Ladies LP

After seeing the LP's on the CBC, I only have one thing to say...

What the HELL has Tarasova done to Mao!?!

Heavy costumes, heavy music and she looks so lost...The JPN Fed actually needs to step in now and do something.

Now there's a sentence I never thought I'd type...

*Sniper* said:

Yes, now the question is WHO PLACED THE THING ON THE ICE SO YUNA WOULD MISS A JUMP.

Any YouTube video by now?
Anything?

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Oh, come on now.
Must have been a piece of ice or fallen beads. Skating last is a tough thing.

harmy18 said:

Sure I'd love to.

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What surprised me today, after reading the protocol, was that the judges were much more in favor of KIM than others, sharky spiral credited level 3,great jobs

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I'd love to hear your opinion on why you think her spiral was shaky in this LP.
Do you mind elaborating?

No, I'm not trying to pick a fight.
Of all the elements in skating, spiral sequence is the one I have the most trouble with, it seems.
I can't tell a good one from bad unless it's plain obvious, and there certainly are divided opinions on YN's spiral sequence.

Thank you.

enlight78 said:

Actually Mao proved that she could match Yu-na or beat her at if she skates clean at World Trophey; the problem is i don't remember the last time mao had to clean programs; Mao loops been down graded a lot for the past season ; thats why she dropped the 3/3 . The emphasis on good technique in the judging system is really hurting skaters like Mao and Caroline;

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Actually I don't think so, unless Mao changed her plan, e.g. pick up her lutz and 3/3 combo, she' no way to compete with others like Yuna, Joannie and Miki. I'm totally TIRED of her 3As and no lutz nor 3/3 combo programs. I just wonder why she would not give me (or herself?) a break?

bekalc said:

I agree with this. If the skaters had all done the same technical content and skated well, Yu-na wouldn't be getting these huge leads.

But when Mao's popping jumps in the short program, and the other skaters are doing only 3/2s, well they are handing Kim her leads on a silver platter.

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Couldn't say it better myself. I completely agree with you guys here. It's not really Yuna's fault that she's making the competitions "boring" because of her leads. She's doing her job as a competitive figure skater to push the envelopes every season. The other skaters just aren't as consistent as she is. Now let's just hope that by the Olympics, everyone (Mao, Carolina, Joanie...... etc etc etc) can skate at their full potential. If not, well, Yuna may very well have a huge lead again - not that there's anything wrong with that.

R.D. said:

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and IMHO, THAT's what sucks.

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Why?

Some options for Mao?

1. Fix other downgraded jumps before attempting 3A or 3A combo

2. Fire Tarasova and hire a new coach who can really understand her or whom she can really understand

3. Fire her costume designer

4. Change that heavy music which reminds me of zombies crawling in a cemetery

Joking Don't go serious.

Tigger said:

After seeing the LP's on the CBC, I only have one thing to say...

What the HELL has Tarasova done to Mao!?!

Heavy costumes, heavy music and she looks so lost...The JPN Fed actually needs to step in now and do something.

Now there's a sentence I never thought I'd type...

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yeah I agree, the Japanese Fed should have stepped in after worlds last season. Mao needs a full time coach. Her jumps are getting worse and everything about her SP and LP are just so wrong for Mao.

that is what i mean--by benefit of doubt--the judges are looking for downgrades for carolina zhang --per usfsa--alexe gilles should have gotten more.i am ONLY TALKING ABOUT US WoMEN skaters--they are unfairly seeking carolina zhang out more than the others--why they us allowed them to seek out michelle why--the unmentionable reason--no one wants to talk about.

ehdtkqorl123 said:

Some options for Mao?

1. Fix other downgraded jumps before attempting 3A or 3A combo

2. Fire Tarasova and hire a new coach who can really understand her or whom she can really understand

3. Fire her costume designer

4. Change that heavy music which reminds me of zombies crawling in a cemetery

Joking Don't go serious.

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Haha, sadly I agree with you here. :yes:

I feel so bad for Mao that everything seems to be going in the wrong direction, especially for the Olympic season. I never realized how important the costumes are in competition. Mao's costumes are a little distracting and I honestly don't like the roses and flowers she has bordering her neck. Looks like a circus almost. Can't say I like her music choices either. Her SP and LP are way too similar in musicality and tone. Even Yukari's sleeves in her SP. Maybe I'm just old-fashioned and prefer costumes like Caroline, Carolina, and Yuna's?

I really do hope Mao will pull it together despite the adversities. Ugh, I really hope she isn't getting too depressed or defeated... keep your head up high Mao!

*Sniper* said:

I'd love to hear your opinion on why you think her spiral was shaky in this LP.
Do you mind elaborating?

No, I'm not trying to pick a fight.
Of all the elements in skating, spiral sequence is the one I have the most trouble with, it seems.
I can't tell a good one from bad unless it's plain obvious, and there certainly are divided opinions on YN's spiral sequence.

Thank you.

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Well, maybe judges thought her spiral was stable whilst from my point of view, it was sharky today; pls refer to her leg suspended in the first few seconds of the spiral, it shook.....

well....maybe someone would think it was still worth level 4.....

*Sniper* said:

I have a question about her spiral sequence.

Aesthetically, hers is definitely not the most pleasing one.
I think her stretch has improved a lot, but that free leg wobbles a bit too much for a top skater, and it seems bent at the knee, too.
Is that related to her back problems at all?

Also I've heard and read many times to know by now that it's the change of edges, speed, and ice coverage, etc that determine the score, not the free leg position.
So in terms of that, how does her spiral sequence really rate?

On one hand, I hear she is excellent in those qualities, and on the other, some people complain about her "weak" SS.

So which is it??
Can someone answer? Thank you.

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Yu-na's spiral has never been a strong suit for her imo. That in part has to do with position and flexibility. Now I don't think you have to be a ballerina or freakin' gumby to do a pretty spiral, so I think her arabesque spiral is fine. She probably can improve even more if she extends her ankle just a tad bit. Her spiral in the bielman position is what kinda bugs me because again with the hooked ankle And I think it's much more prominent in this position. If she held her blade in a higher place her foot would be more pointed & there would be no break in lines. I actually think even in footwork, transitions & twizzles and such- her foot is way too dorsiflexed @ times and would greatly benefit in the overall skating impression if they were more in the plantar position. I think she could achieve that fairly easily if she consciously bended her knees more instead of having them somewhat locked. Yet seeing how the judges don't seem to mind though, there's no reason to really alter anything. Um, where was I...but what Yu-na does well in her spiral to cover for her lack of flexibility is she has great speed, holds positions for the required time, and has good edge quality going into the spirals.

However, today in the LP her energy in the spiral was not there (and I don't mean that in a hyper way or MK feel the joy of figure skating sense) but it just seemed to pass by & her control was not good either. Just seemed like a complacent skate to me. Her facial expressions mismatched with the music and her provocateur, Bond-girl character seeped into the program too much. It is a Gershwin piece so the jazzy parts do require to exude confidence, slyness & such, but I think in a much more ethereal manner. And I don't underestimate that Yu-na can interpret more subdued music. Look at the beauty of Lark Ascending (the frail & willowy beauty, my goodness!! I couldn't take my eyes off) or her exhibition numbers like Ben & Gold. Music & choreography is definitely subjective, so I'm not saying my opinion is worth more or more valid than those that loved the program because I definitely don't think that. It's just this program didn't gel with me.

If the leg was shaky but didn't go under the hip level and it kept the same edge, it still counts, but negative GEO should be awarded.

regarding the huge lead from the short....

It's not like the other competitors don't stand a chance. They can up their game in the short. Kim's dominance comes from her skill, yes, but to suggest that it's somehow unfair that she's able to do so well in the short whereas others aren't is wierd. And I think this competition just showed us how much a lead in the short can be devalued if you don't earn it in the long program (see Verner and S/S). Kim's massive lead in the short program? Smaller than her lead in the long program.

Now, if you think Kim's being overscored, that's another conversation all together.

Are you kidding?

raress said:

I found this video on youtube...
yu-na is totaly over scored am am no doubt about that ...she got a +2 goe for the combination!!!!that's a real mistery...:|:|

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Oh, come on. If you are a mystery fan go watch Supernatural.
Season 5 is now on, lucky for you!
Those are so not captured at the right moment.
Whoever made that clip is clearly malicious.

Of course Yu-na sometimes URs and makes mistakes, since she's not a robot, but her jumps are much more close to a full rotation compared to what other skaters generally do.

I really hate to make this a Yu-na vs. Mao thing(I honestly think it's UGLY, folks, Some of Yu-na and Mao fans tryinig to make the other part look bad), but since she's the best example here I'll just say it. Look at her 3A. Were they ever close to 3.5 rotations after taking off? It's only her heads that fully rotates, but if you watch her blades, they only rotate 0.5 on the ice, 2.7 on the air. AND she gets +GOEs when the UR's not that obvious.

People should just STOP making and uploading these stupid clips about ANY skaters. Seriously.

ImaginaryPogue said:

Why?

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I HATE predictable competitions.

Medusa said:

Zhang got negative GOE on every jumping pass. She needs to get that fixed. Even someone with a comparably bad jumping technique like Nakano manages to beat her.

She also screwed up my predictions, she was supposed to win Bronze!

Oh yeah, and World Record with 5 Triples? You gotta be joking! There were several junior ladies these year who skated more technically demanding programs.

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This is kinda interesting, does the negative GOE come from the fact that her jumps have little height and distance and therefore look puny?

Why does she have the jump technique that she does? Other skaters seem to have no issues with attaining much better height and distance.

So what if she was a little overscored? Are we going to discredit all the judges because of that? Remember that she lost to Mao on her home ice in last year's GPF. Judges can't please everybody with every score so we should be happy that the best skater walked away with a gold medal and let's hope that the same thing happens at every event including the Olympics
skateforever

that is WHAT IS WRONG WITH FIGURe SKATING__it is cheating--
that is what make i\the sport not a sport--NOT Credible
CHeated for Yu-na -
wont cheat for mao
USFSA Tells international judges to purposely keep vcaroline zhang down--make sure she gets downgrades and overloook the small mistakes and downgrades on other us skaters like rachel, sasha alissa, ashley, alexie, mirai.
caroline wil be the next michelle you know in she has to skate PERFECT THE GET THE Score the other US Skaters can BOMB and still get the scores.
caroline kostner shouldn't been above zhang. in free skate,

harmy18 said:

Well, maybe judges thought her spiral was stable whilst from my point of view, it was sharky today; pls refer to her leg suspended in the first few seconds of the spiral, it shook.....

well....maybe someone would think it was still worth level 4.....

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So you saw her wobbly free leg and thought the whole thing was shaky?
Yeah, that's what I usually do, too. HAHA

Her free leg does bend at the knee a bit, too, I think.
I'm wondering whether that's related to her hip problems, but whatever.
She can't be perfect.

And thank you to other posters who've elaborated their views on spiral sequences.
That was very helpful. :thumbsup:

fairly4 said:

So what if she was a little overscored? Are we going to discredit all the judges because of that? Remember that she lost to Mao on her home ice in last year's GPF. Judges can't please everybody with every score so we should be happy that the best skater walked away with a gold medal and let's hope that the same thing happens at every event including the Olympics
skateforever

that is WHAT IS WRONG WITH FIGURe SKATING__it is cheating--
that is what make i\the sport not a sport--NOT Credible
CHeated for Yu-na -
wont cheat for mao
USFSA Tells international judges to purposely keep vcaroline zhang down--make sure she gets downgrades and overloook the small mistakes and downgrades on other us skaters like rachel, sasha alissa, ashley, alexie, mirai.
caroline wil be the next michelle you know in she has to skate PERFECT THE GET THE Score the other US Skaters can BOMB and still get the scores.
caroline kostner shouldn't been above zhang. in free skate,

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1. Huh? How did they cheat for Kim but not Mao?

2. Since this thread is about TEB, lets limit our comments to Alexe and Zhang. How did Alexe benefit from the judges overlooking her mistakes (this is what you're arguing).

3. And why should Zhang have been ahead of Kostner in the free?