Why is the Lutz so difficult?

GiuliaPlum said:

So for Alissa Czisny is the lutz easier than the flip?

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Yes, I think the Czisny's Lutz has always been better than her flip.

In this question & answer article from the Golden Slkate archives Alissa explains that when she was first learning the Lutz her coach (Julianne Berlin) taught her to approach on a big outside edge curve, instead of the straighter, flatter approach that most skaters use. Because of this, she says, she has never had problems with her Lutz take-off edge.

http://www.goldenskate.com/articles/2006/042207.shtml

This would explain why she adds a double-toe to her Lutz..

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Alissa's 3Lz+2T is a money jump for her (although any jump can be an adventure for Alissa), but lots of skaters use that combo, even if they flutz.

Is this (pre-rotating the shoulders and rocking over to an inside edge on a Lutz attempt) legal according to ISU rules?

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No. It should get an "e" call and a mandatory reduction in GOE.

Can anyone explain the following:

All figure skating jumps have their names because of the Take-off. True

All figure skating jumps rotate in the best way a skater can rotate. True.

Doing jumps in opposite rotations do not get anything special and are scored as two separate jumps withing the limit allowed. True

Are jumps distinguished by their Names? Yes.

If a valid named jump takes off on the wrong edge, should the rest of the jump continue to be credited as if it were a correct take-off? knowing that the jump now has a more comfortable take-off as it would have for the new edge allowing for easier air rotations and landings?

Because the Lutz is a difficult jump in that one counter rotates from its Take-off, should there be an official ease of the Rule for Lutz? and maybe the Flip? There certainly would not be for the Axel, Salchow, Loop and Toeloop.

Joesitz said:

If a valid named jump takes off on the wrong edge, should the rest of the jump continue to be credited as if it were a correct take-off? knowing that the jump now has a more comfortable take-off as it would have for the new edge allowing for easier air rotations and landings?

Because the Lutz is a difficult jump in that one counter rotates from its Take-off, should there be an official ease of the Rule for Lutz? and maybe the Flip? There certainly would not be for the Axel, Salchow, Loop and Toeloop.

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There are people that take off almost backwards on their Axels and people who are almost on an outside edge for Salchows, but no one ever picks on these items.

It is not an "official ease of the rule" for Lutz and flip, the skaters who WET get penalties (negative GOEs) which, when the scoring is close as it often is at least within "groups of skaters", can be the difference between 1st and 3rd or 3rd and 5th or 10th and 12th. I know I can do a Lutz from an outside edge 85% of the time and the flat another 10% of the time, but when I get nervous, my timing sometimes goes in the crapper and I flip the edge over before take off. Am I cheating? Maybe in the strictest sense of the word "cheat", but it's never intentional and I get "e" calls under IJS when I do that which means I get -1 and -2 GOEs.

mskater93 said:

There are people that take off almost backwards on their Axels and people who are almost on an outside edge for Salchows, but no one ever picks on these items.

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Who almost uses an outside edge for the Salchow? I can't picture that and I'd like to see it if it's possible.

I've seen the really flat, flat take of edge that pushes over pretty far and could (as I said) ALMOST be on an outside edge. Usually this results in a pretty crappy jump that doesn't fully rotate. I see it at our rink and wonder "what the he-- was that???!"

I wonder

I wonder if anyone has ever been able to pull off a LFI three turn into Lutz. It would be really tough and require and really hard check to pull the jump off but i think it would look great - like when skaters use a RFO rocker into loop jumps.

Ant