- Joined
- Oct 13, 2009
The most funny is the guy who does a 4-3, and gets a +2 GOE on it, and comes in last at the GPF!
Pls don't make the suffering even more unbearable!
I was biting the couch pillow all the way thru with frustration.. :no::no:
Do men need the quad at this Olympics?
- Thread starter Bennett
- Start date
Pls don't make the suffering even more unbearable!
I was biting the couch pillow all the way thru with frustration.. :no::no:
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
Sometimes I wonder....I'm tempted to start a thread on headcases and see if anyone has any insight as to why the three big headcases of today-Verner, Kostner, and Czinsy- so often fail to deliver. Tomas might get really nervous or something.
And I know crazy, two quads and last place but he did deserve that finish because he popped 5 jumps into singles between the two programs. I think he must either still be sick or have some kind of anxiety/attention/stamina difficulties because those quads are just too easy for him so it's odd he can't land a triple flip....
I might have an insight, but I suspect the "headcase" label is of negative nature. We need a more positive approach.
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2006
Yes Tomas was sick at the GPF. So that explains it that time.
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2007
I hate ice-dance because I have literally no real clue what separates the Top Ten couples. Yes, maybe the second-placed couple is smoother than the 5th-placed couple - but hey, what's with the 8th-placed couple, they look smooth, too!
That's why I love the Quad. It makes the sport clearer. And probably not just to me. How many men do 3A, 3-3 and solo 3 in their short programs these days? If you look at the protocols from Worlds, there are some men in 15th with the same - clean! - jump content as the 1st- and 2nd-placed skater. It's all about the tiny nuances these days, level 4 spin, level 3 footwork and the almighty PCS. To me, these are so subjective (and yes, transitions can be subjective, e.g. the explanation says that even hand movements etc. count as transitions), that sometimes watching skating is no fun.
A Quad is easily to recognise - it's the monster jump with 4 revolutions. My guyfriends can distinguish a Quad from a Triple without any skating knowledge whatsoever. But footwork quality? Sure, most people can see if it looks confident or not - and most people can see that Joubert's footwork is different from Lambiel's and Lambiel's is different from Kozuka's. But would everyone say that Lambiel is superior to Kozuka and Kozuka superior to Joubert or that Kozuka is superior to Lambiel? I doubt it.
But someone who lands a Quad-Triple, a Triple Axel and a solo Triple has clearly superior jump content to someone who lands a Triple-Triple, a Triple Axel and a solo Triple. There is just no discussion. The jumps are in most cases the most recognisable elements of a program. There are some skaters who have other rare standout moves, Dai's footwork, Cohen's spiral, Lambiel's spins. But lots of others have footwork of similar quality, spins of similar quality.
That's why I think the jumps, and therefore the Quad, should be of immense importance and that's why I will be bitterly disappointed if the Quad turns out to be insignificant in the outcome of this years Olympic battle. The jumps are the most objective thing about figure skating. But that's only the case if people keep pushing the envelope.
That's why I love the Quad. It makes the sport clearer. And probably not just to me. How many men do 3A, 3-3 and solo 3 in their short programs these days? If you look at the protocols from Worlds, there are some men in 15th with the same - clean! - jump content as the 1st- and 2nd-placed skater. It's all about the tiny nuances these days, level 4 spin, level 3 footwork and the almighty PCS. To me, these are so subjective (and yes, transitions can be subjective, e.g. the explanation says that even hand movements etc. count as transitions), that sometimes watching skating is no fun.
A Quad is easily to recognise - it's the monster jump with 4 revolutions. My guyfriends can distinguish a Quad from a Triple without any skating knowledge whatsoever. But footwork quality? Sure, most people can see if it looks confident or not - and most people can see that Joubert's footwork is different from Lambiel's and Lambiel's is different from Kozuka's. But would everyone say that Lambiel is superior to Kozuka and Kozuka superior to Joubert or that Kozuka is superior to Lambiel? I doubt it.
But someone who lands a Quad-Triple, a Triple Axel and a solo Triple has clearly superior jump content to someone who lands a Triple-Triple, a Triple Axel and a solo Triple. There is just no discussion. The jumps are in most cases the most recognisable elements of a program. There are some skaters who have other rare standout moves, Dai's footwork, Cohen's spiral, Lambiel's spins. But lots of others have footwork of similar quality, spins of similar quality.
That's why I think the jumps, and therefore the Quad, should be of immense importance and that's why I will be bitterly disappointed if the Quad turns out to be insignificant in the outcome of this years Olympic battle. The jumps are the most objective thing about figure skating. But that's only the case if people keep pushing the envelope.
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2008
- Joined
- May 15, 2009
Interesting thoughts but here is something to consider.
At US Natls Ryan Bradley will be doing a quad in his SP and two in his LP.
There is a chance he might land all three of his quads - and still not make the podium.
Is there something wrong if a clean Johnny and Evan do not land a single quad and Jeremy lands one quad but Ryan still comes in 4th or 5th?
Will this set skating back in the US - or is it possible there is more to skating than just the quad? I am not trying to be a wise guy, this is a qustion I have thought about since reading that Ryan is going for three quads.
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2004
I agree... I also believe that the OGM will come down to a shoot out between Plushy and Joubert. This is the big time and if these two go clean and neat with quads in the men's event ... anyone will be hard pressed to bring them down. I also give the slight edge to Brian because he's European AND beautiful. That should count on his PCS!
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
I can't figure it oue either. They could reverse the results and it would be ok with me.
I think choreography which is entertaining has 99% to do with it
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
GET BETTER TOMAS! I know you can beat prince charming if you put your mind to it!
Poor guy, he's always sick it seems.
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2008
and the costumes
i have no idea of ice dance details also, all I learnt from last Olys was that if you fall it is a bad bad thing and you get the Babstare!
Previously I knew oksana + platov, anissina + peizerat, lobacheva + averbuch, and ina + zimmerman but mostly enjoying peizerat's and zeimerman's hair.
Now i m rooting for kerrs but dont know why!
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2005
I don't think that everyone can pick out a quad. Kevin Reynolds' quads look like triples because he spins so fast. He often gets little audience reaction for them. Timothy Goebel's quads werent' huge either.
In terms of jumps, we have pretty much seen as far as the envelope can go. There isn't going to be a jump that is bigger than a quad.
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2004
very wrong, in that case they should send Ryan with Johnny and Jeremy to Vancouver.
why, where is Plushy from?Australia?
I got the hint anyway
Yeah, but Plushy isn't European AND Beautiful. He's European AND Arrogant. Which on a man is almost the same thing... hmmm...will have to reconsider and get back to you....
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
Yeah but Joubert is European AND Really Beautiful so he beats Plushy in that game
. Also, if Ryan lands his quads he should def go instead of Johnny. I'm sorry but I just don't find Johnny that great, he tries to be expressive to make up for his lack of technical difficulty, and while girls can sometimes play that game, guys can't quite as well. Go big or go home.
I would be really disappointed if the OGM winner does not do a single quad. I love beautiful edges, great musicality, great flow, but men's skating is not ice dance. Quad just make people excited! But it has to go hand in hand with beautiful skating to count I don't enjoy woody skaters no matter how many quad they put into a program, either.
I don't enjoy woody skaters no matter how many quad they put into a program, either.- Joined
- Dec 29, 2004
Yeah but Joubert is European AND Really Beautiful so he beats Plushy in that game
Also, if Ryan lands his quads he should def go instead of Johnny. I'm sorry but I just don't find Johnny that great, he tries to be expressive to make up for his lack of technical difficulty, and while girls can sometimes play that game, guys can't quite as well. Go big or go home.
Can't we just call it a tie and leave Abbott home? That seems fair... I don't like his hair.
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
No way! Abbott is probably the best one out there. It's should be Lysacek Abbott and Bradley. It's time for Johnny to retire, he just doesn't skate like he used to.
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2008
plushy is spectacular:boohoo:Yeah but Joubert is European AND Really Beautiful so he beats Plushy in that game
i thought this was lysacek.
what go big does he do?On the other hand, johnny has great jumps, smooth steps, very very nice spins and he is original.
