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Thread: Thoughts on U.S. Nationals judging?

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    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
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    Thoughts on U.S. Nationals judging?

    With all this chatter about score inflation, I've been pleasantly surprised that we didn't see that at this Nationals.

    Jeremy Abbott certainly got a really high score, but I would expect so after he did 8 triples and a quad. Patrick Chan didn't do nearly that much technically and he got a similar score for his FS.

    And it looks like PCS has only been a minor factor here. I think Lysacek and Weir got some reputation PCS during the FS, but it's not much higher than what Ryan Bradley or Adam Rippon got.

    Any thoughts on why the U.S. judges aren't inflating scores so far?

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    L'art pour l'art Medusa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    Any thoughts on why the U.S. judges aren't inflating scores so far?
    Because they are better than Russians, Canadians and Japanese?

    No, seriously. I mean it. I am so pleasantly surprised by this. They judged what they saw - and not what possible political considerations or former results might have dictated them.

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    Rink Rat i love to skate's Avatar
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    There is still two events to go...

    FYI, Patrick still did 8 triples and had a pretty fantastic skate. Jeremy's skate was exceptional though! Good for him!
    Last edited by i love to skate; 01-17-2010 at 10:00 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    Because they are better than Russians, Canadians and Japanese?

    No, seriously. I mean it. I am so pleasantly surprised by this. They judged what they saw - and not what possible political considerations or former results might have dictated them.
    And French, Swiss and Finns.

    I've gotta echo Medusa on this, though. The judging was far fairer than I anticipated, and that's worth applauding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    I've gotta echo Medusa on this, though. The judging was far fairer than I anticipated, and that's worth applauding.
    I must agree. I'm glad there has been minimal score inflation so far. I hope it continues next weekend with Ladies and Dance.

    It will be interesting to see what happens if a) Cohen competes and b) all top 6 ladies skate perfect SPs.

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    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    It will be interesting to see what happens if a) Cohen competes and b) all top 6 ladies skate perfect SPs.
    yeah, because THAT's going to happen.... (hey I've kept my expectations low SO far with fairly good results that proved me wrong!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    yeah, because THAT's going to happen.... (hey I've kept my expectations low SO far with fairly good results that proved me wrong!)
    Notice I said "IF"

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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    I must agree. I'm glad there has been minimal score inflation so far. I hope it continues next weekend with Ladies and Dance.

    It will be interesting to see what happens if a) Cohen competes and b) all top 6 ladies skate perfect SPs.
    I know what will happen!

    1.) Cohen - 75
    2.) Czisny - 70
    3.) Nagasu - 62
    4.) Flatt - 61
    5.) Wagner - 60
    6.) Caroline - 59

    Then Gao and Maxwell if perfect will get, you know, maybe a 50, no higher than 55 by any means. :banging: hate the judging system :banging:

    So unfair but you know that's what it will look like if they are all clean. Czisny got a 66 last year and her SP this year is just a better program.

    Actually, change Sasha to an 80 and Alissa a 75, just for kicks .

    Then Sasha will do the exact same program in Vancouver and get a 57! No joke
    Last edited by Tonichelle; 01-18-2010 at 12:00 AM. Reason: USE THE EDIT FEATURE DON'T DOUBLE POST

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    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    ...not what possible political considerations or former results might have dictated them.
    It's all a plot. By low-balling the U.S. skaters at U.S. Nationals they will shame all the other judges into giving out low scores at the Olympics. Then the U.S. bloc will pull a switcheroo and send U.S. skaters scores through the roof.

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    I think any plot relying on the shame of international judges is doomed to failure

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    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    It's all a plot. By low-balling the U.S. skaters at U.S. Nationals they will shame all the other judges into giving out low scores at the Olympics. Then the U.S. bloc will pull a switcheroo and send U.S. skaters scores through the roof.
    me likes your thinking

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    With all this chatter about score inflation, I've been pleasantly surprised that we didn't see that at this Nationals.

    Jeremy Abbott certainly got a really high score, but I would expect so after he did 8 triples and a quad. Patrick Chan didn't do nearly that much technically and he got a similar score for his FS.

    And it looks like PCS has only been a minor factor here. I think Lysacek and Weir got some reputation PCS during the FS, but it's not much higher than what Ryan Bradley or Adam Rippon got.

    Any thoughts on why the U.S. judges aren't inflating scores so far?
    The inflation will come later I think. In the ladies event, there are what, 24 entries? And I'm sure half of those entries will attempt a 3lz-2t, 3f, and 2a in the short, and probably 6 or 10 will be clean on the jumps, meaning PCS will decide who gets what place.

    In the long, more things can happen, but last year, Alissa got almost the exact same score for her 3 triple FS that Rachael and Caroline got for their 7 (6 clean) triple FS. In the long the ladies will attempt between 5 and 7 triples, and for anyone that isn't Sasha, Alissa, Ashley, Rachael, Mirai, Caroline , the more triples you land the higher your score will be.

    Among the top 6 though, it will come down to PCS. If someone like Maxwell, Gao, or Bulanhaugi skates really great, I can see something like what happened to Adam Rippon happening to them, getting bumped down in the rankings to like 4th or below even when if they outperform the favorites.

    If all the top 6 splat that is the only way anyone who isn't Sasha, Alissa, Ashley, Rachael, Caroline, or Mirai will be on the podium or named to the Olympic team. But that's just how I see it.

    So annoying, if Sasha pulls a Lepisto and wins a spot i'll be pissed. Oh yes, I can be the best skater in the world with one 3toe and one 3loop as the only jumps in my LP. Aren't I sooo impressive? Watch out Yuna Kim, I'm going to break your World record with three whole triples in the LP!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    Among the top 6 though, it will come down to PCS. If someone like Maxwell, Gao, or Bulanhaugi skates really great, I can see something like what happened to Adam Rippon happening to them, getting bumped down in the rankings to like 4th or below even when if they outperform the favorites.
    I thought Adam Rippon overscored in both programs.
    His long had 2 faulty triple axels, which are his two hardest jumps. That LP didn't deserve 150+.
    He was 4th after the SP for a faulty lutz and crashed into the board over a flawless Armin.

  14. #14
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Agree with Flattfan - there was no "holding up" PCS marks in the men's SP over the "new guys". They looked pretty fair and on par with what these guys should see internationally if they skate the same. Johnny a little lower due to being slower (SS) than Abbott and Lysacek. Abbott - you can really see the figures work he's done in his clear and solid edgework.

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    I wouldn't praise the judges to high Heaven just yet. Let's wait until the ladies produce a result the USFSA and NBC don't expect or want, then I will heap the praise upon them that they deserve.
    Last edited by Mathman; 01-20-2010 at 02:50 PM.

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