ISU will no longer provide funding for Skate America | Page 2 | Golden Skate

ISU will no longer provide funding for Skate America

merrywidow

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Yesterday I was thinking along the same lines as Mathman & antmanb but on further reflection I decided that all that would accomplish would be retaliation by Speedy. Something like any skater participating in SkateAmerica if it withdraws from the Grand Prix would be ineligible to participate in any other ISU event including Worlds. Speedy believes in getting even, one way or another.
 

Buttercup

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
I've been in the UK for the whole GP season and they've shown every GP on Eurosport (except the final:scowl:). They showed Europeans and Worlds as well! Not bad actually.
Yes, but it was the first time they had done it in years and it might be a one-time deal. NHK was barely shown, and most of TEB looked suspiciously like snooker. Though Speedy cannot be blamed for the evil that is too-long snooker tournaments :scowl:.
 

antmanb

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 5, 2004
I've been in the UK for the whole GP season and they've shown every GP on Eurosport (except the final:scowl:). They showed Europeans and Worlds as well! Not bad actually.

While this is true, Eurosport is a paid for channel, and it only started showing the GP this season. I think the last time it did was in 2000 or 2001. Hopefully the viewing figures they got will encourage more coverage next season (including the final!).

Ant
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
I think if Speedy ousts Skate America from the GP schedule, he'll likely replace it with a Korean event.

But Skate America could then apply for International B status. Most International Bs aren't televised anyway.
 

antmanb

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 5, 2004
Yesterday I was thinking along the same lines as Mathman & antmanb but on further reflection I decided that all that would accomplish would be retaliation by Speedy. Something like any skater participating in SkateAmerica if it withdraws from the Grand Prix would be ineligible to participate in any other ISU event including Worlds. Speedy believes in getting even, one way or another.

Yes that's the same conclusion I reached, which is why it would have to be "national" event.

The biggest problem would be losing the ability to fill your home slots with your own skaters. E.g. if Cohen were to come back next season the USFSA could give her Skate America to get some international exposure and feedback. If Skate America didn't go ahead that chance wuold be lost, equally with a skater like Meissner.

I think the ISU is being pretty stupid though because if the USFSA said, we can't afford to put it on without your financial help, let's scrap it, then the whole way the seeded skaters etc work would be thrown out of whack. Surely there wouldn't be another country willing to step into the breach on such short notice, that doesn't already have a GP? I suppose Germany might, given it did used to host one. Perhaps Korea might be willing given the popularity provoked by Kim?

Ant
 

sillylionlove

Medalist
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
If speedy has his way instead of Kristi Yamaguchi's Family and Friends we will all be watching

Apollo Anton Ohno's speed skating spectacular starring Apollo Anton Ohno with special guests Dan Jansen and Bonnie Blair and a bunch of skaters from Korea!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
OK, I finally got a chance to read the entire report (for some reason I couldn't open the document from my home computer.) It has a lot of interesting information about the financial status of United States Figure Skating.

First, I don't think anyone is talking about canceling Skate America, seceding from the ISU, bearding Speedy in his den, or anything of the sort. The ISU usually makes a contribution for Skate America expenses; this year it won't.

Skate America last year (Everett, Washington) set the all-time attendance record (29,477, bettering the previous record from Spokane of 28,664 in 2002.) USFS also was able to attract increased sponsorhip for figure skating overall, with a new contract with AT&T and the return of State Farm and Smuckers. They sold 85% of the available advertising for the event.

The real problem is not Speedy but the downturn in the economy. Membership is down somewhat and people are not traveling to events. The projected budget for next year lists an income of $12,000,000 form all sources against expenditures of $12,500,000. The remaining $500,000 will be made up by withdrawals from their two reserve funds. These cash funds were worth $60,000,000 last year, but lost 20% of their value in the stock market crash. (Lucky USFS -- I wish I had lost only 20% :laugh: )
 
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merrybari

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 21, 2007
Thanks, mathman, for bringing some reason to this discussion. There's no need to panic or to believe SA will disappear from the GP schedule. Especially, in my thinking, as Team USA just took top honors at the WTT. Seems like spitting in the wind to oust them.

I'm still hopeful, call me an eternal optimist, that ISU will change it's mind and provide some funding after all. Speedy threats were recalled for the LA Worlds when he once said IIRC the hosting there was in jeopardy because of possible lack of TV/rights/coverage. He then retracted and said he'd GIVE away the rights if necessary in order for them to be held there. I think he's pushing just to see if and how hard anyone will push back. Didn't USFS say they were not giving up?

I believe the economy is the issue to some extent. Any word on sales for Lake Placid in 2009? Accessibility may be an added factor in attracting fans. From what I hear, no airport nearby - could mean a problem of added expense ie. car rental to get there.

Those who want to go badly enough will find a way. And the beat goes on!
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
Speedy gets what he wants

When there was a proposed split from the ISU to establish the WSU, who stood by OC? The fans, The coaches, The judges, and of course the Federations. the answer was 'leave it alone, no reason to switch organizations.'

That would have been the perfect way to eliminate Secret Judging, and OC.

Speedy gets what he wants
 

Particle Man

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
I predict that 2011 will be the death of figure skating on television. The Olympics will be over and then no one will care about it....and that's very sad!!

Well, on US television you mean? I could see that, especially since our ladies probably won't even be on the podium for the first time since 1964, which was right after our whole team died in the plane crash.
 

antmanb

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 5, 2004
Speedy gets what he wants

When there was a proposed split from the ISU to establish the WSU, who stood by OC? The fans, The coaches, The judges, and of course the Federations. the answer was 'leave it alone, no reason to switch organizations.'

Joe, was this a question or a statement? The establishment of the WSF was something that divided nearly every group of people you list, except elligible skaters. Understandably no elligible skater wanted to stick their neck on the line in case the WSF failed...which sadly it did.

I'm fairly certain that NISA took the ISU to CAS courtesy of Sally Stapleford.

The WSF also went either to CAS (or i seem to recall it was a case in court) for breach of competition laws but also failed there.

Ant
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
^^^
Ant - It was just an opinion of mine. Given the comments of the thread regarding OC, I just wanted to point out that during the time of the proposal to start up the WSF, which had momentum, did not work. OC and the ISU survived. I just thought there is no point in discussing eliminating OC now. He rules. And it is just my opinion.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I think the mistake which the World Skating Federation made was this. They were so apoplectic over the villainies of the ISU, and so sure that everyone would see the WSF as the white knights riding to the rescue of the sport, that they put all their efforts into doomed legal challenges instead of trying to build an organization.

They could have started by putting on some competitions -- maybe involving professional skating, or recently retired competitors -- and building from there. The only way the ISU could be successfully challenged is if someone puts out a better product than the ISU does.

By the way, Mr. Cinquanta turns 71 this year. He has been ISU President for 16 years.

The last president, Olaf Poulsen, served for 14 years, 1980-19994. Mr. Poulsen died last year at age 88.
 

nylynnr

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 19, 2008
Completely agree with Mathman's assessment of WSF. Would add that many WSF organizers were also more concerned with generating self-aggrandizing publicity than actual doing the work of creating a federation and putting on events.
 

antmanb

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 5, 2004
They could have started by putting on some competitions -- maybe involving professional skating, or recently retired competitors -- and building from there. The only way the ISU could be successfully challenged is if someone puts out a better product than the ISU does.

But wasn't part of the problem that anyone involved with the WSF wouldlose their elligibilty and that included people who require their elligibilty to perform official functions in their own member federations? Judging, testing etc. Also who would judge these events? Using what type of scoring system - 6.0 was out, would they have to use 10.0 and the reputation that already had as jkoe judging in pro comps.

Doomed as they were I think the WSF thought that challenging the ISU was the strongest position to take because if it succeeded in even the smallest challenge then it would show the skating world that it no longer had to bow down to the whim of $peedy. Sadly the world still has to bow down!

Ant
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Using what type of scoring system - 6.0 was out, would they have to use 10.0 and the reputation that already had as jkoe judging in pro comps.

Why would 6.0 be out? As I recall that's exactly what they intended to use, but they allowed for the possibility of modifying it in the future.

Calculations by majority or OBO? That I don't remember.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
But wasn't part of the problem that anyone involved with the WSF would lose their elligibilty and that included people who require their elligibilty to perform official functions in their own member federations? Judging, testing etc. Also who would judge these events? Using what type of scoring system...?

Well, yes, those are the challenges that the WSF would have had to address if they wanted to succeed. In particular, they would have had to secure support from some prominant national federations.

They burned their bridges with USFS by -- from the point of view of USFS -- tricking USFS into issuing a statement in support of the principles of the World Skating Federation, to wit, fair judging. Well, everybody is in favor of that. But then the WSF rushed to press with the announcement that USFS supports the overthrow of the ISU and the wresting of the Olympic games from ISU control.

This was a far cry from what USFS actually said. And again, that is putting the cart befiore the horse. The WSF would have had to establish itself as a legitimate enterprise first, and then try to seduce some national federations to jump ship. This takes time -- the ISU has been at it, for better or for worse, for more than 100 years. They will not go gently into that good night.

The only thing that I personally did not like about the WSF is that they were not up front about where their financial backing was coming from. They never published a financial report and they never responded to questions about money matters. This reticence fueled speculation -- never refuted -- that the WSF was entirely underwritten by IMG, the giant management group, which presumeably hoped to benefit from the success of the WSF.

This is not to impugn the integrity and altruism of Ron Pfenning, Jon Jackson, and their warriors. I wish their efforts had succeeded.
 
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antmanb

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 5, 2004
Why would 6.0 be out? As I recall that's exactly what they intended to use, but they allowed for the possibility of modifying it in the future.

Calculations by majority or OBO? That I don't remember.

I thought the ISU had mandated that 6.0 could only be used in officially sanctioned ISU competitions with ISU judges etc. Wasn't that why pro cmops were marked as 10.0?

Ant
 
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