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Thread: Junior Dance CD

  1. #1
    Always supporting skaters :) 100yen's Avatar
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    Junior Dance CD

    Warm-up Group 1
    1 Katie Donaldson, Wichita FSC/Brock Jacobs, Wichita FSC
    2 Piper Gilles, Broadmoor SC/Zachary Donohue, Broadmoor SC
    3 Katharine Zeigler, Essex SC of NJ/Baxter Burbank, Fairbanks FSC
    4 Natalie Wojton, Peninsula SC/Michael Soyfer, IceWorks SC

    Warm-up group 2
    5 Kristen Nardozzi, Chicago FSC/Robert Cuthbertson, Stars FSC of Texas
    6 Maia Shibutani, SC of New York Inc/Alex Shibutani, Arctic FSC
    7 Rachel Tibbetts, Broadmoor SC/Collin Brubaker, All Year FSC
    8 Janine Halstead, SC of New York Inc/Robert Knopf, SC of New York Inc
    9 Gabrielle Friedenberg, Washington FSC/Benjamin Nykiel, Bowie FSC

    Warm-up Group 3
    10 Lauri Bonacorsi, Peninsula SC/Travis Mager, Columbia FSC (MD)
    11 Anastasia Cannuscio, University of Delaware FSC/Colin McManus, Skating Club of Boston
    12 Charlotte Lichtman, Arctic FSC/Dean Copely, All Year FSC
    13 Isabella Cannuscio, University of Delaware FSC/Ian Lorello, University of Delaware FSC
    14 Anastasia Olson, Ann Arbor FSC/Jordan Cowan, All Year FSC

  2. #2
    Custom Title skatemom1122's Avatar
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    I'm new to dance, especially the CD. Can anyone give me tips on what to look for in what separates the teams? I thought that the first two teams were fairly even, yet they are 8 points apart.

  3. #3
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
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    Dear Skatemom1122,
    In the unlikely event that DorisPulaski does not respond to your post (she is perhaps our most knowledgeable poster on ice dance and very happy to share her knowledge), here are a couple of her posts from a year ago on the top Sr dance contenders for the Olympics. They might shed some light on your question. You might try reposting it in The Edge section of this forum if it doesn't get more attention in this section. Best of luck to your child(ren) and thanks for your support of the art and sport of figure skating!!!

    All that follows is by DorisPulaski:

    Dance: DelSchoes, DomShabs, V&M and B&A need first and foremost to get and stay healthy. And they need not to be failing to attend their national championships.

    The biggest need of K&N, P&B, and D&W is to beat the national #1's at their national championships, and beat them again at 4CC's and Europeans. All three teams are, by a quirk of health and fate, already their national champions this year.

    B&A need an FD that they really really can relate to. They have been strong in ODs any number of times, but their FD's have been a problem. I think they need to choose something light hearted, which will fit their personalities better than operatic tragedies.

    B&A and Domshabs both need to work on getting level 4's on step sequences. Dostatni & tech specialist team members were quite forgiving in their level of skills they assigned at Worlds. If Judy Blumberg or one of the other tougher tech specialists is the lead at Olympics, they could really suffer. B&A need also to continue the carriage and extension & CD work they have done so well and to such profit this year with their new coaches. DomShabs also need to work on their dance spins, IMO. Maxim really needs to keep working with the physical therapist and his doctor, more than anything.

    V&M need to return to the romance type FD's that worked so well for them in Valse Triste and Umbrellas of Cherbourg. This year they showed they can expand and do more modern types of music--next year they should play to their strength. And they should not go for polka or Russian folk in their OD. I have doubts that they can do humor very successfully. They seem to be quite serious young people. Technically, other than staying healthy, the one thing they might work on is their dance spins. Their lifts are the best in the business right now.

    D&W already have the tech content down for the elements. (They had the highest tech score in the FD this year at Worlds) Other than B&A's retirement, what they need to do is work on posture and precise foot placement & extension.in an effort to pop up their Skating Skills PCS score. They made some improvements this year, but they have more to do. And they need to start learning the Tango Romantica and practicing the Golden Waltz right away. Their CD's are the weakest section of their competitions, always. And the CD's are a great place to work on their weaknesses. They also need to relax in the CD's. They seemed particularly tense this year. In the OD, they need not to be doing Russian folk again, and not picking hoedown. What they don't need to work on is projecting to the audience. It was obvious from the marvelous response they got in LA for their FD, that they have really done well on that (and it's a great improvement over the last 2 years).

    K&N need for DomShabs to retire. They also need some CD work. Because Jana is so short, the Golden Waltz is likely to be a particular challenge for them, and they should start working on it right away. I'd love to see them do something not classical for their FD. They did classical this year, and it was not nearly as good as their last year's FD (and didn't rate with the judges as well either). Good on them for stretching themselves, though!! Also, they should refrain from acrobatic lifts and besti squats as opening and closing moves in all CD's. I think their moves in the paso offended some of the judges who decided, "that's not a paso at all" and downgraded them accordingly. Also, do not use any costume suggestive of a vegetable (like Jana's lettuce OD costume) again. I love their overall creativity and can't wait to see what they come up with for their Olympic program!

    DelSchoes have the best CD's out there. However, they need to work a bit on their dance spins, and also need to avoid making mental lapse mistakes, a problem that has plagued them in the past. Above all, they need to be healthy. In a politicks free competition, if no one else improves much, I would expect them to win the Olympics in a walk.

    P&B are another team that really need to improve their CD's-they have been unable to score better than D&W and B&A, teams notorious for CD problems. They also need to arrive at their first competition totally prepared. They might well have done better at Worlds this year if they had arrived at Skate Canada in shape, and had not ended up at SC behind Crone Poirier and Davis & White. Their FD this year was a very open one, a reason that it didn't score outrageously well, given the level of its charm, and the fact that by Worlds, they received all level 4's.

    F&S-first they need to stay on their feet. The fall in the OD was disastrous to their hopes, and there will be fall out from it next year, too. Second they need to do something about their lifts. Granted they are nearly the same size; still DomShabs seem to be able to use that to their advantage. F&S keep using the same lifts, and also generic level 4 lifts that any of the top 20 skaters might do. With 4 lifts scored in the FD, the pedestrian nature of their lifts is a problem. They also have struggled all year with their dance spins and need to work on them. Also I'd like to see them do a very steamy Latin FD-the Beethoven thing didn't work for me on so many levels, and it never scored well. They had a wonderful Italian folk OD last year, and I hope they find an equally charming folk OD for the Olympic year.

    S&B need to wait for B&A (and D&W) to retire too. But they had timing problems at this years worlds in the CD. Great posture and toe point is good (and they have those), but timing is equally important. . The timing is particularly difficult in the Tango Romantica, and they should start working on it right away. And they need to work on their speed/power. They are not quite as fast as the top couples. They also need work on dance spins a lot. And please, I hope they choose n FD that does not have the droning, repetitive type of music they had this year. They seemed to love their OD, but their FD not so much. They need an FD they truly love.

    Kerrs- I totally love the Kerrs!!!

    One thing they need to do is stay with Platov! He made sure that they arrived at Skate America in shape, and prepared to skate their programs. This is something they never did in past years. When you saw them at Euros, you'd say, where did this wonderful team come from??? I didn't notice them in the GP...and when you looked back at their earlier event scores for the season, you could see it was because they did not score well and skated poorly in their first event, a little better in their second event, but they never made the podium in the GP until this year (2 third places, and third at Euros!). That is all due to new discipline and commitment to training. The result of bad rankings is that ice dance is partially a game of expectations. A bad fall GP season means a couple points off your CD and the judges don't catch up with the improvement until the FD, and by that time, you're mired way down in the standings. I can't stress that enough for them...arrive in October in tiptop shape. Their strengths are unique programs and a lot of commitment to the program when they skate. They had my very favorite folk OD last year I don't know what they'll do this year -- it's too bad that they used up the Scottish dance for a non-Olympic season, but who knew the ISU would do folk again so soon. However, catching the "character of the dance" is a strength of theirs. They did it again with 40's Lindy Hop & Swing again this year.
    They are a team that has had trouble with CD's, and I'm sure Platov will continue to make them work very hard on the CD's, especially since both the Tango Romantica & the Golden Waltz are both very difficult. They need to continue to work on their twizzles. They both & John famously have lots of trouble with twizzles. Platov has them doing mirror twizzles to conceal the lack of unison in twizzles, but you can't hide everything. Also they need to work on matching leg lines, and unison in general, and on John's feet, which aren't that tidy, particularly in footwork. I'd like to see them with some new lifts, as they do some lift recycling as well. (that handstand lift is in both the OD & FD for example).
    I'd never think to suggest what they should skate to--their choices are wonderful, and I'd rather be surprised!!!

    Capellini & Lanotte - are another team that have to wait for the number one team to retire. This year they worked like crazy to do better than F&S, but still finished behind them even with F&S falling in the OD. It has to be very discouraging for them. British Eurosport absolutely adores this team, even when they are not skating very well, as in the OD at Worlds, mostly because A: they're young B: Anna is gorgeous.

    Somewhat, I think they peak at the wrong time, but opposite of the Kerrs. They seemed much better to me at Cup of China than here at the end of the season. They should perhaps pace themselves a bit more. I think there is also a speed and power issue here, too. They also lose touch with the character of the dance from time to time. She smiled all the way through the paso, plus had odd headrolls. Not a good idea.

    Do you know the old original shaggy dog story? After a bunch of contests, the old man's shaggy dog is finally at the Worlds Shaggy Dog contest, having won all the qualifiers. And the the first judge says that's a shaggy dog. The second judge says, "That's a very shaggy dog." The third judge then says, "Nah, that's not a shaggy dog at all." You don't want to get to worlds and discover that your little paso character trick gets the judges thinking that's not a paso at all. It happened this year to K&N, and to a lesser extent to C&L, I think.

    C&L will definitely move up after the older couples retire. I'm thinking DelSchoes and B&A will retire after the Olympics. It's possible DomShabs will retire too. Maybe V&M, if they win gold. So 3 or 4 teams will be gone, and that would move C&L up to 6th.

  4. #4
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    In general, a CD skated faster is better, all other things being equal. Speed can be best judged by the size of the patter. Bigger is faster.

    Deep edges are better. This is easy to see by the lean of the skaters. No steps done on flats.

    Leglines should match.

    Carriage should be proper.

    The closer the skaters skate the better.

    Skaters' timing to the beat must be right.

    The skaters should portray the character of the dance. In the case of the Argentine Tango, it should look like a tango.

    Here's ice-dance.com's reference:
    http://www.ice-dance.com/reference/c...ies/#argentine

    ARGENTINE TANGO



    Music - Tango 4/4
    Tempo - 24 measures of 4 beats per minute
    - 96 beats per minute
    Pattern - Set
    Duration - The time required to skate 2 sequences is 1:10 min.

    "The Argentine Tango is a sinuous dance and should be skated with strong edges and considerable élan. Good flow and fast travel over the ice are essential and must be achieved without obvious effort or pushing. [...]

    This tango is danced to the rhythm of Latin American tango music where the musical count is 1-2-3-4-and-1, etc. This differs from the Spanish tango rhythm of 1-2-and-3-4-1, etc. The many varied step sequences in this dance are complementary to the dramatic and romantic character of the music. Dancers must at all times be aware of the rhythmic timing and reflect this in the execution of steps and in expressive interpretation of the music. Prolonged free leg extension, upright, graceful carriage and good unison are needed for this dance. Where appropriate, rotations must be fast but controlled. The partners should make maximum use of the interpretive elements of the dance, including the short steps, quick turns and serpentine movements."

    Inventors - Reginald J. Wilkie and Daphne B. Wallis
    First Performance - London, Westminster Ice Rink, 1934
    z

  5. #5
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
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    What did I tell you?

  6. #6
    Always supporting skaters :) 100yen's Avatar
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    For me, compulsory dances are usually particularly difficult to look for big separations unless the differences are blatant, like if a team clearly has deeper edges and more speed than a slower team that may have shallow edges.
    It's good to keep an eye out for teams that put better expression into the skating, too.

    "Setting the mood" is especially important in the CD, like the tango here. A team is going to get a higher score if they stylize their body and facial expressions to the tango rather than a team who might just do some sharp head and arm twists to try and mimic the mood of the tango.

    Watching the CD closely, it's good to look for the quality of the turns executed like the mohawk, counter or rocker (that they aren't jumped or three-turned). While many teams might be able to express the tango well, this is where the skill levels are clearly defined. Maintaining good edges and an ease of speed when changing holds shows the judges that the skaters have control. It is best when a couple looks like they are gliding over the ice without looking like they have to work hard or push especially hard to stroke. The ability to control the twizzle with speed also factors in greatly to the TES.

    Also watch for timing with the music and unison, especially with the free leg and how the torso is carried (does one partner extend the free leg higher than the other? Is one partner slouching over more than the other?).

    I hope this helps!! I will have to watch those two skaters at the start again when the video goes on-demand~

    EDIT:
    Haha, everyone beat me to it! :3

  7. #7
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    did I miss it?

    apparently I haven't missed it fully! *whew*

    I love CDs!
    Last edited by Tonichelle; 01-20-2010 at 12:12 AM.

  8. #8
    Always supporting skaters :) 100yen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    I love CDs!
    Me too! I would like to see a junior waltz once in a while, though!

    It feels so sad and neglected just like it was last season

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    There was a woman at one end of the rink who kept yelling out "You're awesome!!" to some of the couples as they skated past.

    Hilarious!!

  10. #10
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    probably another skater/parent...

    the same type that screams "yeah you're hot" umpteen bazillion times during the ladies and mens events... oy

  11. #11
    Always supporting skaters :) 100yen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by missysays View Post
    There was a woman at one end of the rink who kept yelling out "You're awesome!!" to some of the couples as they skated past.

    Hilarious!!
    And there was one very, very high pitched screaming girl. It wouldn't be so bad if the whole crowd was like that, but I have to say the growling noises she made were kind of

  12. #12
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Results

    2010 US Figure Skating Championships
    01/15/2010 - 01/23/2010
    Junior Dance
    CD: Argentine Tango
    Final Result Details Place Name TSS
    = TES
    + PCS
    + SS TI PF IN Deduction
    - Start
    #
    1 Maia Shibutani, SC of New York Inc
    Alex Shibutani, Arctic FSC 35.72 19.17 16.55 6.61 6.46 6.71 6.75 0.00 #6
    2 Rachel Tibbetts, Broadmoor SC
    Collin Brubaker, All Year FSC 33.76 18.48 15.28 6.18 6.04 6.07 6.14 0.00 #7
    3 Isabella Cannuscio, University of Delaware FSC
    Ian Lorello, University of Delaware FSC 30.94 16.73 14.21 5.71 5.57 5.68 5.82 0.00 #13
    4 Piper Gilles, Broadmoor SC
    Zachary Donohue, Broadmoor SC 30.81 16.81 14.00 5.71 5.43 5.68 5.61 0.00 #2
    5 Lauri Bonacorsi, Peninsula SC
    Travis Mager, Columbia FSC (MD) 29.88 16.61 13.27 5.29 5.32 5.29 5.32 0.00 #10
    6 Anastasia Cannuscio, University of Delaware FSC
    Colin McManus, Skating Club of Boston 29.50 16.51 12.99 5.11 5.18 5.07 5.46 0.00 #11
    7 Charlotte Lichtman, Arctic FSC
    Dean Copely, All Year FSC 28.78 16.08 12.70 5.18 5.07 4.89 5.11 0.00 #12
    8 Anastasia Olson, Ann Arbor FSC
    Jordan Cowan, All Year FSC 28.71 15.81 12.90 5.07 5.11 5.14 5.39 0.00 #14
    9 Katharine Zeigler, Essex SC of NJ
    Baxter Burbank, Fairbanks FSC 25.65 14.45 11.20 4.46 4.46 4.46 4.54 0.00 #3
    10 Natalie Wojton, Peninsula SC
    Michael Soyfer, IceWorks SC 25.58 14.84 10.74 4.43 4.21 4.25 4.25 0.00 #4
    11 Gabrielle Friedenberg, Washington FSC
    Benjamin Nykiel, Bowie FSC 25.30 14.13 11.17 4.68 4.21 4.50 4.50 0.00 #9
    12 Katie Donaldson, Wichita FSC
    Brock Jacobs, Wichita FSC 22.33 12.79 9.54 3.86 3.89 3.71 3.71 0.00 #1
    13 Kristen Nardozzi, Chicago FSC
    Robert Cuthbertson, Stars FSC of Texas 22.20 12.11 10.09 4.18 3.93 3.96 4.04 0.00 #5
    14 Janine Halstead, SC of New York Inc
    Robert Knopf, SC of New York Inc 18.53 10.25 8.28 3.46 3.07 3.43 3.32 0.00 #8

  13. #13
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    The microphone picking up that person making "you're awesome" comments at the end of each pattern was so funny :chorus:

    Regardless, great to see enthusiastic fans and an audience bigger than any one is likely to ever to anywhere else for compulsories! Great job Spokane.

  14. #14
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    I enjoyed watching the CD and I thought it would be zzz! The Shibutani's are so cute!!!

  15. #15
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    100yen, I just had to restore your great post (#6), OK?

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