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Thread: Stats for men from 2008-09 season

  1. #1
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Stats for men from 2008-09 season

    Hi. I'm compiling some element-wise stats from last season.

    As I've said to ButterCup, I'm making a separate thread for men.
    two reasons:
    1. On both thread, I hope to add more stats for different elments. So I dont want to make them too crowded with already boring numbers.
    2. I just feel men/ladies have somewhat different fan base.

    OK. first one is of course ... the JUMPs.

    Methods are almost same as ladies.
    Jump scores of 10 international events last season.
    (6 GPs, GPF, EC, FC, and WC)
    Exclude any 'invalid' jumps. (a.k.a marked as '*', there were 9 of'em)
    List men who got marks at least more than 11 times.

    Of course, columns are same as ladies.
    From left, average_points, maximum_points, average_GOE, maximum_GOE.
    And I ordered it by higher-POINT-first. (think it's most natural)

    POINT ( max ) | GOE ( max ) | Name
    7.808 ( 15.20 ) | +0.309 ( 1.8 ) | Nobunari ODA
    7.730 ( 13.20 ) | +0.012 ( 1.0 ) | Alban PREAUBERT
    7.604 ( 14.20 ) | +0.231 ( 2.0 ) | Takahiko KOZUKA
    7.577 ( 13.40 ) | +0.552 ( 1.4 ) | Samuel CONTESTI
    7.562 ( 15.20 ) | +0.174 ( 2.0 ) | Brian JOUBERT
    7.234 ( 14.30 ) | -0.579 ( 1.0 ) | Kevin REYNOLDS
    7.223 ( 14.42 ) | +0.192 ( 1.8 ) | Evan LYSACEK
    7.111 ( 11.50 ) | +0.324 ( 2.0 ) | Patrick CHAN
    7.089 ( 14.02 ) | +0.212 ( 1.4 ) | Jeremy ABBOTT
    7.049 ( 15.25 ) | +0.379 ( 1.2 ) | Kevin VAN DER PERREN
    6.925 ( 10.60 ) | -0.441 ( 1.0 ) | Ryan BRADLEY
    6.855 ( 13.23 ) | +0.122 ( 1.6 ) | Johnny WEIR
    6.720 ( 11.00 ) | -0.626 ( 1.2 ) | Brandon MROZ
    6.690 ( 13.60 ) | -0.008 ( 1.6 ) | Takahito MURA
    6.646 ( 11.90 ) | -0.203 ( 2.0 ) | Yannick PONSERO
    6.591 ( 13.80 ) | +0.110 ( 1.6 ) | Denis TEN
    6.407 ( 14.80 ) | -0.065 ( 1.8 ) | Tomas VERNER
    6.394 ( 10.02 ) | +0.068 ( 1.0 ) | Stephen CARRIERE
    6.388 ( 11.20 ) | -0.238 ( 1.2 ) | Jialiang WU
    6.323 ( 12.20 ) | -0.315 ( 1.2 ) | Sergei VORONOV
    6.266 ( 10.70 ) | +0.164 ( 1.8 ) | Shawn SAWYER
    6.196 ( 10.80 ) | -0.147 ( 1.0 ) | Peter LIEBERS
    6.084 ( 11.70 ) | -0.572 ( 1.0 ) | Andrei LUTAI
    6.075 ( 11.80 ) | -0.336 ( 1.8 ) | Jeremy TEN
    6.053 ( 10.30 ) | -0.327 ( 1.4 ) | Javier FERNANDEZ
    6.009 ( 11.00 ) | -0.223 ( 1.6 ) | Vaughn CHIPEUR
    5.975 ( 10.30 ) | -0.601 ( 0.8 ) | Adam RIPPON
    5.932 ( 10.50 ) | -0.011 ( 1.0 ) | Song GAO
    5.692 ( 10.80 ) | -0.520 ( 0.8 ) | Adrian SCHULTHEISS
    5.657 ( 11.70 ) | -0.579 ( 0.4 ) | Gregor URBAS
    5.646 ( 12.20 ) | -0.705 ( 1.0 ) | Alexander USPENSKI
    5.588 ( 13.20 ) | -0.601 ( 1.2 ) | Igor MACYPURA
    5.531 ( 10.50 ) | -0.476 ( 1.0 ) | Michal BREZINA
    5.517 ( 10.10 ) | -0.478 ( 0.6 ) | Przemyslaw DOMANSKI
    5.431 ( 08.40 ) | -0.629 ( 0.4 ) | Ming XU
    5.411 ( 10.40 ) | -0.456 ( 1.0 ) | Artem BORODULIN
    5.362 ( 12.10 ) | -0.355 ( 1.0 ) | Chengjiang LI
    5.236 ( 09.20 ) | -0.579 ( 0.8 ) | Ari-Pekka NURMENKARI
    5.130 ( 11.08 ) | -0.559 ( 1.0 ) | Yasuharu NANRI
    5.104 ( 11.00 ) | -0.078 ( 1.0 ) | Jamal OTHMAN
    5.093 ( 09.22 ) | -1.025 ( 0.4 ) | Abzal RAKIMGALIEV
    5.091 ( 10.50 ) | -0.726 ( 1.0 ) | Anton KOVALEVSKI
    5.083 ( 09.00 ) | -0.811 ( 1.0 ) | Clemens BRUMMER
    5.080 ( 10.80 ) | -0.575 ( 1.0 ) | Kristoffer BERNTSSON
    4.971 ( 10.00 ) | -0.707 ( 0.2 ) | Ian MARTINEZ
    4.831 ( 10.10 ) | -0.841 ( 0.6 ) | Elliot HILTON
    4.785 ( 10.65 ) | -0.673 ( 0.4 ) | Yoann DESLOT
    4.657 ( 10.50 ) | -1.011 ( 1.0 ) | Vladimir USPENSKI
    4.404 ( 09.00 ) | -1.364 ( 0.4 ) | Kensuke NAKANIWA
    4.354 ( 07.30 ) | -0.657 ( 0.4 ) | Boris MARTINEC
    3.963 ( 09.40 ) | -1.164 ( 0.6 ) | Alexander MAJOROV
    3.259 ( 06.40 ) | -1.173 ( 0.0 ) | Kevin ALVES
    3.193 ( 05.00 ) | -0.723 ( 0.4 ) | Justin PIETERSEN
    3.143 ( 05.80 ) | -1.029 ( 0.0 ) | Charles Shou-San PAO
    2.918 ( 05.20 ) | -0.690 ( 0.1 ) | Mark WEBSTER
    2.903 ( 06.30 ) | -0.663 ( 0.8 ) | Luis HERNANDEZ
    2.893 ( 05.80 ) | -1.220 ( 0.0 ) | Nicholas FERNANDEZ
    2.695 ( 04.80 ) | -0.622 ( 0.1 ) | Robert MCNAMARA
    2.632 ( 06.00 ) | -0.970 ( 0.0 ) | Min-Seok KIM
    2.375 ( 05.80 ) | -1.578 ( 0.0 ) | Humberto CONTRERAS
    2.318 ( 04.50 ) | -0.560 ( 0.0 ) | Wun-Chang SHIH

    If you're interested, Ladies page is here.
    http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28745

    Thanks for reading.
    Feel free to comment if you spot any error in my data.

  2. #2
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
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    Thanks for these stats. I love numbers.

    The comparison with the ladies is interesting here. Among the ladies, the top 5 are really the ladies who won something the season, you got Kim-Rochette-Asada in front, followed by other top ladies like Ando etc.

    Among the men, the top four weren't even on the podium at Worlds, heck, Préaubert wasn't at Worlds at all, nor at the Grand Prix Final (!). He had three big international competitions with the Grand Prix and Europeans - where he rotated and landed every jump he attempted. Nobody else did that this season.

    Best overall GOE had Contesti and KVDP, two European jumping machines with great technique. KVDP also had the highest score for a jump element with 15.25, followed by Oda, Joubert (15.2) and Verner (14.8).

    I love this list!

  3. #3
    Yeah! Lets get this party started. enlight78's Avatar
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    thanks again poorscorer . I am really loving these stats.This is incredible..
    The highest point getters are the strong european jumpers + oda lol. He is a great jumper.But the if you look at GOEs
    1 Samuel Contesti
    2 Kevin VDP
    3 Patrick Chan
    4 Oda
    5 Kozuka
    6 Abbot
    7 Evan
    8 Brian

    With he depth in mens ; after looking at the winners, quality and difficulty are equalizers in the playing field. I think the key difference between winning and loosing is PCS.
    There are many solid jumpers on the list who fail to win any major events but they all medaled this passed season. I think in the womens jumps are more of a factor than in the men ironic huh.

    I would love it if you could do a stat list of average tec score (short and Long program) vs highest tec score vs base value

  4. #4
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    Thanks for all the stats, poorScorer! You sure do have a misleading name!

    Are you a member at fsu? If you post your stats there, you might get a wider audience to analyze (and appreciate!) your stats. (If you don't want to post them yourself, I can do it for you, unless you don't want it posted anywhere but GS.)

    Can anyone explain why the ladies are so predictable, but the mens' stats varied?

  5. #5
    "Hold an edge and look sexy!" museksk8r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shallwedansu View Post
    Can anyone explain why the ladies are so predictable, but the mens' stats varied?
    It may have something to do with how inconsistent the men were on the jumps. Case in point, none of the world medalists medaled at the Grand Prix Final. Evan didn't even qualify, Patrick skated disastrously, and Brian withdrew from the Final. To counter, the GPF champ Jeremy finished 11th at Worlds, Kozuka finished 6th, and Weir failed to medal at Nationals to qualify for Worlds.

    Also consider Patrick's difficulties with the 3Axel prior to Worlds (I have a feeling he would win the Footwork stats post though). Brian was really off his game this entire season, particularly in the LP - I believe in every event he skated, he placed 3rd or lower in the LP portion. KVDP's always been known as only a jumper, so no surprise to see him right up there in jump stats (his record also goes to prove that there is a lot more to figure skating than just jumps). Alban is viewed by the judges in much the same way, although I think he has way more personality than Kevin.
    Last edited by museksk8r; 09-09-2009 at 03:00 PM.

  6. #6
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    Brian was really off his game this entire season, particularly in the LP - I believe in every event he skated, he placed 3rd or lower in the LP portion. KVDP's always been known as only a jumper, so no surprise to see him right up there in jump stats (his record also goes to prove that there is a lot more to figure skating than just jumps). Alban is viewed by the judges in much the same way, although I think he has way more personality than Kevin.
    Joubert was second on the LP at Euros (behind Yannick Ponsero). Other than that, third or fourth at every event he entered internationally - but then, Brian has generally been a stronger SP skater throughout his career.

    KvdP does have the advantage of having a reputation as a strong jumper, and a great 2nd half 3-3-3. I usually find Alban more entertaining than most, but he is sloppy compared to the top guys, and his posture is poor.

  7. #7
    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    Alban is viewed by the judges in much the same way, although I think he has way more personality than Kevin.
    He is also faster over the ice, has halfway decent spins and some fun choreography! Really, seeing him trashed by the judges for 4 perfect performances on the Grand Prix, where the LP included a Quad each, and after that, not seeing him at Worlds... I still don't think that that should be allowed to happen, I mean, from an athletic standpoint it just feels wrong.

  8. #8
    "Hold an edge and look sexy!" museksk8r's Avatar
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    It's also a testament to how much more competitive the men are as a whole in comparison to the ladies. The men as a whole are much more intriguing to watch, IMO.

  9. #9
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    I think something like this would be really useful for the press at events here in teh US... it makes sense, in a way, and comparable to baseball and football stats... before a skater takes the ice they can pop up a profile on NBC to show this type of information, making it seem more 'sport like' and give people an idea of what this skater can really do and how they stack up...

  10. #10
    Yeah! Lets get this party started. enlight78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    I think something like this would be really useful for the press at events here in teh US... it makes sense, in a way, and comparable to baseball and football stats... before a skater takes the ice they can pop up a profile on NBC to show this type of information, making it seem more 'sport like' and give people an idea of what this skater can really do and how they stack up...
    Then we can replace all our prediction threads with fantasy figureskating instead.
    lol have no idea how that would work

  11. #11
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    we have fantasy figure skating already via the USFSA's website... it's not as intense as the other sports...

    I see no problem with mainstreaming Figure Skating as a sport... IIRC football and baseball didn't show stats in the detail they do to teh average joe either while I was growing up, now they do.

  12. #12
    Thank God for Stephane Lambiel and Matt Savoie! shine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    It's also a testament to how much more competitive the men are as a whole in comparison to the ladies. The men as a whole are much more intriguing to watch, IMO.
    I agree. Every once in a while we hear posters say something like "The men is not their favourite discipline..." or "I don't really care about the men.." most of the times because they are much more of a ladies fan. And I'm always because the men are just so much more interesting to watch! The ladies really hasn't caught up as far as innovativeness, or even expression, goes.

  13. #13
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    chalk me up as another one who is miffed as to why it's all about the ladies!

  14. #14
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    chalk me up as another one who is miffed as to why it's all about the ladies!
    My feeling is that most of the GS regulars prefer the men (or ice dance) - isn't there a poll that supports this? The only frequent poster I can think of who's a fan of just the ladies is Red Dog.

    Personally, I agree with Shine; it's not just that the men are technically superior, but also that there is much more diversity in style, and more artistic innovation. There are a lot of male skaters I love to watch, for different reasons, but very few ladies whose skating I enjoy.

  15. #15
    leave no stone unturned seniorita's Avatar
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    Stats for men from 2008-09 season
    how I missed this?!great work, it needs to be on excel immediately for sunday reading!

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