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Thread: Caroline Zhang's 2009-10 season

  1. #1651
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluelutz View Post
    And as her jumping tchnique was developed for jumping without the speed, if she adds more speed, she messes up with them. In order to compete, she has to keep using her false technique. Then she will never be able to fix it, or never have enough time to fix it, I guess.
    Wow, bluelutz, this is the best post I've seen that pretty much tells the whole story.

    Let me sum it up.

    1.) Skater is used to performing her choreography, transitions, and executing her jumps with slow skating.

    2.) Skater speeds up her skating, but can't sustain jumps, choreography, and transitions with the new speed.

    In conclusion: Opting for speed has ruined her skating as a whole. The jumps are unreliable, the interpretation and execution of choreography has become significantly worse. The overall quality of the skating has suffered.

    To her credit, yes, Caroline has seriously attempted to introduce speed into her skating, but lost her contender status as a result. What she needs to do now, other than recovering her jumps, is to relearn to pay attention to choreography: skate with subtlety, sensitivity, and express the music. As is, she's too tense and nervous to do that. Attempting to skate with more power has robbed her of calm and composure.

  2. #1652
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    also --hate to say it-but score wise-- i knew it and stated earlier what she would get at beginning of season.
    figure skating is all politics.
    that being stated- zhang didn't skate like she should of.

  3. #1653
    Banned janetfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    Wow, bluelutz, this is the best post I've seen that pretty much tells the whole story.

    Let me sum it up.

    1.) Skater is used to performing her choreography, transitions, and executing her jumps with slow skating.

    2.) Skater speeds up her skating, but can't sustain jumps, choreography, and transitions with the new speed.

    In conclusion: Opting for speed has ruined her skating as a whole. The jumps are unreliable, the interpretation and execution of choreography has become significantly worse. The overall quality of the skating has suffered.

    To her credit, yes, Caroline has seriously attempted to introduce speed into her skating, but lost her contender status as a result. What she needs to do now, other than recovering her jumps, is to relearn to pay attention to choreography: skate with subtlety, sensitivity, and express the music. As is, she's too tense and nervous to do that. Attempting to skate with more power has robbed her of calm and composure.
    Caroline grew and what worked for her at 4'10 and 75 lbs is no longer good.

  4. #1654
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fairly4 View Post
    that being stated- zhang didn't skate like she should of.
    duh! and because of it she didn't get the score she would have had she skated well.

  5. #1655
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    Caroline grew and what worked for her at 4'10 and 75 lbs is no longer good.
    Which is why she should go to Frank Carol and fix her jumps like Mirai has done. I don't know if she could handle him as a coach though, it seems like she likes to do things her way.

  6. #1656
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    Nagasu and Zhang were in a similar boat back in 2007.

    One of those skaters made a tough decision and decided to start from the beginning. The other kept the status quo.

    Guess which one is in contention now?

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    Which is why she should go to Frank Carol and fix her jumps like Mirai has done. I don't know if she could handle him as a coach though, it seems like she likes to do things her way.
    I don't think Frank would take Caroline: 1) he already has Mirai, a direct competitor, also Carolina Kostner. 2) he won't put up with her wanting to do "things her way." I've heard Frank's pretty clear from the outset with his skaters, it's his way or go elsewhere for coaching.

  8. #1658
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    Nagasu and Zhang were in a similar boat back in 2007.

    One of those skaters made a tough decision and decided to start from the beginning. The other kept the status quo.

    Guess which one is in contention now?
    Well to be fair, Caroline has a lot more stuff to fix than Mirai ever did, that's something I have to say for the record, just to point out that their situations were not as similar as they may seem.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    I don't think Frank would take Caroline: 1) he already has Mirai, a direct competitor, also Carolina Kostner. 2) he won't put up with her wanting to do "things her way." I've heard Frank's pretty clear from the outset with his skaters, it's his way or go elsewhere for coaching.
    Yes, but is Frank Carroll the only coach on the world who can help someone fix their jump technique?
    Last edited by Tonichelle; 01-23-2010 at 03:53 PM. Reason: please please please I beg all of you, use the multiquote feature

  9. #1659
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    Well to be fair, Caroline has a lot more stuff to fix than Mirai ever did, that's something I have to say for the record, just to point out that their situations were not as similar as they may seem.



    Yes, but is Frank Carroll the only coach on the world who can help someone fix their jump technique?
    Alissa went to someone else. Her jumps are still problematic but the technique is definitely better now. I don't think Caroline wants to move to the midwest though. What about Rafael Artunian?

  10. #1660
    Beliver in Sasha's Perfect Program Tinymavy15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    Alissa went to someone else. Her jumps are still problematic but the technique is definitely better now. I don't think Caroline wants to move to the midwest though. What about Rafael Artunian?
    Alissa is a case of nerves and unless the pressure is 100% off she won't skate clean.
    I do think that Rafael is the best choice for Caroline right now. He made improvements with Mao's jumps and now that Sasha is no longer working with him, I he has no other big name pupils, so she will get a lot of attention. Moving to Lake Arrowhead would still get her away from her mother and sister but she could still go back on weekends and stuff...far less drastic than moving across country.

    Caroline needs a change. I think it may be too late, but she certainly can't stay where she is.

  11. #1661
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinymavy15 View Post
    Alissa is a case of nerves and unless the pressure is 100% off she won't skate clean.
    I do think that Rafael is the best choice for Caroline right now. He made improvements with Mao's jumps and now that Sasha is no longer working with him, I he has no other big name pupils, so she will get a lot of attention. Moving to Lake Arrowhead would still get her away from her mother and sister but she could still go back on weekends and stuff...far less drastic than moving across country.

    Caroline needs a change. I think it may be too late, but she certainly can't stay where she is.
    If Caroline moves away from home, school will not be a problem because she takes online courses. But even if she comes home weekends, she will need to stay in a hotel or apartment. Can her family afford that? I know she taped at least 2 commercials over the summer and fall, but did they pay enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tinymavy15 View Post
    Caroline needs a change. I think it may be too late, but she certainly can't stay where she is.
    No not too late. Caroline is 9 years younger than Sasha.
    Last edited by PolymerBob; 01-23-2010 at 05:23 PM.

  12. #1662
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    Well to be fair, Caroline has a lot more stuff to fix than Mirai ever did, that's something I have to say for the record, just to point out that their situations were not as similar as they may seem.


    Yes, but is Frank Carroll the only coach on the world who can help someone fix their jump technique?
    First statement (my bolding) is true. Mirai's issues were fewer, but she was more willing to change status quo and do something about them.

    Second statement (my bolding): Of course not, I was merely responding to another poster's suggestion of Frank. Caroline apparently had a visit (tryout? interview?) with Callaghan in 2009 but one or both of them decided that wasn't the route to take. The thing is, ANY of the top level technical coaches (Laws, Callaghan, Carroll, Arutunian, Barkell in Canada, etc.) are not going to put up with anything less than doing it their way. Or less than 110% effort from their skater. Or interference from Mama or other family member/agent of skater. In fact, I thought Carroll, once upon a time, either dumped or refused to coach Tiffany Chin (or was it Ann-Patrice Mc Donough??) because her mother was such a piece of work to have to deal with. And top coaches who already are committed to other elite ladies/competitors of Caroline probably won't take her on.

    Also: if Caroline doesn't pull up substantially after the FS, she will likely fall from Team Envelope B down to C or Reserve, though I can't remember the criteria right now. That means less USFS funding. While the funding relative to total skating costs is a drop in the bucket, heading downward on the Envelopes is never the right direction to be going.
    Last edited by bigsisjiejie; 01-23-2010 at 06:32 PM.

  13. #1663
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    Quote Originally Posted by PolymerBob View Post
    If Caroline moves away from home, school will not be a problem because she takes online courses. But even if she comes home weekends, she will need to stay in a hotel or apartment. Can her family afford that? I know she taped at least 2 commercials over the summer and fall, but did they pay enough?



    No not too late. Caroline is 9 years younger than Sasha.
    I think Caroline comes from a wealthy family. I read on NBC that her dad is a vice president of some big deal company, and I know the town she lives in (Brea, Orange County) is expensive. She does need to do something though and now would actually be a good time because she's probably done with most of her growing.

  14. #1664
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    Caroline does have problems that must be fixed, but the biggest problem right now is her injuries. She had the same problems early last year when she was top American at 4CC and World Team Trophy. I know she is still hurt because she left out her pearl spin.

    What she needs to do after tonight is let her injuries totally heal. She should stay off the ice for a while, hit the gym, build up her strength, get back into training when she can and hit the Grand Prix hard next season.

  15. #1665
    Alexei he's my MAN Panther2000's Avatar
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    Caroline is a lovely skater that has truly great talent.

    However, I don't think that she has taken her growth very well. She must almost start over & forget what she has done in the past & start anew. She hasn't made the adjustment.

    I think that like others have stated. She needs to go home & truly heel from her injuries & I think talk to a sports dr. ( Like Alexi Y did) to get her head in the right space( That is key. I think that she lacks drive right now). During her long you could just look at her face & see her counting off the items in her program. Ther was no feel for the music or the crowd. just getting through the program. That wild leg kick is really throwing her off.

    She is one of my fav skaters because of her talent. I really hope that she can get through this & Come back a New person next year.

    I will say this though, She did appear to do much better toward the end of her program.

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