Sasha Cohen's big gamble | Page 5 | Golden Skate

Sasha Cohen's big gamble

R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
All I meant was many who were anti-Michelle getting a Bye and therefore bumping poor Emily, etc are pushing for Sasha to come back.
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I wasn't exactly thrilled with MK getting a bye, but I accepted it. At least she was the reigning national champ, etc.

Cohen has been off the scene for 3 years. Not exactly the same scenario we're talking about here. She absolutely wouldn't deserve any kind of bye or pass and if she were to announce a come-back and then get one, I'd raise a red flag. And I sure won't be the only one. Better it go to someone who actually deserves a shot and who has worked hard for it.

For the pro-Cohen folks: if she were to announce a come-back, appear at US Oly trials and rightfully outskate everyone (or everyone but one), then ok, fine. let her go.
 
Joesitz (RIP)

Joesitz (RIP)

Joined
Jul 11, 2003
As I said before, there has to be a motivation for returning to figure skating after a few years of retirement.

I have a gut feeling that the skaters with the ALL Stars Olympics (what year was it?) must have had a sense of fading glory since ISU competititve skating overtook Pro skating comps. Pro skating took on the bubble gum look of Sunday afternoons. The sillier, the better. It was the ISU Eligible Championships where skating showed what was a serious sport.

Sasha is taking a gamble on her return to eligible skating, imo. It's all in a process that is very legal. Power to her if she decides.

As to the 'bumping', there will be one at Nats if Sasha wins or places second.. The combinations of results at that championship are staggering. Hypothetically, if there are only two places, which is expected, and Rachael wins and Sasha is second, that would mean Zhang is out of the Olympics You can substitue any names in place of Rachael and Zhang in this exercise.

If Sasha does not place, I believe she will not get the backing of the USFS to go to the Olys despite her silve medal in 2006.
 
M

MKFSfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 15, 2006
What Red Dog said.

IMO, Michelle earned the right to petitioning for a bye as the 4th place finisher of Worlds 2005 (especially since both her programs her ranked 3rd in SP and LP) and as the 2005 National Champion, amongst her other credentials. Had she NOT competed for 3 seasons, her bye would've been laughed out of the rink. I am not saying they are the same. I'm not saying that at all! All I am saying is the tables have turned. The same folks who are reporting and praying and hoping Sasha comes back despite NOT competing at all in what will be 4 years, were against Michelle asking for a bye. That's all I am saying. I realize their situations are vastly different because Sasha can "earn" her spot on the team by winning 2010 Nationals, and chances are, if she is Silver (providing there are 2 spots, Silver or Bronze if 3 spots).

Who knows...Sasha may very well be at Skate America and then we'll have more of an idea of how she stacks up.

Like I said before...I don't care if Sasha does not compete all fall, but is at Nationals and makes the team. That is her right as the reigning OSM, it's within the rules and she will earn her spot.

I also feel Michelle earned the right to petition for a bye due to her resume, despite all the cries that it wasn't fair, she didn't "earn" a spot and poor Emily was bumped. Under the rules, only the Gold Medalist at Nationals was guaranteed a spot. Had the rules been bent for Michelle, that would be a different story all together.
 
R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Maybe, but seriously, we should save the discussion of "what if she's at Nats" for if she actually comes back. As far as I'm concerned, she doesn't exist right now. (competitively speaking)
 
Mathman

Mathman

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
About Emily Hughes at the 2006 Olympics, I think there is another way to look at it.

Take Michelle out of the picture. At 2005 Worlds Sasha (2nd) and Jenny Kirk (16th) earn two Olympic spots for the U.S. ladies. Sasha and Kimmie go to Torino, Emily is out.

Michelle's 4th place in Moscow is the only reason Emily got into the Torino discussion at all. And that's why all Emily Hughes fans are eternally grateful to Michelle. :)
 
R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Not that it would matter, but did you remember to move Jenny up a spot? if she was 16th then THEORETICALLY she'd move up to 15th.

Or was she 17th? I don't remember...
 
Mathman

Mathman

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Red Dog said:
Not that it would matter, but did you remember to move Jenny up a spot? if she was 16th then THEORETICALLY she'd move up to 15th.

Or was she 17th? I don't remember...
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I'm all over it. Jenny was 17th. :biggrin:

Edited to add: On the other hand, if Michelle hadn't skated in Moscow, Bebe Liang was next in line and she might have gotten 11th. :)
 
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R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
You know, I'd rather ask for Meissner to return to 2006-2007 form than ask Cohen to come back. Now THAT would be a cool comeback story. (IMO)

Or even Hughes, but she seems set on school. It's staggering how far both of them have regressed since two seasons ago. I mean, wow. I'd never have thought.

As for the two going to Vancouver, without holding any trials and based on what's happening now it might be Zhang and Flatt. No story behind either of them but their ages might get people excited.
 
P

Particle Man

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
I had basically no problems with Michelle being sent in 2006 even WITHOUT going to Nationals, which again will NOT be the case for Sasha. I never thought Emily was in medal contention -- it was yet another argument for "Olympic experience" vs medal chance. Well boo hoo, I love Emily but the best chance at a medal matters most. In 2006, the committee decided Michelle had the better chance so they sent her. Then Emily got to go anyway, and basically showed that they were right to try to send Michelle.

In 2010, no one will decide Sasha has a better chance unless she proves it, which she would have to do at Nationals. Sasha is getting no advantage whatsoever. She has only DISADVANTAGE from being untested, but it's entirely her own fault for staying away so long. The only people against her trying are either Sasha-haters or die-hard fans of one of the newer girls, desperately afraid of losing "their chance."
 
Mathman

Mathman

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Red Dog said:
You know, I'd rather ask for Meissner to return to 2006-2007 form than ask Cohen to come back. Now THAT would be a cool comeback story. (IMO)

Or even Hughes, but she seems set on school. It's staggering how far both of them have regressed since two seasons ago. I mean, wow. I'd never have thought.

As for the two going to Vancouver, without holding any trials and based on what's happening now it might be Zhang and Flatt. No story behind either of them but their ages might get people excited.
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Personally, I don't think we need a "story" behind anyone. This is the U.S. Olympic team, heading for Vancouver to skate for Truth, Justice and the American Way. That should be story enough for anyone. :yes:
 
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R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Then Emily got to go anyway, and basically showed that they were right to try to send Michelle.
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???

Hughes placed 7th in Torino, just behind Kimmie. All three Americans were in the top 10 in Torino, and then again in Calgary. And Hughes did well enough that her placement, combined with EITHER Cohen's or Meissner's would have been good enough for 3 spots next year.
 
R

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Particle Man said:
In 2010, no one will decide Sasha has a better chance unless she proves it, which she would have to do at Nationals. Sasha is getting no advantage whatsoever. She has only DISADVANTAGE from being untested, but it's entirely her own fault for staying away so long.
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Who knows what the US judges want to do. We can't say whether or not she'll get an advantage here, that's purely speculation. Theoretically, she shouldn't, but it doesn't mean she won't.

But I agree with your last sentence.

Shows how bored I am, continuing this ridiculous discussion that may be thrown out the window three months from now :rofl:
 
Mathman

Mathman

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Hmm. The link posted by Particle Man seems to be protected against hotlinking. Copy this into the address bar of your browser, changing ** to tt.

h**p//www.beyondhollywood.com/gallery/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/carolina-kostner-bikini-2.jpg
 
M

MKFSfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 15, 2006
Particle Man said:
I had basically no problems with Michelle being sent in 2006 even WITHOUT going to Nationals, which again will NOT be the case for Sasha. I never thought Emily was in medal contention -- it was yet another argument for "Olympic experience" vs medal chance. Well boo hoo, I love Emily but the best chance at a medal matters most. In 2006, the committee decided Michelle had the better chance so they sent her. Then Emily got to go anyway, and basically showed that they were right to try to send Michelle.

In 2010, no one will decide Sasha has a better chance unless she proves it, which she would have to do at Nationals. Sasha is getting no advantage whatsoever. She has only DISADVANTAGE from being untested, but it's entirely her own fault for staying away so long. The only people against her trying are either Sasha-haters or die-hard fans of one of the newer girls, desperately afraid of losing "their chance."
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I agree with you here. Is anyone here against this??? Confused...I never implied Sasha had any sort of advantage, and I'm pretty sure noone else has either. And I agree, IF she returns and IF decides not to compete this fall, she WILL be at a disadvantage since it's pretty common for inflated marks at Nationals. I don't have the criteria for granting byes in front of me, but I think being a reigning Olympic medalist has some weight, just not enough (that is, IF Sasha were to ask for a bye, which there is NO REASON to assume she would I am just speaking hypothetically here.)
 
C

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Red Dog said:
???

Hughes placed 7th in Torino, just behind Kimmie. All three Americans were in the top 10 in Torino, and then again in Calgary. And Hughes did well enough that her placement, combined with EITHER Cohen's or Meissner's would have been good enough for 3 spots next year.
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No. The 3 spots were decided at Worlds 2006. Meissner won, Cohen was 3rd, and Hughes 8th.
 
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