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Thread: Inflated Scores

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    What I can't tell from the videos is how they compare with each other and with the other top skaters in terms of power, speed, absolute ice coverage.

    The actual Skating Skills marks may vary from performance to performance depending on execution. Same for the other components. And Interpretation especially would be more subject to judges' (or fans') subjective impressions.
    I can't speak for Abbott as I don't watch him that often but as for Patrick his ice coverage is one of the best. In his straight line he not only goes end to end, he also covers the width of the ice. He seems to build up speed fairly easily - Kurt has said that even he has no idea how he picks up his speed.

    Interpretation is subjective as you said but I feel as if Chan should be way ahead in this area when you compare him to a skater like, Plushenko. In Plushenko's short program, it doesn't even seem like he is listening to his own music as he is skating to a different tempo.
    Last edited by i love to skate; 01-20-2010 at 03:32 PM.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by i love to skate View Post
    I can't speak for Abbott as I don't watch him that often but as for Patrick his ice coverage is one of the best. In his straight line he not only goes end to end, he also covers the width of the ice. He seems to build up speed fairly easily - Kurt has said that even he has no idea how he picks up his speed.
    I watched them both, and I totally agree with you, not only just because I am bearing my username
    Abbott has superior jumping technique, smooth and good edges, but lacks the attack, power and speed of Patrick's skating.

  3. #33
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    To me it seems inevitable to watch the PCS inflation that has been occurring since IJS started. It's very much a natural evolution in my opinion. It happened in the extreme in gymnastics too. There was a point before they imploded the system and added difficulty factors that a simple 9.90 meant nothing, and 9.9625 might only mean 3rd.

    I expect there will be some effort to prompt a "reset" lest the entire system have to undergo more renovation. The problem will be when "world records" are not broken any more. Maybe just in Olympic years.

  4. #34
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    Well, only international competition scores count toward world records. So there won't be a real problem until international scores are inflated as those given at various national championships.

    At which point, how will nationals have any room left to inflate their scores?

    If there are brilliant performances at the Olympics, there will be PCS in the 9s and maybe a scattering of 10s. But there will have to be a lot of brilliant performances for that to become the standard.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    You don't think Chan's step sequences worth level four? If his was not a level 4, then many others should be at level 1-2. Abbott's PCS are low because he's just not that good.

    <snip>

    Don't even understand your question. Why or who thinks Canada is different? Are you implying that if a Canadian team win gold, it's because it's in Canada?
    Chan's step sequences are worthy of level four. Especially the level four he got in his long. My question is if it's a close situation, would an international caller call it the same way. gkelly says it's more yes/no than GOEs/PCS.

    My second criticism, and this is more vague and I understand that is as follows.

    a) It seems to me that the huge results for Rochette, Chan, and Dube/Davison are partially predicated on the notion that they've been written off, and the judges want to remind the world what they're capable of. Except they went too far.

    b) To me, it than follows that Virtue/Moir, who never lost the top tier contender status weren't overmarked by the same degree as the other three. Their FD score wasn't as huge as expected, for example. Now, looking at the protocols, they got two level threes for their FD (step sequences), whereas at the GPF they got only one - the rest fours. So that closed the gap somewhat. But seriously, based on the general overscoring and that V/M are the best chance for gold (imo), a score above 110 would've been in line with what the rest were garnering. Even their OD 70, which seems larger, was garnered for their first OD this season with all level fours.

    c) Rochette's score is ten points clear of the international best: was that the best skate ever in COP? She didn't do a 3-3 combo, not 3a or quad. It wasn't an "all level four" performance. Hell, I think she could still skate that with more attack (as many pointed out, it was very focused on nailing every single thing, as opposed to creating a brilliant whole). Chan had a couple of bobbles AND lower technical content than what we're gonna see from other skaters, and his score is still on par with theirs. Now, we say that we cannot compare scores from different competitions, and we know National scores are different beasts all together. But I still raise my eyebrows here.

    d) If they medal is it because they're Canadian? No. I don't believe that in any strictest sense of that logic.

    e) Anyway, I'm done beating this dead horse. Sorry to be such a pedant.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post

    a) It seems to me that the huge results for Rochette, Chan, and Dube/Davison are partially predicated on the notion that they've been written off, and the judges want to remind the world what they're capable of. Except they went too far.

    b) To me, it than follows that Virtue/Moir, who never lost the top tier contender status weren't overmarked by the same degree as the other three. Their FD score wasn't as huge as expected, for example. Now, looking at the protocols, they got two level threes for their FD (step sequences), whereas at the GPF they got only one - the rest fours. So that closed the gap somewhat. But seriously, based on the general overscoring and that V/M are the best chance for gold (imo), a score above 110 would've been in line with what the rest were garnering. Even their OD 70, which seems larger, was garnered for their first OD this season with all level fours.

    c) Rochette's score is ten points clear of the international best: was that the best skate ever in COP? She didn't do a 3-3 combo, not 3a or quad. It wasn't an "all level four" performance. Hell, I think she could still skate that with more attack (as many pointed out, it was very focused on nailing every single thing, as opposed to creating a brilliant whole). Chan had a couple of bobbles AND lower technical content than what we're gonna see from other skaters, and his score is still on par with theirs. Now, we say that we cannot compare scores from different competitions, and we know National scores are different beasts all together. But I still raise my eyebrows here.
    Every nation has the same so-called inflated scoring for their skaters. But I find many people, esp people on this board, seem to just notice Canadian skaters are getting inflated mark. I can already tell that if any of the Canadian wins gold, bitching and mourning will start on this board.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    Every nation has the same so-called inflated scoring for their skaters. But I find many people, esp people on this board, seem to just notice Canadian skaters are getting inflated mark. I can already tell that if any of the Canadian wins gold, bitching and mourning will start on this board.
    ITA..........CD scores at US Nats were inflated big time

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    Every nation has the same so-called inflated scoring for their skaters. But I find many people, esp people on this board, seem to just notice Canadian skaters are getting inflated mark. I can already tell that if any of the Canadian wins gold, bitching and mourning will start on this board.
    a) I'm Canadian. If they win gold and earn it, I'll be at the frontlines pushing back the hoardes of darkness (or something like that).

    b) Given that I've pointed out other national examples of overscoring, and given that we've complained and complained about it (see the threads for Russia in particular), I don't think it's fair to make that accusation in general.

    c) Unfortunately, the National Events that we see (either live or on Youtube) are the ones we go by. That rules out say Finnish, Swiss etc nationals.

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