Japanese Nationals (senior)

**Buttercup** · 12-26-2009, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by yelyoh

I think if Dai skates clean at the Olys nobody will be able to beat him. It's all going to be about the jumps.

I don't buy that. Takahashi's strength is that he's good across the board, but there isn't one area in his skating where I can say he excels above all other skaters, let alone several areas as your comment implies. This was Nats, of course he scored well. Not to mention, the chance of him skating not just clean but with the actual planned content is pretty small. IMO, the likelihood of any of the guys doing that in Vancouver is small, whether for health reasons or because they're headcases or due to technique issues, or all of the above - and whoever does manage it will likely win (or at least win a medal).

**mishieru07** · 12-26-2009, 11:12 AM

Don't think this has been posted yet. Pardon any translation mistakes:

Ladies SP: (TSS, TES, PCS)
1 Mao ASADA 69.12 36.84 32.28 8.20 7.80 8.15 8.10 8.10 0.00 #9
2 Yukari NAKANO Prince Hotel 68.90 38.70 30.20 7.60 7.35 7.70 7.45 7.65 0.00 #18
3 Miki ANDO Toyota Motr 68.68 36.80 31.88 8.00 7.65 8.05 7.95 8.20 0.00 #28
4 Akiko SUZUKI Howa sports landSkateclub 67.84 37.80 30.04 7.50 7.25 7.65 7.45 7.70 0.00 #16
5 Kanako MURAKAMI Grand Prix Tokai Club 60.28 33.80 26.48 6.70 6.40 6.65 6.60 6.75 0.00 #13
6 Fumie SUGURI AK 58.70 31.10 28.60 7.20 7.00 7.20 7.05 7.30 1.00 #5
7 Haruka IMAI Nihonbashi Jogakan 55.98 32.90 23.08 6.00 5.55 5.80 5.80 5.70 0.00 #29
8 Ayumi GOTO AMC Mizuho High School 55.96 33.80 22.16 5.75 5.30 5.60 5.50 5.55 0.00 #30
9 Yukiko FUJISAWA 55.82 34.30 21.52 5.45 5.10 5.50 5.40 5.45 0.00 #2
10 Mutsumi TAKAYAMA Meiji Univ 54.92 31.68 23.24 6.00 5.65 5.90 5.75 5.75 0.00 #7
11 Ayane NAKAMURA Chukyo Senior High School 54.60 32.80 21.80 5.70 5.35 5.40 5.55 5.25 0.00 #19
12 Nana TAKEDA Waseda Univ 54.54 29.74 24.80 6.20 5.95 6.30 6.20 6.35 0.00 #12
13 Kana MURAMOTO 53.34 31.50 21.84 5.50 5.25 5.40 5.60 5.55 0.00 #22
14 Yuki NISHINO 53.26 29.70 23.56 6.10 5.70 5.90 5.95 5.80 0.00 #11
15 Aki SAWADA KANSAI UNIV SKATING CLUB 51.48 30.40 21.08 5.45 5.05 5.40 5.25 5.20 0.00 #21
16 Shion KOKUBUN 51.12 31.20 19.92 5.25 4.75 5.05 4.90 4.95 0.00 #4
17 Satsuki MURAMOTO KANSAI UNIV SKATING CLUB 50.06 27.90 23.16 5.90 5.55 5.75 5.85 5.90 1.00 #14
18 Kako TOMOTAKI 49.02 30.90 18.12 4.70 4.35 4.55 4.60 4.45 0.00 #1
19 Karen KEMANAI Nihonbashi Jogakan 48.50 29.30 19.20 5.05 4.60 4.85 4.80 4.70 0.00 #3
20 Sayaka YODO 47.04 27.20 19.84 5.05 4.70 4.95 5.05 5.05 0.00 #24
21 Rumi SUIZU 46.94 26.50 21.44 5.40 5.10 5.35 5.40 5.55 1.00 #20
22 Ayako HAGIWARA Meiji Univ 45.70 24.62 21.08 5.35 5.00 5.35 5.25 5.40 0.00 #23
23 Mayumi HIOKI Chukyo Senior High School 43.60 24.20 19.40 5.05 4.70 4.90 4.85 4.75 0.00 #26
24 Eri SETO KANSAI UNIV SKATING CLUB 41.50 23.70 17.80 4.75 4.30 4.40 4.45 4.35 0.00 #15
25 Nanoha SATO Obihiro North Wing FC 40.80 21.36 20.44 5.10 4.80 5.25 5.10 5.30 1.00 #25
26 Shoko ISHIKAWA Meiji Univ 39.54 19.22 20.32 5.35 4.95 5.05 5.15 4.90 0.00 #17
27 Hinako KIKUCHI 37.10 19.94 18.16 4.65 4.35 4.55 4.60 4.55 1.00 #6
28 Haruka INOUE DOSHISHA F.SKATING CLUB 37.08 20.32 17.76 4.65 4.25 4.35 4.55 4.40 1.00 #10
29 Misaki OHARA Nihon Univ 36.40 19.00 17.40 4.55 4.10 4.35 4.45 4.30 0.00 #27
30 Naoko OGUMA 35.80 18.28 17.52 4.50 4.15 4.40 4.50 4.35 0.00 #8

There's less than 2 points separating the top 4! Can't wait to see the battle in the Ladies FS.

Interesting, Mao lost to both Akiko and Yukari on TES. I'm curious about the protocols.

**yelyoh** · 12-26-2009, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by Buttercup

I don't buy that. Takahashi's strength is that he's good across the board, but there isn't one area in his skating where I can say he excels above all other skaters, let alone several areas as your comment implies. This was Nats, of course he scored well. Not to mention, the chance of him skating not just clean but with the actual planned content is pretty small. IMO, the likelihood of any of the guys doing that in Vancouver is small, whether for health reasons or because they're headcases or due to technique issues, or all of the above - and whoever does manage it will likely win (or at least win a medal).

I don't care if you buy lt or not. You have your opinion and I have mine. I agree that his skating clean is a big if but IF he does I think he will win.

**Buttercup** · 12-26-2009, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by yelyoh

I don't care if you buy lt or not. You have your opinion and I have mine. I agree that his skating clean is a big if but IF he does I think he will win.

Well, clearly you cared enough about it to respond to my post.

The fixation on skating clean is a 6.0 thing. It's still important, but it's also important to go for difficult content, even if there are some errors. At this point, it's pretty much impossible to say how the guys' programs will stack up against each other because we haven't seen them all in the same event and judged by the same panel; also, in some cases we haven't seen the programs skated to their full potential, or even close to it. So any statements as to who is most likely to win strike me as premature, especially looking at a field of mostly inconsistent contenders.

**ayayukiituka** · 12-26-2009, 11:36 AM

I wonder who goes to 2010 World. It must be sure for JSF to send Dai.Nobu and Takahiko to OGM. But world?? I don't ecpect. we would know after ladies LP

**Medusa** · 12-26-2009, 12:57 PM

I like Daisuke. Had several banners with him etc.

But I don't think he is the best thing since sliced bread. He actually lacks in lots of departments, other skaters get crucified for problems in those departments. E.g. the jump layout this year just makes me go all "Huh?". He starts his program like Plushenko and Joubert (Quad, Axel etc.), just skating from jump to jump and overall doesn't really has many transitions to speak of. While his spins can be decent, they are often shaky, his sitspin especially.

His basic skating is very good, though even there he has guys in his country alone, who have better skating skills. And the footwork is of course his calling card. But just like Joubert and Plushenko, he is skating to the judges and the audience, relying heavily on his charm and personality.

So I think, even if he goes clean with 8 Triples and 1 Quad, he could still be beaten by a guy like Abbott, with the same jumps but an infinitely more complex program. Or by Plushenko and Joubert, if they go out there and land their stuff, including two Quads and two Triple Axels.

**seniorita** · 12-26-2009, 01:12 PM

I dont know about Joubert but Plush seems to be struggling at this phase, to have 2 quads and 2 3axels seems unrealistic right now, and I enjoyed Taka's program a lot. But i agree he is not the 8th wonder and most people seem to not look at his weakness. I still like his sp much more than his lp.

**Medusa** · 12-26-2009, 01:32 PM

Originally Posted by seniorita

I dont know about Joubert but Plush seems to be struggling at this phase, to have 2 quads and 2 3axels seems unrealistic right now, and I enjoyed Taka's program a lot. But i agree he is not the 8th wonder and most people seem to not look at his weakness. I still like his sp much more than his lp.

Plushy is a fighter par excellence, he had a bad day today and still put down one Quad and two Triple Axels, one of them at the end of the program. He also got nerves of steel, in contrast to a certain Frenchman (the sad thing is that Joubert is nevertheless the most consistent and mentally strongest male skater France has ever had).

Daisuke is an excellent, amazing showman. Especially this year he sells the hell out of his programs. But as so many people love to say on these boards if we talk about other skaters: the Olympic Gold should not be given for showmanship, but for transitions, intricacy, edging...

**Tinymavy15** · 12-26-2009, 01:35 PM

Congrats to Daisuke. What a great comeback story. Nice skates by all three guys, they will make one formidable olympic team. I agree that If Dau skates clean at the olympics the gold is his. I had been worried about his ability to skate a clean LP but he seems to be getting stronger.

**ks777** · 12-26-2009, 01:48 PM

I love Kozuka's skating. Just reminds me of Yuka Sato's skating.

**luvsasha** · 12-26-2009, 02:45 PM

^^ should, he is coached by her parents

**terpskate4ever** · 12-26-2009, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by seniorita

But i agree he is not the 8th wonder

Isn't Plush the current 8th wonder in the field if we take into account total career achievements?

Anyways, I'm just happy to finally see Daisuke achieve some nice results after the difficult year away with the injury and after a somewhat disappointing Grand Prix season. He's not back 100% yet but it's good to see him making progress.

And congrats to the other medalists.

**SamuraiKike** · 12-26-2009, 02:55 PM

So.. who goes to 4CC ??? Machida, Nanri and Nakamura?? Hanyu can't go cause he's too young. Perhaps Kozuka will want to go since he doesnt have much of a shot at Vancouver podium and would like to get your usual generous 4CC score plus ranking points.