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Thread: Championship Ladies SP

  1. #1021
    Beliver in Sasha's Perfect Program Tinymavy15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwiggin3 View Post
    I don't care she has Olympic experience - she's a huge question mark with a history of basket-case-nerves and frankly, I think USFSA would look desperate (or even more so than they are) if they sent her unless she won Nationals.
    If she is second why can't she go? My dream team was Sasha and Mirari, and if they both skate well in the free, i don't see why that can't happen.

    As for Sasha's nerves, if she could skate as well as she did yesterday she can do anything. Of course the free will be another story, but she was never as nervous as she was in her life as she was yesterday. But she handled it like a champion.

  2. #1022
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    Quote Originally Posted by soogar View Post
    I wouldn't put Paul Wylie and Sarah Hughes together because Sarah had very good and consistent competitive results. I think Sasha is more likely to have an Olympic moment than Mirai. That is my gut feeling and Sasha has a back story that would be golden if she were to have this amazing Olympic moment and win gold.

    As for icons- I think Sasha is every bit as iconic as Michelle Kwan. I think she is much more appreciated now than she was when MK was around. The reception that she received and her performance level was so much better than the other girls even though that was not the best SP that she had ever skated. All those beautiful qualities in her skating really stand out and she actually looks much more secure on her blades than before.
    That's why I edited the post a bit -- I do realize that Sarah Hughes earned bronze. But she did get relatively little attention until she won the gold. So yes, probably not good to compare Wylie and Hughes in this case.

    I guess we'll see on Saturday. I don't think anyone knows what will happen. Everyone knows my opinion on things, so I won't try to repeat it 80 times.

  3. #1023
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    Quote Originally Posted by UM84 View Post
    They will rebuild after the Olympics, that want to win NOW. I would hope they wouldn't think in the lines of "Let's just send the top 2 and start rebuilding". I would hope they would want to send are best, and Sasha is our best right now. Unless she has an epic meltdown I don't see how they would leave her off the team.
    The practice of the USFSA is to send the top finishers at Nationas to the Olympics no matter what. If you look at the complete Olympic rosters all they way back to 1924, I don't think there is a single exception to this practice in any discipline. In fact, the understanding that has been worked out between the USFSA and the USOC pretty much guarentees that it has to be that way or else the USFSA better have a very good rerason why not. (A representative of the USOC sits in on the meetings of the USFSA's selection committee.)

    The "very good reason" is spelled out in the document that outlines the powers of the Olympic selection committee. In the case of a "dominant athlete" who misses Nationals because of injury (verified by a USFSA doctor), and who can nevertheless demonstate to the committee that he/she will be recovered in time for the Olympics, may petition the committee for consideration. This happened in the case of Michelle Kwan in 2006, Nancy Kerrigan in 1994, and Todd Eldredge in 1992.

    Other than that, they just go right down the list, first and second at Nationals if they have two spots, first, second and third if they have three.
    Last edited by Mathman; 01-22-2010 at 05:29 PM.

  4. #1024
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    Also we have a precedent of what happens when you try to send "the country's biggest hope." Miki Ando was SIXTH in Nationals but was sent to Torino over Yukari Nakano. She went up there and ended up in 15th. I'm not say this will or will not happen with Sasha, but I'm simply saying that the Olympics is a wild beast and you can't make assumptions about how people will place.
    What is interesting is that this year Miki Ando was Fourth at nationals and she is going instead of Nakano who was third with about about 10 points advantage over her. In 2005-2006 nationals, Nakano only had about 2 points advantage over Ando. However it should be said that Ando had already earned her way to the Olympics by her 2nd place finish in the GPF. I do honestly think that Ando will do much better at this Olympic since she doesn't have as much pressure as 2006, however.

  5. #1025
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    In the case of a "dominant athlete" who misses Nationals because of injury (verified by a USFSA doctor), and who can nevertheless demonstate to the committee that he/she will be recovered in time for the Olympics, may petition the committee for consideration. This happened in the case of Michelle Kwan in 2006, Nancy Kerrigan in 1994, and Todd Eldredge in 1992.
    And Meno & Sand in 1998.

    What they have never done is bumped an otherwise-eligible* skater off the Olympic team in favor of someone who finished lower at Nationals.


    There have been times when national medalists were not sent to Olympics because they weren't US citizens or they weren't old enough according to the age rules. That's a different issue and won't apply to this year's selections.

  6. #1026
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    IIRC Ando's selection both times was in accordance with the published rules of the Japanese skating federation. In 2006 they had a point system for various placements at competitions for the previous two years. Whoever got the most points went to the Olympics. (There was, however, a charge that the judges at Japanese Nationals cheated by placing Onda over Nakano to make sure Ando ended up with the most points.)

    This year the rule is: If you win a medal at the Grand Prix Final (and are the highest placed Japanese skater to do so, in case Japan wins more than one medal in the discipline), then you go to the Olympics. Tjhis was Miki. If you win Japanese Nationals, then you also go. This was Mao. (I am not sure if the second place finisher at Japanese Nationals automatically goes or if the Federation reserved some wiggle room for itself in the case of the third lady.)

    Anyway, different federations have different rules and traditions about this. For the USFSA, they send #1 and #2 at Nationals.
    Last edited by Mathman; 01-22-2010 at 05:42 PM.

  7. #1027
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    The practice of the USFSA is to send the top finishers at Nationas to the Olympics no matter what. If you look at the complete Olympic rosters all they way back to 1924, I don't think there is a single exception to this practice in any discipline. In fact, the understanding that has been worked out between the USFSA and the USOC pretty much guarentees that it has to be that way or else the USFSA better have a very good rerason why not. (A representative of the USOC sits in on the meetings of the USFSA's selection committee.)

    The "very good reason" is spelled out in the document that outlines the powers of the Olympic selection committee. In the case of a "dominant athlete" who misses Nationals because of injury (verified by a USFSA doctor), and who can nevertheless demonstate to the committee that he/she will be recovered in time for the Olympics, may petition the committee for consideration. This happened in the case of Michelle Kwan in 2006, Nancy Kerrigan in 1994, and Todd Eldredge in 1992.

    Other than that, they just go right down the list, first and second at Nationals if they have two spots, first, second and third if they have three.
    Yeah, but every winter Olympics since 1968 has seen at aleast 1 U.S lady on the podium. And since the winter olympics began, the US ladies have only missed the podium 4 times. Aside from Sasha, we have no stars or anyone you can honestly look at and say "She can medal at the Olympics". There has always been that star ready to step into the spotlight. These young ladies have had 2-3 years to do it and none of them have. So I think they will overlook the rule for this Olympics is they have to.

  8. #1028
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    Hi everyone!

    Well, I dont think they will send Sasha if she finishes 3rd, 4th or 5th. They will definetely send the ones who gets the 1st and 2nd to the Olympics. If Sasha is gold or silver, good for her, she deserves making the team, no matter what.
    We have to think that they want to send the best skaters to the olympics, the ones who can actually bring a medal. I dont see Flatt as a good contender for a medal at Olympics.
    Ok, Sasha had her time but if she wants to try, this is her last chance. Other skaters are young and could be better than her. But they're not. I dont see great american skaters as we used to have in the past. Sasha was away for 4 years with no competitions and when she's back she almost got the 1st place in the short.
    She really deserves the spot. She has worked hard for that.

    Its her last chance. I really hope she can make it.

  9. #1029
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    IIRC Ando's selection both times was in accordance with the published rules of the Japanese skating federation. In 2006 they had a point system for various placements at competitions for the previous two years. IWhoever got the most points went to the Olympics. (There was, however, a charge that the judges at Japanese Nationals cheated by place Onda over Nakano to make sure Ando ended up with the most point.)

    This year the rule is: If you win a medal at the Grand Prix Final (and are the highest placed Japanese skater to do so, in case Japan wins more than one medal in the discipline), then you go to the Olympics. Tjhis was Miki. If you win Japanese Nationals, then you also go. This was Mao. (I am not sure if the second place finisher at Japanese Nationals automatically goes or if the Federation reserved some wiggle room for itself in the case of the third lady.)

    Anyway, different federations have different rules and traditions about this. For the USFSA, they send #1 and #2 at Nationals.
    Good to know. I honestly did not know how it worked in 2006. (It was pretty clear to me this time around).

  10. #1030
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    Quote Originally Posted by UM84 View Post
    Yeah, but every winter Olympics since 1968 has seen at aleast 1 U.S lady on the podium. And since the winter olympics began, the US ladies have only missed the podium 4 times. Aside from Sasha, we have no stars or anyone you can honestly look at and say "She can medal at the Olympics". There has always been that star ready to step into the spotlight. These young ladies have had 2-3 years to do it and none of them have. So I think they will overlook the rule for this Olympics is they have to.
    And we will find out on Saturday! I guess I would like to see our young skaters given the chance to have the Olympic experience and rise to the occasion. I bet it's pretty frustrating to our young skaters that our country has such little faith in them.

    And for heaven's sake. Flatt finished fifth in a very competitive field's in World's last year. I don't understand why everyone thinks that is so terrible. Fifth is pretty impressive for your first world's appearance. That's just one place lower than what Sasha did in her first worlds.

  11. #1031
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    Mathman's right, it's always 1-2, all the rest is just made up hoopla from the media & the fans.

    That said, I don't care, I want to see Sasha Cohen skate! PLEASE SOMEONE IF YOU HAVE 2 US NATIONALS LADIES FINAL TICKETS FOR SALE PLEASE PLEASE CONTACT ME ASAP EITHER ON HERE OR VIA PM!!!! P L E A S E!!!!

    Okay, now that I have begged for tickets, lol, I just want to say right upfront that I'm pretty sure that Sasha won't make the Team. It'll be exactly the same scenario of the Pairs Final. However, instead of 3rd I expect Sasha to get 4th. My fearless predictions are as follows:

    1st place - Mirai Nagasu
    2nd place - Rachael Flatt
    3rd place - Ashley Wagner
    4th place - Sasha Cohen

    My reasoning, several, of which

    a.) 16 yr. old Mirai is younger than 25 yr. old Sasha therefore in a close competition the young one will get the nod (aka what happened to the oldest pairs team at Nationals last week I&B).
    b.) Mirai has more to give the USFSA over the next years, whereas Sasha is done, on her way out, this will be her very last competitive competition.
    c.) Sasha is not a LP skater, never has been, the falls will seal the deal, no reason for the USFSA to hold her up. She was good for ratings, but now they can kick her on the way out.


    Lol, but I don't care, I want to be there! Thus, I am willing to pay $$$$ for two US Nationals Ladies Final Tickets (please see above). Thank you.

  12. #1032
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadine View Post
    Mathman's right, it's always 1-2, all the rest is just made up hoopla from the media & the fans.

    That said, I don't care, I want to see Sasha Cohen skate! PLEASE SOMEONE IF YOU HAVE 2 US NATIONALS LADIES FINAL TICKETS FOR SALE PLEASE PLEASE CONTACT ME ASAP EITHER ON HERE OR VIA PM!!!! P L E A S E!!!!

    Okay, now that I have begged for tickets, lol, I just want to say right upfront that I'm pretty sure that Sasha won't make the Team. It'll be exactly the same scenario of the Pairs Final. However, instead of 3rd I expect Sasha to get 4th. My fearless predictions are as follows:

    1st place - Mirai Nagasu
    2nd place - Rachael Flatt
    3rd place - Ashley Wagner
    4th place - Sasha Cohen

    My reasoning, several, of which

    a.) 16 yr. old Mirai is younger than 25 yr. old Sasha therefore in a close competition the young one will get the nod (aka what happened to the oldest pairs team at Nationals last week I&B).
    b.) Mirai has more to give the USFSA over the next years, whereas Sasha is done, on her way out, this will be her very last competitive competition.
    c.) Sasha is not a LP skater, never has been, the falls will seal the deal, no reason for the USFSA to hold her up. She was good for ratings, but now they can kick her on the way out.


    Lol, but I don't care, I want to be there! Thus, I am willing to pay $$$$ for two US Nationals Ladies Final Tickets (please see above). Thank you.
    Did you find a cheap flight to Spokane?! Good luck in getting tickets!

  13. #1033
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    Oh for Pete's sake.
    Last night Nicks said he fully expects the Gold and Silver medalists will go to Vancouver.

    The skaters expect this as well. Let them skate their LP's before we start accusing US Skating of saving Sasha or anyone one else.

  14. #1034
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    I probably should clarify to say if she gets 3rd or 4th AND gets offered a spot on the team, then I think it would be nice if she bows out gracefully and let's the ones who finished above her get the spot.

    If USFSA does name Sasha to the team in any way beside her having a top 2 finish, I think it would be such a shame. Yes, the program needs a star, but most likely that would only be through this year. Yes getting medals and high placements are important, but so is building your program for the long-term and you do that by having your skaters (if they earned it, of course) go to high-level international competitions. I know that Flatt/Wagner/Nagasu have all done the GP, but I don't think that's really the same thing as a Worlds or an Olympics when everyone is all in the same place.
    I don't think usfsa will send Sasha if she places 3rd. OTOH I think they do their best to inlate her marks. Come on she 2 foot the flutz and landing was wonky,

  15. #1035
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    The rule, as I understand it, is that only the top finisher is guaranteed a spot.

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