US Junior Ladies | Golden Skate

US Junior Ladies

bigsisjiejie

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 22, 2009
I don't know much about most of the junior ladies, but I just looked at the SP protocols and something struck me as interesting:
--Among the top 5 ladies, there is not a single underrotation or edge call listed.
--Among all the junior ladies, there are only three underrotation, three ! calls and NO "e" calls.

This is hard to believe, and I'm curious to know if we're seeing a new crop of young ladies whose coaches are actually insisting on proper technique and no cheats, or if the tech caller for this competition was either blind or a softie. I haven't seen any videos of this competition so I really don't know.
 
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Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
I don't know much about most of the junior ladies, but I just looked at the SP protocols and something struck me as interesting:
--Among the top 5 ladies, there is not a single underrotation or edge call listed.
--Among all the junior ladies, there are only three underrotation, three ! calls and NO "e" calls.

This is hard to believe, and I'm curious to know if we're seeing a new crop of young ladies whose coaches are actually insisting on proper technique and no cheats, or if the tech caller for this competition was either blind or a softie. I haven't seen any videos of this competition so I really don't know.

I watched Agnes Z's (she's in first) program on Ice Network. Pretty impressive. She was very clean and seem to have the basics down. She has some qualities to work on, but I think that will come with time.
 

oleada

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 27, 2007
I watched Agnes Z's (she's in first) program on Ice Network. Pretty impressive. She was very clean and seem to have the basics down. She has some qualities to work on, but I think that will come with time.

Agnes has a lot of potential; her jumps are huuuge and seem to have mostly clean entrance edges (I think she might switch edges on the flip just a tiny bit), but man, she was slooooooooow. I think it's a Tom Z. thing as a lot of of his skaters (Flatt, Gilles, Mroz) seem to be on the slow side. I hope she works on that.

I think Angela Wang showed a lot of potential as well (currently 3rd).

Also, sadly, I think the reason there's no more edge calls is that not that many ladies tried 3Lzs. Also, US Nats isn't always the strictest about calling edge calls - a couple of years ago, Ashley Wagner never got one and we all know she has a major flutz.
 
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bigsisjiejie

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 22, 2009
Also, sadly, I think the reason there's no more edge calls is that not that many ladies tried 3Lzs. Also, US Nats isn't always the strictest about calling edge calls - a couple of years ago, Ashley Wagner never got one and we all know she has a major flutz.

True, although IIRC not that many junior ladies ever really have solid 3Z's anyway. And now the potential downgrade or edge call for a marginal effort may lead many to not attempt it in competition anymore unless it's really solid. A great 3Lz carries a lot of weight at the junior level, and Agnes did hers in combo with +GOE's to boot. Hope to catch a video of this young lady sometime.

True also about US Nats (and lower level competitions also) on not being very strict on technical calls...at least in the past. I was hoping this would change, as giving free passes for flawed jumps has not helped US ladies out when they hit the international comps. And the strict calling needs to start around juvie level--to nip any jump cheating and wrong edges in the bud, while they can still be fixed. Ditto for leg wraps and mule kicks.
 

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Junior Ladies used to be Senior Ladies with less speed/polish => All the same jumps, smaller, less secure but definitely lacking finishing school. Maybe a missing triple from a full set. Of course, there are up and down years in Juniors in terms of "owned" jumps, but they have typically been impressive and everyone can't wait for the Juniors to be Seniors and then only 1-2 slip through and have success....
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Junior Ladies used to be Senior Ladies with less speed/polish => All the same jumps, smaller, less secure but definitely lacking finishing school. Maybe a missing triple from a full set. Of course, there are up and down years in Juniors in terms of "owned" jumps, but they have typically been impressive and everyone can't wait for the Juniors to be Seniors and then only 1-2 slip through and have success....

The winner of the Jr. Title always seems to be a surprise...DeeDee last year, Alexe the year before, Mirai the year before that, Sandy in '05. I think this is because most juniors lack polish, so whoever lands the most triples wins.
 

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Last year seemed to be more of a "down" year technically for Juniors while this year is a more "up" year. There are cycles and waves of skaters where a group come up together and are strong and they move on to Senior and the group directly behind are a little weaker.
 

iceminx

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
The winner of the Jr. Title always seems to be a surprise...DeeDee last year, Alexe the year before, Mirai the year before that, Sandy in '05. I think this is because most juniors lack polish, so whoever lands the most triples wins.

DeeDee was a surprise because Ellie was the "favorite", alex was a SHOCK because everyone expected Angela to take it by a landslide, but Mirai was nowhere near a surprise because everyone knew it was either her or Caroline (that year's "favorite")
 

liketotally

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Originally Posted by iceminx
DeeDee was a surprise because Ellie was the "favorite", alex was a SHOCK because everyone expected Angela to take it by a landslide, but Mirai was nowhere near a surprise because everyone knew it was either her or Caroline (that year's "favorite")

No, I believe Mirai certainly was a huge surprise. If I remember correctly, she was a complete unknown before that year, as she had never made it to nationals before, while Caroline tore up the JGP and was definitely the favourite to win.
 

gkelly

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
No, I believe Mirai certainly was a huge surprise. If I remember correctly, she was a complete unknown before that year, as she had never made it to nationals before, while Caroline tore up the JGP and was definitely the favourite to win.

Surprise to whom?

Depends whether you were following only the skaters who had JGP assignments or were also following the ones who qualified through regionals and sectionals -- by scores or by also watching the programs. That was the year we first had access to videos of qualifying competitions through the precursor to IceNetwork and I remember being especially impressed with Nagasu's performances. Same reasons there was buzz about Zawadzki this year. Now we also occasionally get some stellar performances from summer club competitions via youtube.

And of course people (other skaters, coaches, judges, hardcore California-based fans, etc.) who actually attended SWP and Pacific Coasts or skated at her rink had seen what she was capable of. Which is the kind of information that would always have been available to a small subset of people even before the Internet and before the JGP, but harder to compare the whole potential field.
 

skatemn

Spectator
Joined
Oct 22, 2008
Any news on Junior ladies practices, any long program standouts? Sometimes the Junior ladies jumps can be up and down.
 

LeCygne

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Congrats to Agnes Zawadzki, Yasmin Siraj, and Lindsay Davis!! Nina Jiang pulled up all the way to 5th with a 3rd place free skate!! :love: Kiri Baga's SP saved her big time, otherwise Nina would be the pewter medalist..
 

iceminx

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Surprise to whom?

Depends whether you were following only the skaters who had JGP assignments or were also following the ones who qualified through regionals and sectionals -- by scores or by also watching the programs. That was the year we first had access to videos of qualifying competitions through the precursor to IceNetwork and I remember being especially impressed with Nagasu's performances. Same reasons there was buzz about Zawadzki this year. Now we also occasionally get some stellar performances from summer club competitions via youtube.

And of course people (other skaters, coaches, judges, hardcore California-based fans, etc.) who actually attended SWP and Pacific Coasts or skated at her rink had seen what she was capable of. Which is the kind of information that would always have been available to a small subset of people even before the Internet and before the JGP, but harder to compare the whole potential field.

:agree:
After Mirai's great regional skate, then sectionals, she was debuting with a lot of hype at nationals for having such a huge score -it was as if there were only 2 ladies entered in junior that year...does anyone remember what her regional score was? her program was even on youtube months in advance...
 

iceminx

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Congrats to Agnes Zawadzki, Yasmin Siraj, and Lindsay Davis!! Nina Jiang pulled up all the way to 5th with a 3rd place free skate!! :love: Kiri Baga's SP saved her big time, otherwise Nina would be the pewter medalist..

:eek:hwell:
Nina must have had a horrible SP to have ended up so low (for her) *sad*
I hope she stays junior so she can WIN next season!
Speaking of, what happened to Angela Wang who was in third? *sad again*
 

oleada

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 27, 2007
:eek:hwell:
Nina must have had a horrible SP to have ended up so low (for her) *sad*
I hope she stays junior so she can WIN next season!
Speaking of, what happened to Angela Wang who was in third? *sad again*

2 falls and 4 downgrades :( Shame as she's very talented...
 

oleada

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 27, 2007
:eek:hwell:
Nina must have had a horrible SP to have ended up so low (for her) *sad*
I hope she stays junior so she can WIN next season!
Speaking of, what happened to Angela Wang who was in third? *sad again*

Nina only did a 2F, singled her axel (mandatory -3 GOE) and had a mistake in the flying spin. Her footwork was also only a level 1.
 

bigsisjiejie

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 22, 2009
I really hope they put Zawadzki on the Junior Worlds team.

This year, there are a number of age-eligible ladies skating senior that will probably be in line before Agnes. I'm thinking Gao, Dobbs, and Gilles, if they all do well in the FS tomorrow. All have experience this season in front of international judges. I'd put Maxwell in there also, but she is injured and I don't know if it's season-ending or not, plus I doubt that USFS would pass over one of the other above ladies for her.

Zawadzki will hopefully get JGP assignments for next season, and start building that international competitive resume.
 

bigsisjiejie

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 22, 2009
Good grief! What happened to Kiri Baga in the free? I notice deductions -3.00--did she have 3 falls? Is she sick or injured or just melted down under pressure?
 
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