This pretty much sums up what I think about Mrs. Bianchetti and her writings.
Commentary by Sonia
- Thread starter gsrossano
- Start date
This pretty much sums up what I think about Mrs. Bianchetti and her writings.
I think you have to take serious note of the tremendous error of fact at the end of Ms. Bianchetti's article, because it forms one of her bigger arguments against IJS, and it makes no sense whatsoever. It's more than a mistake of math; its entire reasoning is counter to what is actually happening on the ice.
I found this article an embarrassment. To say that "besides the top three in the men's, ladies, and pairs," the athletes were disastrous, is not only simply untrue; it begs the question, "What does Sonia expect?" If she can go to Paris and enjoy the top three short and long programs in these disciplines, plus gaze with wonder at Virtue and Moir, what else did she want? I certainly do not recall any competitions of the 70's and 80's, that were not Worlds, Olympics or Europeans, yielding higher technical and artistic merit than Bompard. I do recall many flat-out poor performances and puzzling judging decisions. To read Sonia's writing, one would think every competitor was the equal of John Curry during the 1975-1976 season (and even he made errors at Worlds that year).
Her further point, that somehow all the skaters performed without joy, is also incorrect; she evidently failed to see Inoue and Baldwin, who finished off the podium, exalt in their throw triple Axel, Alexe Gilles smile after her short, and many other moments.
It's time for one of Sonia's many friends in skating to sit her down and tell her the writings have become repetitive, poorly reasoned and downright cranky. Of course she's entitled to publish what she wishes but she is doing her outstanding record of innovation in the ISU a profound disservice.
I found this article an embarrassment. To say that "besides the top three in the men's, ladies, and pairs," the athletes were disastrous, is not only simply untrue; it begs the question, "What does Sonia expect?" If she can go to Paris and enjoy the top three short and long programs in these disciplines, plus gaze with wonder at Virtue and Moir, what else did she want? I certainly do not recall any competitions of the 70's and 80's, that were not Worlds, Olympics or Europeans, yielding higher technical and artistic merit than Bompard. I do recall many flat-out poor performances and puzzling judging decisions. To read Sonia's writing, one would think every competitor was the equal of John Curry during the 1975-1976 season (and even he made errors at Worlds that year).
Her further point, that somehow all the skaters performed without joy, is also incorrect; she evidently failed to see Inoue and Baldwin, who finished off the podium, exalt in their throw triple Axel, Alexe Gilles smile after her short, and many other moments.
It's time for one of Sonia's many friends in skating to sit her down and tell her the writings have become repetitive, poorly reasoned and downright cranky. Of course she's entitled to publish what she wishes but she is doing her outstanding record of innovation in the ISU a profound disservice.
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Thanks for sharing your views. You do make a strong case and effectively pick apart many of Bianchetti's statements. I do want to say that apart from most of your points - which after some consideration I can agree to -
for better or worse Sonia's point about the health of figure skating is central to her article and has been overlooked by her many critics here. Actually because it is unpleasant to most of you it has been totally ignored.
One thing is certain and true and that is that even in an Olympic year figure skating is not doing nearly as well as it has in the past.
It is fine and more than fair to pick apart Sonia's article piece by piece without considering or mentioning the underlying concern behind her comments. It is a very old and successful debating trick and you are good at it and very convincing.
Another favorite response "Sonia has an agenda, blah, blah,." Puh-leeze, who in figure skating doesn't have an agenda? Speedy for instance? Why be involved or care about anything, personally or professionaly without an agenda or reason.
I find that attitude not only unfair but ridiculous.
If Sonia is so wrong about so much - why is figure skating floundering. The loss of so much TV money must be BRUTAL for ISU and having fewer judges based on the way CoP works has the strong possibilty of reducing close results to nothing more than a lottery. That is NOT sport, that is results by luck of the draw - and reducing the judging panel will eventually come back and bite ISU where the sun don't shine.
I think most of the dissent over Sonia here is well founded and it did make me think and reconsider my earlier thoughts. But a society or sporting union without dissenting voices is not a good thing. I am glad Sonia continues to fight on, work for her agenda and offers an alternative view to Speedy and ISU governing body.
After a lifetime devoted to a sport she loves Sonia has earned this right.
I read legendary as a reference to how well Mao has performed at the last GPF and previously. To me Mao has not looked like Mao in her last 3 performances (4CC, Worlds and TEB).
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Last edited:
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2004
I find Sonia's indifference to facts that contradict her opinion and general ignorance of the relationship between cause and effect to be extremely irritating. I also find her emphasis on 'passion' to be a little tiresome (I'm a more formalistic kind of person and like the more formalistic aspects of skating).
But ... she's got some good points in general. I've very sympathetic to the idea of CoP but I can't much say I care for the results we've gotten so far. There are some hugely talented skaters around now but I get a lot more bored watching CoP skating a lot faster than I ever did with 6.0 (despite all the flaws of that system which I freely grant).
I even get bored watching CoP SP's and I never got bored watching 6.0 SP's.
Just sayin'....
But ... she's got some good points in general. I've very sympathetic to the idea of CoP but I can't much say I care for the results we've gotten so far. There are some hugely talented skaters around now but I get a lot more bored watching CoP skating a lot faster than I ever did with 6.0 (despite all the flaws of that system which I freely grant).
I even get bored watching CoP SP's and I never got bored watching 6.0 SP's.
Just sayin'....
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2005
I think we have discussed this before janetfan but really the only place that skating is suffering or floundering is in the US. The primary reason for this is because the States doesn't seem to have a "star" in the ladies division. However, you have the Men's World Champion and World Silver Medalists in Ice Dance! You have a very strong team in Dance, a strong Men's team, and a strong junior team. Why not celebrate them?
The general public or audience in the US needs to shift their view to include other disciplines of skating. The end all and be all of the sport is not the Women's division and the States is very narrow minded in this regard, IMO.
Can't agree it is a laughable exaggeration. There is clearly a random component to the results using the current calculation method. It does not come into play for every skater or every medal, but it does come into play. It should not be a part of determining an athletic competition.
(We can have an animated discussion on this in Lake Placid.)
(And BTW the error in the next to last graph has been corrected.)
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Floundering? After US Skating kicked your butts at WTT
Seriously, ISU has lost a ton of TV money. FYI we have limited coverage here this season and Europe has less.
I am happy Canada is hosting this year and glad for the added boost it gives your fine skaters and your entire Winter Olympic team.
But interest is waning not only in the USA but in many parts of Europe too.
The loss of so much big TV money, which typically used to be the largest income generator for ISU not only hurts ISU but is a fair barometer for judging the saleabilty and attractiveness of skating.
You are entitled to your views and Canada is a great country with fine athletes. But on the whole the ISU is not going through a good period right now.
- Joined
- Mar 25, 2008
Your tone here reminds me of some of the very strange posts you had a few months ago. Has Canada done something to offend you? You were the one who suggested that skating was "floundering" when, in fact, it is not - certainly not in the US.Floundering? After US Skating kicked your butts at WTT
I love to skate was spot on: US skating is in great shape, but the public isn't interested because there's no pretty princess who can consistently get to the top of the podium - nor any female skater who looks as though she'll have MK's longevity and influence. It doesn't help that the TV market is so fragmented or that US broadcasters are always the first to cry wuzrobbed instead of, you know, actually telling viewers what's going on or promoting the excellent American men and ice dancers.
Actually we have about the same coverage we've always had. The US has more, from what I gather. Last year was an exception in Europe as ES showed all the GP series and some of Junior Worlds, in addition to the usual wall to wall live coverage of Euros and Worlds. Russian TV continues to show just about everything. During TEB, Bercy was pretty much packed for the LPs and there was a good sized audience for the SPs - on a work day.
US tv money went, Japanese money came in. The only reason the US had a WTT to win was that someone put up a lot of money to host what was essentially a glorified on the record cheesefest. Considering the success of Japanese skaters on the JGP circuit, I think the sport should stay in good shape there.
ETA gsrossano, thanks for pointing out the correction. I think it's pretty lame for Ms. Bianchetti to correct her column without noting what the revision was (which is standard practice for journalists and for many bloggers). Ending her column with the dig about the math being too difficult for the ISU, when she herself obviously didn't bother getting it right, is not something for her to be proud of, either.
Last edited:
Just a word on how skating is "floundering" in the U.S. While it is certainly true money has declined dramatically since the glory years (approx. 1994-2002 or so) there have been recent small, positive signs, including the signing of a new TV contract and the addition of several sponsors. Relentless negativism does no one any good.
I am astonished such a keen observer as yourself let it through unscathed.
My embarassment knows no bounds
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
I thought it was pretty obvious that my WTT comment was nothing more than a friendly joke. I also think I said very complimentary things about Canada and Canadian athletes several times in the post you are referring to. You are right about a post I made several months ago that was in extremely poor taste and totally uncalled for. To connect it with my last post requires a gigantic leap of faith.
I am aware of WTT's relative lack of importance which is precisely why I made a light hearted reference to it. I am also a fan of Ice Dancing, Pairs and the Men's field. I don't understand what you were implying but since I know you are a fair minded person I will take it for what it was.
I would be interested if anyone here can offer some facts into the state of ISU finances to show I am wrong and that ISU is indeed very prosperous.
BTW, the old US TV deal through ESPN used to pay what % of ISU's total income? Was it more than Japan and Europe combined? Whatever it was it is way, way down.
Japan and Korea have a strong interest in skating - they just don't pay half of what the US TV market used to pay to the ISU. AFAIK, the overall TV revenues are way down from several years ago. Whether I like a "pretty princess" or other disciplines is perhaps your issue or I Love To Skates issue but it really doesn't apply to me because I will be rooting for our guys and also our Dance/Pairs teams this year.
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Is "relentless negativism" about a skating article going to bring down skating? Please, I don't think so
Start the thread over and it is pretty clear the "relentless negativism" you mention started here over Sonia's article. I defended parts of it and was met by a barrage of negative comments.
It seems like this has been a disputed but failry civil series of posts.
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2005
It's great that you will be supporting the other disciplines but the majority of the US audience wont be and that is where the USFSA and the networks need to do some serious problem solving. If the US announcers keep crying over the judging system and the networks primarily only air the Ladies division, there is no way people are going to be drawn into watching a skating event.
- Joined
- Mar 25, 2008
Well, it was a pretty memorable post, and I thought you were going in a similar direction here. My mistake. I'm glad that's all in the past; at the time I was actually concerned because it was such a strange thing to write, and then you completely disappeared.
I was pointing out that unlike real fans, which of course you are, the casual US fans seem unaware that they have skaters who are not female, and the US media isn't doing a good job in promoting these athletes - a pity, because the best US skaters are really strong and deserve more publicity.
Ha ha, you will get those figures out of Speedy's cold dead hands. Possibly not even then.
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Here are some statistics from US Skating.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
In April 2007, NBC Sports and U.S. Figure Skating announced a multiyear partnership under which NBC will broadcast live high-definition coverage of the U.S. Figure Skating Championships, including Saturday night primetime coverage of the ladies free skate, as well as Skate America. The unique partnership includes 10 hours of event coverage and various marketing and broadband rights, highlighted by additional live event coverage on NBCSports.com and U.S. Figure Skating's icenetwork.com.
Who watches figure skating?
70% of women consider themselves figure skating fans
54% of the total population 12+ is interested in figure skating
68% are women age 25-54
65% 1+ years in college
63% are in $50M+ income households
Figure skating fans are educated and affluent
Figure skating is the highest-ranked sport among the U.S. population 12+ in fan base
Women sports fans prefer to watch figure skating over college basketball, college football, tennis and the NHL
Figure skating is the most popular spectator sport among American women and their teenage daughters
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Also, I saw that at Torino US viewers interest in events were very similar with ladies topping at 15%, Dance /Pairs at 12% and Men's at 11%.
That spread is not as wide as I might have imagined considering Sasha was a leading medal contender in Torino.
But this information does not feel right to me..........
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I would feel happier if these figures came from an independent polling organization than from the figure skating establishment.
As the saying goes, if you're all that popular, why aren't you rich?
Similar threads
