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Thread: Grand Prix Final: Mens LP

  1. #211
    Beliver in Sasha's Perfect Program Tinymavy15's Avatar
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    What is up with the tech calling/judging at this event? evan gets a season's record for a with a freeskate with a popped jump and a sloppy triple axel and no quad? sorry that is absurd and I am huge Evan fan. I think Oda should have actually won the event...had had pretty much the same number of mistakes that Evan did in the freeskate but the quality of his other stuff is great. It should have been close, but I would have put Oda in first after the free.

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz View Post
    In comparing Evan with Jeremy and assuming both skate their best, one should note, Evan is basicaly a solid consistant skater and Jeremy is basically a musical skater. Both have quads but which one makes the quad a part of their solo dance?
    Please note that Jeremy is the one who has quads, and he was brave enough to do quads in all competitions. Evan doesn't have quad any more. His technical skill is shrinking. What makes him so outstanding? I honestly don't know.

    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    And please tell Plush he is too pale and needs some tan to look like he is a alive
    I would rather see pale than the ugly, fake tan.

    So no more Poor Evan in this thread? Enjoy the moment!

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvsasha View Post
    My personal opinion is that the US should send the three men here, but I know they have to deliver at Nats.

    Interjecting to also say that Jeremy was awesome today
    Agree with you on this. I expect Evan and Jeremy will go 1-2 at Ntls in some order, barring a complete meltdown by either of them. If Weir is #3 he'll make it easy for USFS and he'll be sent too, but if he ends up in #4 behind a Mroz or a Rippon, it gets more interesting. And if he ends up in #5 or below, probably will put nail in his coffin for OG.

  4. #214
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    I actually enjoyed Evan's skating at the GPF (and no I'm not a particular fan of his). But I agree the PCS especially were a little

    But now we know where poor Akiko's missing PCS numbers ended up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by demarinis5 View Post
    http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news

    Article from IN on the th Men's FS.

    quote from Johnny

    I defeated our National Champion (Abbott) here. Last year I was 5th at the Nationals and he was first, and I hope this competition gives me some legitimacy, because a lot of people after I made mistakes always write me off and I have to climb my way up

    Sounds like Johnny is making a case for himself for the Olympic team.
    Although it is not trash talking, I would prefer Weir to have better manners. He did not need to bring Abbott into the discussion at all. In my opinion Weir should have waited for somebody else to make comparisons if at all. LOL, there are things one can say e.g. to one´s own mother, but should not say publicly. Apparently Weir has not been taught the difference.
    Last edited by Jaana; 12-06-2009 at 04:00 AM.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Jeremy ABbott WUZROBBED of the PCS!!! 6 points behind Lysacek???? Judges need to be real, for once.
    Well, that is exactly what skating has always been: the skaters need to pay their dues, so to speak. If Abbott would have skated better in World competitions and been on the podium even once, he would get better scores, I´d expect. His best international achievement is the win in 2008 GPF, which is just a small competition.

  7. #217
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaana View Post
    His best international achievement is the win in 2008 GPF, which is just a small competition.
    GPF is arguably the most valuable competition of the year outside of Worlds/Olympics.

  8. #218
    Banned janetfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    GPF is arguably the most valuable competition of the year outside of Worlds/Olympics.
    Perhaps it depends on where one comes from.
    Given the choice of being US Natl Champion or GPF champion - I would pick the US title in a heartbeat.

    As far as the prestige and tradition the GPF has very little of either.

    Maybe you forgot about Natl titles - or are just in love with the GP series - but it is nothing more than a very silly title made up by Cinquanta..

    I would rather be my countries champion than Cincuanta's champion any day of the week.

    I seriously doubt if Alissa would trade her US Championship for a GP title.
    Do you think Michelle would trade one of her nine US Titles for a GP title?

    I seriously doubt it.

    Johnny Weir showed us tears when he lost his US Championship but would never have a reason to do so over losing a GP title. Why is that?

    Maybe if a skater is from a smaller federation or a federation lacking a strong National Championship tradition the answer could be different. It might feel that way for fans too.
    Last edited by janetfan; 12-06-2009 at 08:59 AM.

  9. #219
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Being GPF Champion is more significant in the eyes of international judges than a National Title, IMO.

  10. #220
    Banned janetfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Being GPF Champion is more significant in the eyes of international judges than a National Title, IMO.
    Yes, I can see your point.
    I doubt if many US skaters would agree with you though.

  11. #221
    leave no stone unturned seniorita's Avatar
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    Gpf is an international competition, of course it is more significant. In terms of competition.
    Nationals are inside a country competition and usually with inflated marks which maybe dont reflect reality(russian nationals). Yes I think all the skaters would exchange their national championship with Gpf Gold. It is the most important series after worlds and euros (and 4cc) and they medal against the top cream of athletes internationally. Try to ask them. Yagudin was never a russian champion, so? You think he cares?He is marked one of the greatest and without it, lol! And yes russia is a strong federation.

  12. #222
    Banned janetfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seniorita View Post
    Gpf is an international competition, of course it is more significant. In terms of competition.
    Nationals are inside a country competition and usually with inflated marks which maybe dont reflect reality(russian nationals). Yes I think all the skaters would exchange their national championship with Gpf Gold. It is the most important series after worlds and euros (and 4cc) and they medal against the top cream of athletes internationally. Try to ask them. Yagudin was never a russian champion, so? You think he cares?He is marked one of the greatest and without it, lol! And yes russia is a strong federation.
    .A Russian skater might have reasons not to care about their Natl championship..
    A Russian champion might not be selected for his Natl team but an American skater will always be selected. That is a HUGE difference.

    An American skater knows that National titles are part of their legacy. Russia has a different tradition.

    That may be harder for international fans to understand but typically it is true.

    In an Olympic year it could be considered differently.

    Would Evan rather go to Vancouver as the GP champion and US Bronze medalist?

    Or would he also want to be the US Natl champion?

    Thinking about intl judges and how they view your skating is important. But taking the ice as you Natl champion is also important.

    ETA: There is no US skater that would trade a National title for the 4CC title. That is ridiculous and shows absolutely no understanding about our skating tradition.

    I doubt if an American skater would trade a Natl championship for a GP title either. Most American fans who watch skating every four years don't know or care about the GP series too much. They do know what it means to be the National Champion.

    Perhaps it is an inward view - but many international fans don't understand the importance and tradition of US Natls.

    It is important to us and goes back many years. Views from other parts of the world don't change it - even if from a strategic point it may feel correct to place more value on a international event like GP or 4CC.

    I am sure Evan wants the US Title this year and does not want to go to Vancouver as the runner up.
    Last edited by janetfan; 12-06-2009 at 07:34 AM.

  13. #223
    leave no stone unturned seniorita's Avatar
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    A Russian skater might have reasons not to care about their Natl championship..
    A Russian champion might not be selected for his Natl team but an American skater will always be selected. That is a big difference.
    Russian Team is selected by Russian Nationals, the gold medalist for sure and the second or third spot might be judged by their performace at euros as well if there is a tie, I dont see the big difference.
    Evan went as US bronze medalist in worlds and won the competition, I dont see it hurt his confidence. Of course everybody wants to be also the national champion as they hit the ice, I have no reasons to believe otherwise.
    We were just talking if nationals are more prestigious than grand prix series and I think if you are a top skater winning an international competition it counts .

  14. #224
    End subjectivity,reduce PCS, fix the COP! schiele's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinymavy15 View Post
    What is up with the tech calling/judging at this event? evan gets a season's record for a with a freeskate with a popped jump and a sloppy triple axel and no quad? sorry that is absurd and I am huge Evan fan. I think Oda should have actually won the event...had had pretty much the same number of mistakes that Evan did in the freeskate but the quality of his other stuff is great. It should have been close, but I would have put Oda in first after the free.
    Aha, so it appears I do not stand alone in my argument that the placement was not right..

  15. #225
    End subjectivity,reduce PCS, fix the COP! schiele's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seniorita View Post
    Russian Team is selected by Russian Nationals, the gold medalist for sure and the second or third spot might be judged by their performace at euros as well if there is a tie, I dont see the big difference.
    Evan went as US bronze medalist in worlds and won the competition, I dont see it hurt his confidence. Of course everybody wants to be also the national champion as they hit the ice, I have no reasons to believe otherwise.
    We were just talking if nationals are more prestigious than grand prix series and I think if you are a top skater winning an international competition it counts .
    Theoratically yes I feel the same, though sometimes it looks like there are always unknown exceptions coming up in Johnny's case..

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