so genuine and sweet. We spoke briefly, and she even made sure I got my music played during practice. I also enjoyed watching her skate her program, and really admired the work she's put into her triple jumps. :clap:

Mathman · Sep 25, 2008

jimreuter said:
...nobody has sexy feet in figure skating boots.

To each his own, but don't forget us foot-fetishists. :laugh:

http://weblogs.newsday.com/entertainment/tv/blog/YamaguchiKristi2.06.jpg

Princess-ice, thanks so much for the first-person report! :yes:

merrybari · Sep 25, 2008

I personally don't find Caroline boring at all, just rather young to do full justice to "ladies" programs. Give her time to grow and mature into the programs and music that will showcase what she has it in her to do. IMO she is a diamond in the rough that time and maturity will polish to a high shine. She has potential to make a real name for herself. I await the day with anticipation.

skatesindreams · Sep 25, 2008

princess-ice said:
I skated on the ice with Caroline this weekend in So Cal. She is so genuine and sweet. We spoke briefly, and she even made sure I got my music played during practice. I also enjoyed watching her skate her program, and really admired the work she's put into her triple jumps.

Thank you! That's wonderful to hear.

Pikachuusb · Sep 25, 2008

I for one think Caroline is wonderful on the ice, not boring at all. :love:

Yes she may be slow, but she can work on that. I think that will come with age and size as she is young and tiny right now.

She does 1st rate spins and spirals(which many skaters need to work on) and does great with her jumps. :rock:

Yes she has a mule kick but that can be worked on as well and I can look past that considering she isnt on the ice drying it up with her dress as some human zambonis do.

I think everyone has a different feeling as to whats great or exciting. I for one think her music is beautiful. I also find exteme flexibility great as well. But then again I do love to listen to classical music, watch(and still take)ballet as well as lyrical dance. Usually when watching So You Think You Can Dance my favorite dancers are usually ballet or lyrical dancers. I also find rythmic gymnastics to be quite exciting. I love when skaters and dancers have a great line as well as wonderful centering and beautiful extension. Dont get me wrong I also enjoy it when skaters "mix it up" with their song choices but that doesnt make me think the baby ballerinas are boring at all. That may explain why I am a fan of Mirai Nagasu, Sasha Cohen, Alissa Czisny, Yukina Ota & Lucinda Ruh as well. Whether they have the jumps or not in that event/show, they still come across as gorgeous on the ice. :biggrin:

Tonichelle · Sep 25, 2008

Male skaters trying to do "sexy" are liable to give anyone with taste and/or standards chest pains. Plushenko scarred me for life with his various sex-bomb programs .... (cringe, whimper).

you're not the only one. And Phillipe Candeloro's version sex bomb (well before Plushy's) was worse (what he did to the ice, it was disgusting)

that being said I think Kurt Browning is very sexy on the ice - and he's fully clothed when he does it. Nyah, Serenade to Sonia (yes I think it is!), and Are You Lonesome Tonight are all in that category IMHO! :biggrin:

fairly4 · Sep 26, 2008

i know you are attacking her skating, but you are implying that caroline zhang is boring person. not a skater. i must confess why attack her because of her chinese heritage. why she is the only skater you mention as boring. no other skater. i find all the skaters boring--why 1) same choreographer, 2)same jumps -cant help that, same music. 3 skating itself--humans can only go so fast and so high without help. so just don't single her out. i am afraid the ones who call her boring are attacking her personally so their (fans) favorite skater ie- mirai, rachel, ashely, mao, yu-na , yukari, joannie can get higher scores from the judiges based on popularity . don't laugh --it works.

AwesomeIce · Sep 27, 2008

fairly4 said:
i know you are attacking her skating, but you are implying that caroline zhang is boring person. not a skater. i must confess why attack her because of her chinese heritage. why she is the only skater you mention as boring. no other skater. i find all the skaters boring--why 1) same choreographer, 2)same jumps -cant help that, same music. 3 skating itself--humans can only go so fast and so high without help. so just don't single her out. i am afraid the ones who call her boring are attacking her personally so their (fans) favorite skater ie- mirai, rachel, ashely, mao, yu-na , yukari, joannie can get higher scores from the judiges based on popularity . don't laugh --it works.

Are you joking?

Why does Caroline Zhang bore some people?

museksk8r

kittyjake5

feraina

feraina

Mafke

Mathman

DragonPhoenix

museksk8r

museksk8r

Mafke

vlaurend

jimreuter

princess-ice

Mathman

merrybari

skatesindreams

Pikachuusb

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll

fairly4

AwesomeIce

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