Is Rachael the one?

dorispulaski · Nov 22, 2009

No, like the rest of the American girls.

What seems to me to be the usual US mantra for the last 4 years:
Stretch 'em (so they can do those gumby poses)
Starve 'em
And for heaven's sake don't exercise them, those muscles will look ugly.

Don't fix their jump technique BTW-rely on starvation to fix their jump issues.

One reason I seldom watch the ladies any more, particularly the US ladies.

Spun Silver · Nov 22, 2009

That sounds gruesome and I'm not advocating starvation. Ashley doesn't look like a starving gumby doll to me. She looks healthy, muscled, fit, and strong, like most athletes. (Did you ever read about what Michael Phelps eats?) And she seems very happy and successful as well. There doesn't have to be a contradiction between fitness and performance.

R.D. · Nov 22, 2009

mandykane21 said:
They were never built like Rachael. What is with people thinking she needs to be on a diet? She's a strong girl, let her be. All the things she needs to work on, getting thinner is NOT one of them.

I swear man

CARA · Nov 22, 2009

Ok, no diet, and no starvation. But she can start taking ballet class to improve her posture and extension. And I like the idea of Tom Dickson as her choreographer, possibly for the next year's programs.

dorispulaski · Nov 22, 2009

I'd like to see her do some type of off ice exercise-what I was getting at was that she doesn't seem overweight, but her arms look not very toned, like she might be underexercised, especially in the upper body. However, she's young and she may just be in that transitional puppy stage where nothing looks quite the way you're going to look when you're a couple years older.

And I wasn't so much thinking of Ashley (who also has jump issues, but looks toned, at least) but of Caroline Zhang.

krenseby · Nov 22, 2009

Mathman said:
So, Rachael finishes the Grand Prix season with the highest point total of the American ladies.

I think she's the one! :yes:

I could see Rachael being a silver medalist at Worlds, behind Mao of course. Because Mao will once again be World Champion. Please, no one tell me I am wrong.

ImaginaryPogue · Nov 22, 2009

I don't think there is "the one."

chuckm · Nov 22, 2009

krenseby said:
Well, no worries, now we've got Joannie to challenge Yuna! It has never happened before, of course, but I am pondering the possibility of Joannie beating her! Joannie has scored so high at Skate Canada, that maybe she has some chance of overcoming Yuna, but of course only if Yuna makes quite a few mistakes.

Joannie will NEVER beat Kim with the SP from CoC and/or the FS from Skate Canada. If Joannie can't do two clean programs in the same competition, she has zero chance of beating Kim. If Flatt's 116 FS at SA couldn't beat Kim after Kim messed up the FS, surely Rochette's 112 FS at SC couldn't do it either.

Rochette scored as high as she did at Skate Canada thanks to some outrageously high PCS scores (especially in the FS---she got 8s when she nearly fell on the loop, doubled two other jumps and wobbled on the spiral).

bigsisjiejie · Nov 23, 2009

krenseby said:
I could see Rachael being a silver medalist at Worlds, behind Mao of course. Because Mao will once again be World Champion. Please, no one tell me I am wrong.

No problem. I won't tell you you're wrong.

bigsisjiejie · Nov 23, 2009

You all may be onto something about the choreography and/or artistic-focused coach. Please, though not Morozov! What about Rachael + Tarasova? On second thought...maybe not. Does Lea Ann Miller ever do choreo for singles skaters?

Layfan · Nov 23, 2009

dorispulaski said:
I'd like to see her do some type of off ice exercise-what I was getting at was that she doesn't seem overweight, but her arms look not very toned, like she might be underexercised, especially in the upper body. However, she's young and she may just be in that transitional puppy stage where nothing looks quite the way you're going to look when you're a couple years older.

And I wasn't so much thinking of Ashley (who also has jump issues, but looks toned, at least) but of Caroline Zhang.

Is Rachel's problem really that she needs to muscle up? It seems to be that she's got the athletic ability down just fine, even though she may not look as muscular as Joannie Rochette or Irina Slutskaya or whoever ...
Rachel's problem is that she doesn't have the greatest lines. And I'm not just talking about spiral sequences; it sort of shows throughout her skating.
Ballet classes won't help that much. (If she hasn't already taken them.) Trust me, I took ballet for years and years I no matter how much I tried I just wasn't going to have the right lines for a professional ballet dancer. I'm quite certain Rachel works as hard as she can on her lines and flexibility. But you can't just will that kind of thing to happen. Sometimes it really is just about body types.
Luckily for Rachel, her athletic abilities make up for her weaknesses in other departments. And luckily for her figure skating is not ballet, so you can get to the top without perfect lines. Look at Miki Ando.

(p.s. Rachel is not "the one," whatever that means.) For her to win she needs others to flounder. But all the U.S. ladies fall into that category. Rachel is our best hope right now because she is the one who always kicks down the door when someone leaves it open. And that makes her an exciting skater to keep an eye on.

french quarter · Nov 23, 2009

krenseby said:
I could see Rachael being a silver medalist at Worlds, behind Mao of course. Because Mao will once again be World Champion. Please, no one tell me I am wrong.

It can happen if Yu-Na will choose not to be at worlds after she will win gold at the Olympics.

R.D. · Nov 23, 2009

Yeah, Flatt reminds me of the pre-2007 Meissner. Has the jumps, relatively consistent performer but just nothing else to fall back on.

silverlake22 · Nov 23, 2009

dorispulaski said:
No, like the rest of the American girls.

What seems to me to be the usual US mantra for the last 4 years:
Stretch 'em (so they can do those gumby poses)
Starve 'em
And for heaven's sake don't exercise them, those muscles will look ugly.

Don't fix their jump technique BTW-rely on starvation to fix their jump issues.

One reason I seldom watch the ladies any more, particularly the US ladies.

I don't know I don't think any of the top US ladies now look like they're starving. I mean Kimmie was really skinny when she was 16, but then she looked fit and healthy by the time she was 18. And Mirai and Caroline were so thin a couple years ago because they were 14 and still had little kid bodies, both look healthy now, Mirai even has strong shoulders. Alissa I used to worry about when I saw her on Ice Diaries 4 years ago and she looked so thin but now she just looks like a healthy young woman, just a slim one. Ashley and Racheal definitely look fit and strong and Rachael DOES NOT need to go on a diet. She's all muscle and if she didn't eat she wouldn't be able to land all those jumps! Plus I think Mao has gotten skinner recently and it judging by her performances this season it seems to be hurting her, not helping her. Being skinny doesn't make you a better skater

Layfan · Nov 23, 2009

R.D. said:
Yeah, Flatt reminds me of the pre-2007 Meissner. Has the jumps, relatively consistent performer but just nothing else to fall back on.

I don't know ... Meissner had that certain quality that made things look easy. Rachel never makes anything look easy. But I kinda know what you mean.

R.D. · Nov 23, 2009

Also, Meissner improved her presentation from 2006 to 2008 (I know because she was SO boring in 2006!) It remains to be seen if Flatt will do the same...but for some reason I don't see her sticking around for much longer (college calls?)

Layfan · Nov 23, 2009

Back in 2006, I thought Meissner was boring. Now that I look back at her, I can appreciate her presentation - even the 2006 Meissner more in light of some of today's U.S. skaters

R.D. · Nov 23, 2009

Layfan said:
Back in 2006, I thought Meissner was boring. Now that I look back at her, I can appreciate her presentation - even the 2006 Meissner more in light of some of today's U.S. skaters

I remember thinking she was sooo boring even as recently as late 2007. I think, ironically, when her struggles began that's when she started to really improve on presentation. But I didn't fully appreciate her until seeing her live at SOI a couple years ago in Baltimore.

silverlake22 · Nov 23, 2009

I miss Kimmie! I hope she shows up at Nationals even if she falls during her skate! She never seemed like a diva despite all her accomplishments which I like :biggrin:

bigsisjiejie · Nov 23, 2009

Layfan said:
I'm quite certain Rachel works as hard as she can on her lines and flexibility. But you can't just will that kind of thing to happen. Sometimes it really is just about body types.
Luckily for Rachel, her athletic abilities make up for her weaknesses in other departments. And luckily for her figure skating is not ballet, so you can get to the top without perfect lines. Look at Miki Ando.

I don't think Rachael needs to "muscle up" though if she stays in skating until her 20's, that may happen because it seems to be easier for ladies to accomplish this once you're out of your teens and bones/plates are solidly fused. I also agree that some skaters are just never going to have perfect balletic lines, and the answer for them is to pick music and choreography that highlights their positive attributes, not what they may lack. You gotta play to your strengths--I'm thinking specifically of Irina Slutskaya here, who generally chose high-drama, high-energy, or high-power programs because she had the sense to know she wasn't the delicate flower ballerina type. Pick the wrong music for your "look" or style and it will only amplify what you lack. Rachael should definitely consider finding a fresh eye/different choreographer for her 2010-2011 programs.

Is Rachael the one?

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Spun Silver

R.D.

CARA

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

krenseby

ImaginaryPogue

chuckm

bigsisjiejie

bigsisjiejie

Layfan

french quarter

R.D.

silverlake22

Layfan

R.D.

Layfan

R.D.

silverlake22

bigsisjiejie

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