2009/2010 Competitive Ladies | Page 2 | Golden Skate

2009/2010 Competitive Ladies

Joined
Jul 11, 2003
If the list is just for champions of worlds, olympics . I somewhat agree with the exception of rachel and alena, however if you include nationals i agree.
as far as 2nd tier laura lepisto she already won FC
As far as I look at it, skaters can improve and correct their mistakes during the off season so I don't count anyone out ever.

As far as the new rule, it seems it will favor certain skaters over others.
I am not going to name names of who it will favor over not.
Your list should include all the skaters who are competing , because it is a competition and anything can happen, but by counting one skater/skaters out so early and that said skater(s) win, then most people are surprised when they shouldn't be. Because as I stated earlier anything can happen.
if they judge fairly (which I doubt) anyone can win, medal.
Of course my list is not authentic. It is just how I feel which skaters will be at their best when the chips are down. It has nothing to do with the results of Worlds

I find some skaters excellent but not consistently. Some skates are fighters; othes do not fight and will falter.

Fairly4 - please make up your own list of skaters who will skate their best regard;ess how the results come oudt. There will be plenty of time after GPF for predictions
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
The GOE hit for under rotated (by more than 1/4 turn) jumps, prior to this change in the guideline, was most often -2. (The guideline for jumps under rotated by a 1/4 turn or less was -1.) So I think this change could potentially have an even greater impact than noted above, assuming some judges do not deduct 2 GOEs for under rotated jumps.

To me, it is kind of hard to tell from the protocols, because severely undrrotated jumps usually have other flaws as well, which factor into the GOEs.

Anyway, the point I was trying to make is that for underrotated solo jumps the change in rules is not so important as it is for underrotating the second jump of a triple-triple combo. (Because for a solo jump the GOE is taken off at the discounted rate of a double jump.)
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Anyway, the point I was trying to make is that for underrotated solo jumps the change in rules is not so important as it is for underrotating the second jump of a triple-triple combo. (Because for a solo jump the GOE is taken off at the discounted rate of a double jump.)

This is a good point.

Underrotating the second jump of a 3-3 combination has a comparable, significant, effect on the base mark as would underrotating a solo jump. Well, a solo 3T or 3Lo, whichever the second jump of the combo was.

But the effect of the GOE is more severe for the combination, because the GOEs, positive or negative, are at the values that apply to the higher value jump of the combination, which in this case is still a triple. So the values of the pluses and minuses will be larger.

Under the old rules, the GOE from all judges for a combination with one underrotated jump had to be negative, even if the jump looked good from the judges' point of view and the other jump looked great. A judge might be thinking +1 or +2 for a combination, and then see the downgrade and have to change the GOE to -1. That would be a difference of 2.0 to 3.0 whole points if all the judges thought the combination was that good before learning of the downgrade.

Under the new rules, they will now be allowed to give those +1 and +2 GOEs. Sure, the base value of the combination will still lose a significant number of points with one of the intended triples now counted as a double. But positive GOE would soften the loss of points.

Of course, if the judges do see the underrotation, they will need to reduce the GOE from what they would have given otherwise. Most combinations with one jump underrotated will still get negative GOE, or 0 GOE at best. But the potential is there for positive GOE -- the good qualities of the rest of the combo can compensate in part for the downgrade.
 

feraina

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
Of course, if the judges do see the underrotation, they will need to reduce the GOE from what they would have given otherwise. Most combinations with one jump underrotated will still get negative GOE, or 0 GOE at best. But the potential is there for positive GOE -- the good qualities of the rest of the combo can compensate in part for the downgrade.

I wonder if this will particularly benefit those who do 3R as the second jump, who haven't had any luck recently with them not being downgraded. Mao & Miki in particular. The combos look very impressive in real time, and in general more impressive than combos with 3T as last jump, and yet they get hit time and again. I would love to see these combos given a little more credit.
 

Particle Man

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Here's how I list them based on many previous comps and showing clean or close to clean programs. The Ladies I look to be this seasons' would-be champions.

Mao Asada
YuNa Kim
Joannie Rochette
Yukuri Nakano
Rachel Flatt
Alena Leonova
Sarah Meier

Skaters I see who are not as competitive

Laura Lepisto
Fumie Suguri
Elene Gedevanishvili
Alissa Czisney
Carolina Kostner
Caroline Zhang
Ashley Wagner
Kimmie Meissner

...... Now I feel better about arguing with you so often. :rofl:

Lepisto was European champ. Less competitive than Sarah Meier uwhwuwhwuhw HUH?? Caroline Zhang, again - what are you thinking? She's been on par with Rachael, at least.

Also, try to get the spelling of the names right. I mean, come on.

Rachael Flatt
Alissa Czisny
Yukari Nakano

And this was really posted today? No Sasha listed? You must think she is getting injured because other than that possibility, she's likely the most competitive we have.

Oh, and Mirai Nagasu, our 2008 ladies national champion does in fact still exist, and will in fact be skating. Again, you must be assuming continuing injury, but nothing I have heard would indicate last season's injuries will continue into this season. She should certainly be LISTED as she is often right up there with Rachael and Caroline, beat them at '08 Nationals and elsewhere and has plenty of potential to "bring it."

Lastly -- clean programs don't really "mean" anything anymore.
 
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Joined
Jul 11, 2003
...... Now I feel better about arguing with you so often. :rofl:

Lepisto was European champ. Less competitive than Sarah Meier uwhwuwhwuhw HUH?? Caroline Zhang, again - what are you thinking? She's been on par with Rachael, at least.

Also, try to get the spelling of the names right. I mean, come on.

Rachael Flatt
Alissa Czisny
Yukari Nakano

And this was really posted today? No Sasha listed? You must think she is getting injured because other than that possibility, she's likely the most competitive we have.

Oh, and Mirai Nagasu, our 2008 ladies national champion does in fact still exist, and will in fact be skating. Again, you must be assuming continuing injury, but nothing I have heard would indicate last season's injuries will continue into this season. She should certainly be LISTED as she is often right up there with Rachael and Caroline, beat them at '08 Nationals and elsewhere and has plenty of potential to "bring it."

Lastly -- clean programs don't really "mean" anything anymore.
hmmm. you have not made a list of youe inconsistent skaters. That's ok. Just use their few and far between good ones.

And btw, thanks for the spelling tip. I'm just not consistent.
 

christinaskater

Medalist
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
For me

Yu-Na Kim with a slight edge
but her chief rival is right there with her,
Mao Asada has discovered the right combination that would score big and really put her alongside with Yu-Na. It's a grand showdown between 2 of the finest women in history in my opinion! Both ladies are exquisite in every way!


---------
(spoilers of the top 2 ladies)!

Miki Ando- this girl is in the spotlight, but not in the intense spotlight and pressure that Yu-Na or Mao has. She is a world-champion and has thrived in pressure and she certainly knows how to deliver. She has grown so much through the years and has become one of the best in the world. This girl is one of the girls who can win or medal!

Sasha Cohen- this girl is extraordinary, she is theater on ice! I love her dramatic flair, extension, everything!

Joannie Rochette- hometown girl, this is it for it, it's either she succumbs to the pressure of skating at home turf or she soars at the opportunity! It's make or break for her. A golden and inspired skate will spell wonders


Carolina Kostner- love her or hate her, Carolina's jumps when landed properly and when she is in on, are some of the best in the world. She is a champion waiting to happen. Her footwork is considered one of the best if not the best among the ladies in the COP. This is another dark horse in there


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Caroline Zhang- could be one of the stars this year, but i think she is deemed for World titles after the Yu-Na and Mao era together with Mirai. If she or Mirai can transform to a lady this year and really showcase maturity , adult artistry and really transform which both ladies are capable of doing and consistently land 3-3's then Caroline can challenge the top ladies! A medal is possible if she really breaks through this season. I think very soon, she will be rewarded for her consistency and clean programs!


Rachael Flatt is also gorgeous, hope to really see her transform this season together with Mirai!!!! Hope Frank does her wonders for Mirai, the way he did with Michelle and Evan!


Yukari Nakano- I hope to see her comeback and show them all what she is capable of doing. I see her in the top 5 if she really skates well, who knows maybe grab a medal there!
 
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