Grand Prix 2009 Entries are up! | Page 8 | Golden Skate

Grand Prix 2009 Entries are up!

LeCygne

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
I'm facebook friends with Caroline, and her status since Saturday is "Oh no..."

Coincidence? I think not.

from the source herself, there ya go. Yes, USFSA has no love for Caro.

I noticed that too. Poor girl, and she just had her sweet sixteen.. :disapp:

Sorry to be so gloomy, but this GP layout is a disaster for her, and as a devoted Caroline fan, I'm preparing myself early not to be disappointed with whatever the outcome. With Caroline herself, I will be happy just as long as she skates her best.

As for whoever mentioned her skating for another federation, as a high-profile US skater with international medals, USFSA could easily refuse to release her for many years, to make sure that not only she can't skate this Olympics, but not pose a threat at the next Olympics. I don't remember the exact rules, but I remember cases of skaters not being released for many years, and they weren't as successful as OO. Ironically, I think USFSA might value her more in absence.

Yeah, me too. Even though I know it's probably not likely, I still can't help but hope...

I've often thought about her switching federations... I'm sure China would love to have her (and USFSA would see what they're missing) but I didn't know that she had to actually be released by USFSA... How does this work exactly?
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
For heaven's sake, Caroline Zhang just turned 16. Her skating career is just in its infancy. She will only be 20 for Sochi, and by then she should be a polished skater with a real shot at the podium.


As other posters have pointed out, Rachael got off 'easy' in the GP because she is a seeded skater and never has to face more than one other seed at her two events. And she is a seeded skater because she finished 5th at Worlds. The USFS obviously picked her as one of the seeds for SA, and had very little say as to where her second assignment would be.

The USFS did not pick Caroline for SA because they wanted both Caroline and Rachael to have a shot at making the GPF. Unfortunately, the USFS cannot control how the other federations issue invitations. Caroline just got unlucky with her assignments, but there is no evidence that USFS 'doesn't like' her.

Caroline needs to focus on skating the best she can in the GP, and finishing as high as possible at US Nationals. If she doesn't make it to Vancouver, she will likely get to skate at Worlds 2010, and become a seeded skater for the 2010-2011 season.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
For heaven's sake, Caroline Zhang just turned 16. Her skating career is just in its infancy. She will only be 20 for Sochi, and by then she should be a polished skater with a real shot at the podium.

I think it is a big mistake for skaters to bank on what they are going to do four years from now. They might be out of the sport by then -- or another sixteen-year-old might have shouldered them aside.

Today's the day! :)
 
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fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
i found out something interesting, i don't know if it happened before because I didn't look into it.

But the 6 countries that went to the World Team Last Year got most of the spots.
(I am including the TBA in it as of this time in June , it might change by August and when the Grand prix series start).

For example of the 72 spots for women,

The US claimed 18, Canada claimed 7, Japan, 11 , Russia 4, China 4 , France 4 for a total of 48 spots which left 24 spots over which Finland got 6.

For the 72 spots of Men

The US claimed 16, Canada claimed 11, Japan claimed 9, Russia claimed 7, China 5, and France 8 for a total of 56 which left 16 spots for the other countries .

For the 48 spots of Pairs

The US claimed 10, Canada 10, Japan 1, Russia 9, China 8, France 4 which totaled 42 spots which left only 6 spots for the other countries and their went to
Germany, Great Britian, Ukraine and Estonia.

For the 60 spots of Dance

The US claimed 13, Canada 8, Japan 1, Russia 11, China 3 and France 7 which totaled to 43 spots which left 17 spots open for the other countries
which Italy got 4,
As I stated earlier this includes the TBA and I didn't break it down to how many specific skater 9 girl etc. I just did the open spots for the countries and counted them. I found it interesting that the bulk of the spots went to the countries who went to the World Team and the US snagged the most.
It went US took 57 spots of the four disciplines
Canada took 36 spots of the four disciplines.
Russia took 31 spots of the four disciplines.
France took 23 spots of the four disciplines
Japan took 22 spots of the four disciplines.
China took 20 spots of the four disciplines.


the next 3 highest were Italy with 8 spots of the four displines
Germany with 7 spots of the four displines.
Czechklovia with 6 spots with only spots in men and dance
Finland with 6 spots all of them in girls,.

I just find this interesting that is all.
 

Sylvia

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 25, 2003
I found it interesting that the bulk of the spots went to the countries who went to the World Team and the US snagged the most.
Those 6 countries that competed at the WTT are also the host countries of the 6 GPs and pay the bulk of the costs for holding the events. I haven't done the math, but I'm sure the USA had the most guaranteed spots in the 4 disciplines according to the ISU's GP selection guidelines.
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
I think it is a big mistake for skaters to bank on what they are going to do four years from now. They might out of the sport by then -- or another sixteen-year-old might have shouldered them aside.

Today's the day! :)
Poor Caroline! She's only 16, but she has no future in the sport. :laugh:

(It would be interesting to compare the Soviet and Chinese systems, where baby athletes were plucked out of their cradles and trained with a very long view. Overall those systems got pretty good results, no?)
 

feraina

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
(It would be interesting to compare the Soviet and Chinese systems, where baby athletes were plucked out of their cradles and trained with a very long view. Overall those systems got pretty good results, no?)

Hmm, well, do you mean the successful Chinese ladies' skating team, or the Chinese ladies' gymnastics team that's filled with mature ladies trained with a very long view? ;)
 

Nadine

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 3, 2003
My opinion - I really don't get all the doom & gloom - have faith.

The GP hasn't even officially started yet, and all these questionable scenarios when no one even knows how each will skate, at least not until the first competition of the season. And not even then, as anything can happen, good or bad, it's just the way it goes, that's life.

That said, I believe ALL skaters should have as much tough competition as possible ~ face the best of the best right off the bat, no chickening out, do or die ~ it will only make them stronger, push them, make them work harder on their weak spots. In order to defeat the best you have to be the best. Sooner or later they all have to meet, thus better to meet sooner versus later.

I recall the Grand Prix season before the 2002 Olympics, and how Sarah Hughes was virtually written off, but that didn't stop her from medalling at each assignment, finally culminating in her *first* win against the best of the best (aka Kwan & Slutskaya) at Skate Canada. From then on she made the GPF, finishing with a respectable third place, nicely followed up by another hard-fought third place finish at Nationals, securing her place on the Olympic Team. Each assignment only made her tougher/stronger, pushed her to skate all out, throwing in the most difficult of elements that she knew she needed in order to defeat the top 2.

I see the same scenario now -- ALL skaters are gunning against the top 2 (aka Yuna Kim & Mao Asada) -- so it is only fitting that they get the honor to compete against them, rightfully so. If one is chosen by their federation to compete against them, that says something, it says their federation thinks they are good enough to do so. I feel sorry for the ones that were *not* given that type of consideration/honor. But then again, it could push them as well, hmm...:agree:
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
Hmm, well, do you mean the successful Chinese ladies' skating team, or the Chinese ladies' gymnastics team that's filled with mature ladies trained with a very long view? ;)
Hee-hee. I was actually thinking of that secret Chinese armory deep in the Mongolian highlands where they hide all their international medals in golf, table tennis, and pairs skating.

But a shout-out to Yan Liu and the mini-gymnasts! :clap:
 

gocaroline

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
As other posters have pointed out, Rachael got off 'easy' in the GP because she is a seeded skater and never has to face more than one other seed at her two events. And she is a seeded skater because she finished 5th at Worlds. The USFS obviously picked her as one of the seeds for SA, and had very little say as to where her second assignment would be.
I agree here. But what about other US ladies in GP, why Caroline have to be at TEB?
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
In my opinion too much is made of trying to strategize your way into the finals, and not enough attention is paid to the events themselves.

The original five events (Canada, USA, France, Germany and Japan) were prestigious international invitational figure skating competitions long before the Grand Prix was so much as a gleam in $peedy's eye. Skate Canada is the oldest, dating to 1973.

It was an honor to be invited to any of them. (And yes, U.S. champions Alissa Czisny, Jeremy Abbott, and Davis and White have every reason to feel snubbed that they were not invited to Skate America this year. :disagree: ) Medalling was a prestigious accomplishment in its own right, not just a means of gathering points for some other purpose. Winners of Skate America include Scott Hamilton, Brian Boitano, Todd Eldredge (5 times) and Michelle Kwan (7). The winners of the first German event (1990) were Kurt Browning and Kristi Yamaguchi.

Before Alissa Czisny won U.S. Nationals last year, she was always introduced in exhibitions as, "the winner of the 2005 Skate Canada!"

In 1995 the five federations decided to get together for the purpose of sharing television revenue and pooling prize money. Up until then, they were just five separate events, each organized and produced by its own national federation.

But once that "pooled television money" idea arose, in swooped Speedy. In 1996 the ISU arrogated all television rights for these events to itself and came up with the "Championship Series," which two years later was renamed the Grand Prix of Figure Skating.

It's all about the Benjamins.
 

feraina

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
I agree about the U.S. Champions should be feeling snubbed for not being invited to SA. But at least it happened to three out of four disciplines, so nobody should feel especially slighted.

Before Alissa Czisny won U.S. Nationals last year, she was always introduced in exhibitions as, "the winner of the 2005 Skate Canada!"

But how else could she have been introduced? Silver medalist from 2005 SA, 6th from 2005 GPF, Bronze medalist from 2007 US championships, or 15th place form 2007 World's? ;)
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
I agree here. But what about other US ladies in GP, why Caroline have to be at TEB?

France doesn't have any competitive ladies, so for this event, they seemed to pick the ladies with the most audience appeal, and that included Caroline. The French federation may have drawn first in the picking order, and that's why they grabbed so many of the top ladies.
 

Alicja

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 17, 2009
As other posters have pointed out, Rachael got off 'easy' in the GP because she is a seeded skater and never has to face more than one other seed at her two events. And she is a seeded skater because she finished 5th at Worlds. The USFS obviously picked her as one of the seeds for SA, and had very little say as to where her second assignment would be.

The USFS did not pick Caroline for SA because they wanted both Caroline and Rachael to have a shot at making the GPF. Unfortunately, the USFS cannot control how the other federations issue invitations. Caroline just got unlucky with her assignments, but there is no evidence that USFS 'doesn't like' her.

:agree: I couldn't have said it any better. Thanks for given some her a reality check.
 

wishmaker

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
Gee, MATHMAN. Thanks for being around to explain and make things more understandable. I feel so frustrated. I used to only watch the figure skaters and see who will get into the podium, but gradually the curiosity of knowing more about the how, the who, the why, and the when makes me realize that the people involved/running figure skating is just like any system with so much politics. I really appreciate all your informative comments/discussions where at least my thoughts on skating is placed on the right perspective of infos
 

wishmaker

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 4, 2009
And may I add my thoughts on the competitors of the GP. Well, with the COMEBACKS, I sure wish they can compete. We all know how they were before and doing shows during their absence from competitions. Now they say that they will compete again and so much long discussions about their coming back and promotions for their image. Enough of the blah blahs and they should show that they are deserving. With the CURRENT SKATERS, kudos to them for still being around always improving to the very difficult/strict requirements of the current judging system.The judging system during the COMEBACKS' time is very different from the current judging system. All the minute/detailed deductions of the current system is so demanding. And one should not ignore the psyche/mental aspect of it all when they are on the ice. So, good luck to all the competitors and special mention to the COMEBACKS because they have to prove to themselves, the people and their fans that with all the years of absence and the change of the judging system, they are still competitive and that they still exist.
 

seniorita

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2008
nice post :)
but i have to confess that while reading it, it honestly gave me some shivers:laugh:The comebacks sounded like androids of a philip dick novel ready to invade the human figure skating world:rofl:
THE COMEBACKS..brrrr:eek:
 
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Buttercup

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
nice post :)
but i have to confess that while reading it, it honestly gave me some shivers:laugh:The comebacks sounded like androids of a philip dick novel ready to invade the human figure skating world:rofl:
THE COMEBACKS..brrrr:eek:
So, Plushy has been a master of the quads (I dissented, you'll recall), an X-man (I believe we chose Mystique) and is now an android? What's next, a cyborg?

seniorita, are you sure you're a Plushenko fan :biggrin:?
 
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