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Thread: What I learned from a judge's point of view...

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    What I learned from a judge's point of view...

    I ended up watching a lot of ladies practices with a gentleman who is an international judge & a former coach. He was not a judge at any of the events in L.A. I spent quite a lot of time with him, and he was very sweet and wonderful about sharing his thoughts on various ladies.

    Rochette - Beautiful basic skills/edging and loved her cross overs & said her cross overs were almost text book beautiful. Pointed out how much lean she has on her stroking & how crisp her feet are. Went into more technical details but don't remember them now. Considers her a skater's skater because she has such wonderful underlying basic skills. Thought her LP had a lot of "substance" and was well "balanced". He wasn't sure if she could do a 3-3 in the future even if she is doing them in practices.

    Kostner - Another skater with wonderful skating skill but pointed out that she wasn't timing her jumps well. Asked why her speed gets such high praise & he said because it makes doing the next element that much harder. Has wonderful on-ice presence & she knows how to "perform" for the judges. Loves her footwork because it really shows off her ability to control her blades w/out losing speed.

    Mao - Wonderful soft knee & flow. Really likes her skating but didn't think her edging wasn't as nice as Rochette or Kostner's. Had me watch certain transition moves where she seems to skate more on flats or two feet than above two skaters. Thought she may have rushed into learning triple jumps too early & had doubts about being able to land 3L in L.A. because her timing seemed off. Loved her 3A but who doesn't?

    YuNa - Has most natural rhythm in her jumps & loves the distance she gets in her jumps. Didn't think she would miss a jump in L.A. because she had such great timing on her jumps. Nice edging and expressive movement.



    If anyone thinks that he was criticizing any particular skater, he wasn't. He was just pointing out what to look for and appreciate in each skater. We talked about other skaters as well, but I don't really remember.
    Last edited by Ms.Anthrope; 04-01-2009 at 02:22 AM.

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    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Great post! Thank you. Anything you want to add will be most welcome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Great post! Thank you. Anything you want to add will be most welcome.
    Thank you. I've always loved watching Mao & come to love YuNa as well. It was really interesting watching Rochette and Kostner with someone who can explain & point out what to look for in their skating. While I still don't "get" Rochette and Kostner, I have fuller understanding of their skills and am planning on watching their past programs.

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    Custom Title fumie_fumie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ms.Anthrope View Post
    Thank you. I've always loved watching Mao & come to love YuNa as well. It was really interesting watching Rochette and Kostner with someone who can explain & point out what to look for in their skating. While I still don't "get" Rochette and Kostner, I have fuller understanding of their skills and am planning on watching their past programs.
    Thank you so much. I hope those who were unhappy about Joannie winning silver read your posts. Your post says it all.

    If you are interested in watching her past programs.

    2004 Jo's Worlds LP: Her lutz were a bit rough, because she just finished fixing her lutz.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NGrlv6ZI0E

    2005 Jo's first national title winning program - LP Firebird: This program showcases her power, strong skating skills, complex choreography. She had 3toe-3toe as the first jumping pass.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17uTwCAUtrw

    2007 Skate Canada LP. This is second version of Don Juan. She started doing 3-3 sequence from 2007 season, and she popped the second triple there.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVxwB_7Vk7g

  5. #5
    "Hold an edge and look sexy!" museksk8r's Avatar
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    Thanks for posting this, Ms.Anthrope!

    That judge confirmed some of what I've thought about Joannie and Carolina all along . . . that they both have fabulous basic skating skills/edging. They have always been two of my favorites in ladies' skating. Carolina is the more external and faster of the two in her performance style and Joannie, though more internal, has better flow, smoothness, crispness, and timing. A lot of people seem to like to beat up on these two, but I find them both marvelous.

    So I wonder if Mao's weaker edging explains why she bobs up and down when she strokes since she's not getting deep into the ice and is skating more on the flat of the blades. That's something I've always wondered about her . . . why does she do that?
    Last edited by museksk8r; 03-31-2009 at 09:52 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    Thanks for posting this, Ms.Anthrope!

    That judge confirmed some of what I've thought about Joannie and Carolina all along . . . that they both have fabulous basic skating skills/edging. They have always been two of my favorites in ladies' skating. Carolina is the more external and faster of the two in her performance style and Joannie, though more internal, has better flow, smoothness, crispness, and timing. A lot of people seem to like to beat up on these two, but I find them both marvelous.

    So I wonder if Mao's weaker edging explains why she bobs up and down when she strokes since she's not getting deep into the ice and is skating more on the flat of the blades. That's something I've always wondered about her . . . why does she do that?
    I really think Mao has wonderful edges. =x. Maybe it's just me.

  7. #7
    Custom Title fumie_fumie's Avatar
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    CBC's PJ had a very interesting interview with Lori Nichole on her choreography work with Caroline Kostner during Worlds coverage.

    Lori said, Caroline's coach Huth always has new/fun edging exercises for Caroline and Tomas to do every day before they practice their full programs and jumps. And both Caroline and Tomas love their edging exercises. Lori said, thanks to Huth's unique coaching/exercises plan, Caroline is a very fast learner as far as footwork/transitions goes. Lori just gives Caroline a rough description on what transitions she envisions will be on a particular part. And Caroline does it right away on the spot and C's execution is pretty much right on. Lori also noted that she appreciates working with Carolina because C can do pretty much every move Lori suggests.

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    Beliver in Sasha's Perfect Program Tinymavy15's Avatar
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    Thanks for the insight. I guess speed is a pretty big thing with judges. Maybe that is why Caroline always gets such pathetic PCS and Carolina always is overmarked. Funny thing is that during the ladies free, which I attended live, Carolina did not look all that fast at all.

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    Thank you for sharing. I really believe edging, unlike jumps and spins, is one thing that continues to improve with years. Take Shizuka for example. By the time she won OGM, her stroking and edging were simply divine.
    It explains why we see "older" skaters with great edging, such as JoRo, Carolina, Susanna, Fumie, etc. although there are counterexamples.

  10. #10
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    I always enjoy it when I can chat with a former competitive skater or a judge when I go to US nationals... it's always interesting to hear tidbits of what the judges do and gossip about (among other things)

    I'll never forget a judge turning around to his group after the men's final and saying if Michael Weiss had just fallen on his triple axel and not popped it, he'd have been on the 2006 Olympic team, not Matt Savoie. Just one of many times a judge's insight was not just insightful, but surprising lol

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrlmy View Post
    Thank you for sharing. I really believe edging, unlike jumps and spins, is one thing that continues to improve with years. .
    I wish judges would deduct for people cough(*Sasha Cohen*cough) with bad edges on spiral even if they can stretch their legs far far a part.

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