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Thread: JGP Budapest, HUN (Aug. 26-29, 2009)

  1. #46
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzz View Post
    Thanks to everyone for postings the results and links etc.


    P.S.
    I would really like to know where Russia is getting all these rocking juniors in gymnastics and figure skating from.
    Well it's not like Russia doesn't know how to develop good figure skaters or gymnasts. :lol: They practically made gymnastics what it is today, and well were a huge part of skating. The problem was after the Soviet Union lots of coaches left, there was no more funding or free lessons etc. Parents couldn't afford to get their kids lessons.

    Now though things are a lot better. The government is getting back into the business of really funding sports like skating and gymnastics. Wages are up so a lot of Russian coaches in gymnastics and figure skating are moving back to Russia.
    Last edited by bekalc; 08-29-2009 at 07:02 PM.

  2. #47
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    I am happy for Angela for getting the silver. But only 136 points? She will need to do better if she wants to turn senior.

  3. #48
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    Do you mean Senior Grand Prix? Angela moved up last season and skated Senior Ladies at 2009 Nationals this past January. She did however skate on the Junior Grand Prix last season.

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    I saw a video of the Ladies medal ceremony, and it was a bit off-putting. Shelepen came out and bowed and got on the podium. Then Angela Maxwell came out and got in her spot. She looked over at Shelepen, who pointedly ignored her. Then Haruka Imai. Angela said something to Haruka, but Shelepen ignored both of them.

    When Shelepen was awarded her medal, both Angela and Haruka applauded her. But when Angela's and Haruka's medals were awarded, Shelepen continued to pretend they weren't there.

    Looks like Shelepen is a diva in the making. She is only 13 and is very tall, much like Cynthia Phaneuf at 14-15. Makes me wonder if Shelepen will be able to make a successful transition to Senior skating once she begins to fill out.

  5. #50
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    I saw something completely different. Maxwell didn't even shake Shelepen's hand, for example. I think Shelepen probably didn't know what to do.

    You're coming off as rather bitter.

    Shelepen has nice height and rotation in her jumps, better than most. Who knows what the puberty monster will do to her, but her jumps have actually improved from last year, and she has grown a lot.

  6. #51
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    When Shelepen was awarded her medal, both Angela and Haruka applauded her. But when Angela's and Haruka's medals were awarded, Shelepen continued to pretend they weren't there.

    Looks like Shelepen is a diva in the making. She is only 13 and is very tall, much like Cynthia Phaneuf at 14-15. Makes me wonder if Shelepen will be able to make a successful transition to Senior skating once she begins to fill out.
    What Oleada said. Angela should have gone over there and congratulated Polina. That's the protocol. Then Imai should have gone over there and congratulated Angela and Polina. I bet Polina didn't know what to do. Angela and Imai though, THEY were the ones who had been in that situation before.

    Polina seems like if she doesn't get too tall that she make the transition because she seems to have a very long legged ballerina type body. The only issue is she seriously needs to work on her arms and positions because she looks messy. I don't think she should be written off as hopeless like some have already done, but she needs some serious work there.
    Last edited by bekalc; 08-31-2009 at 11:01 AM.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by bekalc View Post
    Honestly, though I was shocked that none of the girls went and congratulated Polina before they got on the stand. That was kind of bad sportsmanship on their part. So who knows. The girl may not have been thinking and didn't mean anything by it.

    This being said while Polina is talented she really needs to work on her artistry. Her positions are not great and her arms need serious work.
    I agree with all you said.

    I'm not sure if Shelepen's artistry will be improved by her current coach - maybe she needs some imput from someone like TAT or so, who has been involved with Adelina Sotnikova, who has lovely arms and artistry. Her programs are DIRE and I think she needs more accessible music. Given the chance and the right vehicles, she could be very good. I mean, Angela Maxwell wasn't known for her huge PCS, and she improved so much artistically in the past season or so. Look at her now and then and it's a huge change. Yu-Na Kim was rather awkward when she first competed as a Junior, and now she's an amazing artist.

    OTOH, it's probably better to develop the solid basics first and then work on the finer details.

  8. #53
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    . Yu-Na Kim was rather awkward when she first competed as a Junior, and now she's an amazing artist.

    OTOH, it's probably better to develop the solid basics first and then work on the finer details.
    The thing is though Yu-na always had lovely arms. But yes, I don't know what Polina's coach is doing but at the very least they can work with their arms. It's good though that she has those solid basics, which even I can see she has. Someone in the Russian Federation needs to intervene NOW.. Because with better presentation that girl can be very competive, very very soon.

    Russia has some talents coming up, so really if she wants to make big teams, she has to improve this for her own sake. To write her of at 14, look at how much Ashley's arms have improved, is ridiculous though.

  9. #54
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    Yeah, writing her off at 14 is very premature. And she was not unfairly marked in the PCS. Her PCS scores were lower than Maxwell, Imai's and I think Ovcharova's in both programs.
    Last edited by oleada; 08-31-2009 at 11:17 AM.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Looks like Shelepen is a diva in the making.
    Try to understand her. This girl is only 14 and it was her first international podium. People who knows her say that she is shy, so I think she just didn't know what to do.
    Just read at the russian forum that Polina was too nervious in Budapest and people who was there and saw her didn't expect that she would skate clean. But she did it

  11. #56
    Tripping on the Podium Narumi1997's Avatar
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    About the Diva/Attitude thing:
    I agree with everyone that Polina might not have known what to do. It's her first itnl competition. I don't know if I'm right but the only other major competition that Polina was a medallist was Russian JR ntnls in 2008. So maybe it's just inexperience in major competition podiums.

    A little off topic here:
    I just realized Polina and Angela share the same birthday but different year (July 28)

  12. #57
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    I am certainly NOT writing Shelepen off. She may signal a new beginning for Russia in ladies' skating and go on to become a great champion. But too many times in the past we have seen young Russian ladies make a big splash at 13-15, and then disappear.

    Some examples:

    In 1995, Irina Slutskaya was JW Champion and Yelena Ivanova won silver. In 1996, Yelena Ivanova, Yelena Pingatcheva and Nadezhda Kanaeva swept the JW podium. In 1997, Yelena Sokolova and Yelena Ivanova on JW silver and bronze. In 1998, a Russian sweep again with Yulia Soldatova, Yelena Ivanova and Viktoria Volchkova. In 1999, Daria Timochenko, skating for Russia, was the JW Champion, and Kristina Oblasova won the 2001 JW Championship.

    Out of all those promising young Russian ladies, only 3--Slutskaya, Sokolova and Soldatova--made it to the World podium, and only Slutskaya became a multiple World and European champion and a major star.

    And then there were Olga Naidenova and Veronika Kropotina, each of whom won multiple medals on the JGP, but never had any impact at the Senior level. And remember Liudmila Nelidina, who landed a ratified 3A in the GP? She had jumps but nothing more, and quickly faded out of sight.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    I am certainly NOT writing Shelepen off. She may signal a new beginning for Russia in ladies' skating and go on to become a great champion. But too many times in the past we have seen young Russian ladies make a big splash at 13-15, and then disappear.

    Some examples:

    In 1995, Irina Slutskaya was JW Champion and Yelena Ivanova won silver. In 1996, Yelena Ivanova, Yelena Pingatcheva and Nadezhda Kanaeva swept the JW podium. In 1997, Yelena Sokolova and Yelena Ivanova on JW silver and bronze. In 1998, a Russian sweep again with Yulia Soldatova, Yelena Ivanova and Viktoria Volchkova. In 1999, Daria Timochenko, skating for Russia, was the JW Champion, and Kristina Oblasova won the 2001 JW Championship.

    Out of all those promising young Russian ladies, only 3--Slutskaya, Sokolova and Soldatova--made it to the World podium, and only Slutskaya became a multiple World and European champion and a major star.

    And then there were Olga Naidenova and Veronika Kropotina, each of whom won multiple medals on the JGP, but never had any impact at the Senior level. And remember Liudmila Nelidina, who landed a ratified 3A in the GP? She had jumps but nothing more, and quickly faded out of sight.
    Ladies single skating never had enough of support and attention from FS federation in Russia, coaches worked with pairs and boys more, few years ago Mishin said that "one not as talanted boy is better than two very talanted girls" (but then he found Liza Tuktamysheva ). Now it seems that situation's changed. There're 3 talanted girls, our hopes for Sochi 2014, they have enough of support and attention, I don't know if all of them will be big names in future, but now they have all of the chances for that, so let's just wait and see...

    P.S. As I know, Oblasova and Kropotina stopped skating because of injuries

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    Well, that's the way it goes - the strongest survives. The field was deep these years, it was extremely difficult, if not impossible, to get into Russian ladies team in late 90s and early 2000s. So those girls may have lost hope, some tried to switch countries, some quitted (aside from possible health and growth troubles). That happens when the field is extremely deep. It's likely what will happen in USA with current youngsters - the majority of those who dominate junior field these days would most likely fade away. There won't be enough place for all of them.

  15. #60
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    I am certainly NOT writing Shelepen off. She may signal a new beginning for Russia in ladies' skating and go on to become a great champion. But too many times in the past we have seen young Russian ladies make a big splash at 13-15, and then disappear.
    Well the writing Shelepen off was not directed at you but rather at someone else, to be quite frank. But I do think it was ridiculous what you wrote about her behavior on the stands. Especially since the girl actually did look at Imai a couple of times and neither Angela or Imai clapped that much...Angela barely at all for Imai.

    But as for the Russians who disappear, it's not just Russia. What really happened to Jenny Kirk, Ann Patrice, the young Japanese junior world championg Ota, was it? This stuff happens all the freakin time. It's especially difficult when a country has top stars like Russia did in the late ninty's/2000s well it's hard to make the team.

    Russia is going to invest a lot into those kids, and yes I think puberty might factor in BUT, I think one or two will probably last. As for Polina her body type so far reminds me of Kim and Asadas, she's very long legged. I 'm just way more concerned that Polina about Polina's presentation at this point.

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