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Thread: OD - 12:00 EST - Saturday, November 21

  1. #46
    Brazilian Eurotrash beep_beep's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nevergonnadance View Post
    Just to reiterate - I think the other two were possibly scored too high. I just didn't think this was a very strong field (prior to V/M taking the ice). On the level of basic skating P/B are not impressive.
    Ok, but 10 points better??
    It's like their clear stumbles didn't even happen....

  2. #47
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    I would have given it to Weaver and Poje over P/B. I got on W/P bandwagon a few years ago just noting talent. After Olys, everyone will be on their bandwagon. JMO.

    What was interesting was P/B's use of American country music, and it was Blue Grass - not all that CMA stuff. Skating to American folk music is always risky. Not sure if P/B just copied it from Hollywood movie scenes which were never authentic according to the blue grass people. That George Clooney movie demonstrated blue grass very well.

    Anyhow happy that W&P are beginning to be recognized.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by beep_beep View Post
    Ok, but 10 points better??
    It's like their clear stumbles didn't even happen....
    Exactly. One thing: the OD wasn't 10 points better. It was 4.5 points better. Those clear stumbles should've knocked away that difference without a beat.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by beep_beep View Post
    Ok, but 10 points better??
    It's like their clear stumbles didn't even happen....
    I don't know - but I was watching P/B and thinking they were NOT good - they were sloppy in their individual skating, off time with the music at times, and lacked unison. No "mistakes" but it was a semi-labored effort - I was really surprised.

    There's always this debate between "clean" versus "mistakes and higher level skating" always, in cases like this. IMO V/M's edge depth and speed even today are extraordinary versus the field at SC.

    If P/B had skated stronger overall (not just clean) IMO they would have a better case for the scores to be closer but it was really not cohesive.

    Weaver and Poje need more strength in their skating. The program kicks a$$ and it's all there in the structure, but the actual skating is kind of flamenco lite.

    Just .02. I'm not saying V/M were 60 but I don't know about P/B's score either. If their compatriots were here, maybe they wouldn't have gotten 56 or 55, whatever they got, and maybe because they did, V/M had to get 60 for a lesser (for them) effort.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    Exactly. One thing: the OD wasn't 10 points better. It was 4.5 points better. Those clear stumbles should've knocked away that difference without a beat.
    I don't agree with you. I'm never on the side of higher level with mistakes gets leveled with a clean team that has mediocre (IMO) skate quality.

    But if you think P/B are better than I think they are, I get your point. I didn't think they were good.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scout View Post
    Belbin/Agosto only got a 60.95 at SA. I have no technical eye for ice dance...but this would suggest that B/A are not near V/M or D/W (who scored a 63-something at NHK)

    or is this just a 'you can't compare across competitions'? because a 3 point difference in the OD seems like a lot. and V/M getting virtually the same score as a clean B/A seems to say that there is a big difference in their skating, despite B/A clearly beating them at Worlds.
    Reading through the PBP and comments at first I felt better seeing that V&M received a 60 something which is what B&A have received at both of their events. But to read a little bit farther and see that V&M had two falls and still posted a 60? Even pre-Linichuk I feel that B&A were still competitive with V&M (as you said last season the judges seemed to agree) and this year they are closer in skating skill.

    Scout like you I had been thinking that the judges were marking the skaters in comparison to the fields they are skating in so I still wasn't worried about B&A. However, IMO while there is a huge drop off in skating skills between V&M and the rest of skaters from S&B/W&P down the list, P&B (IMO) are good enough to beat a horrible performance by V&M. Maybe there is something to the comments that the judges aren't even going to give B&A a fair shot at the olympic gold. Perhaps not even a medal.

    For the record V&M are one of my favorite teams.

  7. #52
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    Dyan, there weren't two falls in the sense that there were two deductions. Neither stumble counted as a fall. But the stumbles were noteworthy enough that if Moir hadn't been supporting her, she would have fallen. I remember Brodeur/Mattatal having a spin that went awry like that and they counted it as a fall (his support was necessary in the specific position they were in). I thought that would've happened here. It didn't. Because neither stumble was on an element, the TES were unaffected, but they were considerably gifted in the PCS. It was a disappointing performance, no doubt, but their marks were even moreso.

  8. #53
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    ImaginaryPogue, thanks. I haven't seen the OD's and don't usually comment before I have seen them but it threw me a little when I saw people refer to "falls" in their posts. I took that to mean that Tessa actually was down on the ice twice.

    IMO P&B's skating skills have improved a lot over the past few years and while V&M are still superior skaters overall I do believe because of V&M's issues today the gap between them and P&B could have been closer even if P&B didn't outright win the OD.

    I've been checking the schedules but is Universal airing any of the dance competition? From what I saw it doesn't seem so which is a shame as I would have liked to get V&M's, P&B's and W&P's FD's on tape.

  9. #54
    pour atteindre l'inaccessible étoile! 1795's Avatar
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    i can't wait to see the protocols for V/M's twizzles and the footworks

    good acting.

  10. #55
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    3rd. canadian team

    where is this team from? They looked like they just moved up from junior. Does anyone know!

  11. #56
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    IMO P&B's skating skills have improved a lot over the past few years and while V&M are still superior skaters overall I do believe because of V&M's issues today the gap between them and P&B could have been closer even if P&B didn't outright win the OD.
    P/B's skating skills may have improved a lot but it didn't show today and I believe there was still a marked gap between them and V/M despite V/M's stumbles. P/B's skating was not strong today - not as good as at TEB, IMO.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by sktgirl6 View Post
    where is this team from? They looked like they just moved up from junior. Does anyone know!
    They've been together since 2007. Individually, they competed on the junior grand prix, but not together. They've been strictly senior together, but have only done two international competitions before this year.

  13. #58
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1795 View Post
    i can't wait to see the protocols for V/M's twizzles and the footworks

    good acting.
    as much as like them V/M scores were just a joke, is good OD and good CD, but that high marks...sorry but no way

  14. #59
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sktgirl6 View Post
    where is this team from? They looked like they just moved up from junior. Does anyone know!
    Here's their background, and competitive history. If you clink on the names of their previous pairings, you will see the profile of their former teams.

    http://www.tracings.net/chon-gfel.html

    They competed at Skate Canada last year.

    You could not say they were just up from Juniors, as Andrea is 22 and Gfeller is 24.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1795 View Post
    i can't wait to see the protocols for V/M's twizzles and the footworks

    good acting.
    Twizzles: 0.2, with one judge giving them a 2 (WTH?)
    CiSt3: mostly 1s and 2s, which is right - the mistakes came later.
    NtMiSt2: ditto.

    The mistakes were in the transitions/linking footwork/movement, but that was still scored in the eights. I don't see how they got 9.00 from one judge in interpretation/timing, and the 9.50 in choreography (same judge) definitely feels like a "lets see how to get this score higher" maneuver.

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