I just saw Evan short again; I like better than the first time; not only does he look like a bird; the bird like movements enhance the program
I just saw Evan short again; I like better than the first time; not only does he look like a bird; the bird like movements enhance the program
Plushenko didn't maximize his points out like he will later in the season, though. He left out an entire combination and his footwork is going to grow in complexity as well.Originally Posted by bekalc
Oda basically skated the very best he can without Quad to get that score.
That's a beautiful picture! Thank you. I like it!
I see. This makes more sense for him to dress in black. The name "Ivan" even chimes with "Evan." Good idea!
Then maybe he should consider to get rid of the sleeve decoration thing? It made me feel that he is trying to portray a bird. I don't mind seeing fluffy sleeves on Yukari since she is obviously the firebird, but it looks a bit awkward on Evan's costume. He will look more princely without it, JMHO.
I never said that Oda can beat Plushenko without a quad. I think he'll absolutely need a quad if he wants a shot at Plushenko. But, I think that Oda with one quad in the long program can out score a one quad in the long program Plushenko by quite a lot. Plushenko's program, once again sucks...
Why can't Oda beat Plushenko without a quad? He can beat Joubert without a quad. Plushy, last week had only a double lutz and slow speed, bad spins and no transitions. Sure, his jumps were great, but they can't be giving him the gold on the quad alone again.
As for Evan, I think the feathers will grow on me, although I hated them at first sight. I like the program, I see more connection to the chreography from him. The jumps looked effortless, but I do wish he had tried the quad.
But...does Prince Ivan wear frou frou feathers? Ick.
I highly doubt that. I think Plushenko's programs will only get better and stronger by the end of the season. They have never encountered before at international competitions, right? So we'll have to wait and see how things turn out as the Olympics are drawing near day after day.
Joubert skated poorly in France. I think that if Oda wants to make his case against Plushenko, he should at least land one quad. The quad is just as much part of the whole package as spins, choregraphy. He lands the quad, then there can be talk about how he actually has a well constructed program and Plushenko does not.
Why can't Oda beat Plushenko without a quad? He can beat Joubert without a quad. Plushy, last week had only a double lutz and slow speed, bad spins and no transitions. Sure, his jumps were great, but they can't be giving him the gold on the quad alone again.
I don't think a guy necessarily has to match Plushenko jump for jump, they just need to present a full package. The only issue is the judges may give Plushenko high PCS anyways, but Plushenko's PCS in the long give some hope...Oh I know Plushenko is talking about more difficulty (and unless he was planning a 3loop/2toe he only lost about 4 points by not doing those extra combos)But I know there's been concerns about stamina in his camp. Doing a 4/3 2 3axels and other jumps is easy for Plushenko, but going for more has never been easy for the guy....
I mean if we are going to go by jumps alone, Plushenko should have won the long program in 2002, but it's never been "just" about jumps.
Maybe but its not like at the Olympics in 2006 he had transition filled programs (at all.) And he's older now. I hope Plushenko does have better programs. With better programs I can support him winning. But the programs he put out in Russia...long
I highly doubt that. I think Plushenko's programs will only get better and stronger by the end of the season. They have never encountered before at international competitions, right? So we'll have to wait and see how things turn out as the Olympics are drawing near day after day.
Evan's SP, everything was good except the flapping arms. They are so annoying. He should add more feathers on his costume, and connect the arms to the waist.
Ha, I know why he skated "Firebird". It's because he cannot stop flapping, so they chose the "Firebird" for him. Just kidding.
I agree !00%. Oda won at TEB against a faltered Joubert. If Joubert has had his usual strong jumps, Oda would have been the second.
So far we've seen a super consistent Plushenko. I bet Oda won't beat him if he doesn't add a quad in LP. Even Oda adds a quad in his program, it doesn't guarantee that he could beat Plushenko. We can only say he might beat him.
Last edited by jennylovskt; 10-30-2009 at 11:44 PM.
I would bet a lot of money on Plushenko's LP in Vancouver having at least 2 quads and maybe 3. A LOT of money.
Then bet on it. But four years ago when Plushenko was dominating, he wasn't doing 2 quads in a long program. I believe he stopped that as soon as Yagudin retired. And to be frank when Yagudin was around, Plushy at big competitions was having at times issues with consistency.
However, of course once he scaled down to a 4toe/3toe/2toe and two 3axels, his consistency improved because that jumping layout was easy compared to some of the crazy layouts he was doing in his young years.
I'm not saying that to be on the safe side it wouldn't be a good idea for Oda to do a quad in the short as well. But I think Oda should only do it if he can do that combination consistently. Because the most important thing for him would be to make the final group, and to be frank there are a lot of guys bunched together.
I think I remember hearing Oda talking about wanting to do a 4/3/3 and I may have heard something about 2 quads in the long. It would probably be smarter for him to go for 2 quads in the long program, than it would be for him to take a risk on a combination in the short he doesn't have consistently down.
Are you sure you can win the bet? I know you are only joking. That's all.
The judges simple don't agree with you, though. Plushenko received the same PCS overall as Oda.
The point I'm trying to make is that a clean Oda with a Quad in his LP will be at the same level as a clean Plushenko with a single Quad. Plushenko will actually get better PCS than Oda by the time he has improved the program with better footwork for the Olympics (you can count on this), but Oda should be able to make up for that with better GOEs in the spins.
Therefore, Oda needs to be completely competitive in the SP as well if he wants to have a chance of beating a clean Plushenko.
There honestly isn't THAT much risk of doing the Quad in the SP, as long as you always rotate it and train your program so that you are ready to do a 3-3 combination in place of the solo Triple. Oda would still be in contention for a medal if he fell on the Quad in the SP, and he probably isn't going to WIN the Olympics without it, so I say...why not?
(I should be getting paid for this advice. :sheesh: )
And people were already criticizing Plushenko's PCS. Not to mention you don't think Oda's PCS are going to improve over the season, I think they will. His PCS in the short already improved big time.
Last edited by bekalc; 10-31-2009 at 01:18 AM.
Oda has pretty much maxed out on his SP score, without a Quad (IMO).
He skated the program better in China than he did in France, but I don't see much more room for improvement. He has never done level 4 footwork before and his skating skills are not the strongest, so I don't see that as a possibility for him.
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