Page 3 of 11 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 155

Thread: Patrick Chan Article "Disses" Plushenko

  1. #31
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    1,055
    to me--patrick is getting way to cocky and arrogant for just one silver medal, he is pinning too much on homefield advantage.
    he should be definetly considerating on his own skating. evygeny didn't just win on jumps -he has some artistry-

  2. #32
    Constable , Costume Police colleen o'neill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    1,797
    Oh please .I don't follow everything that these skaters say month in month out , but it's obvious, in the overwhelming number of cases, they're responding to pointed questions by reporters. It's entirely possible that when Chan said " boring" , he meant it would be boring to him as a skater to skate without transitions...Even if he meant it was boring for him to watch, that's OK.

    To reference Bull Durham, he hasn't learned his cliches yet. (And I do hope he spends some time on this over the summer, so he can stop putting his foot in his mouth and people can stop taking everything he says in the worst possible context.)

    I don't believe he goes into these interviews intending to bad mouth anybody,but to assert his right to be where he is. I have heard him say , numerous times on TV , that all the competitors are champions and he's excited to be competing with them all..Of course he speaks of himself as being their equal, of being potentially able to best them on any given day..If he doesn't believe that , he might as well stay home.

    He's continually asked to contrast what he does with what some skaters who came up under the 6.0 system do. He's continually asked for his opinion on what , say, Joubert said recently , or how would he stack up against Plushenko if he came back..and on and on.. I don't think he's been asked much about Abbott, or Takahashi...but that wouldn't have a hope of providing such a controversial answer, would it ?

    Protect yourself Patrick , learn your cliches.

  3. #33
    Dreaming and dancing Bennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Watching the sunset
    Posts
    2,793
    What Patrick presents is one of the schools of thought. I think that he makes the case.
    I read similar remarks posted on Jeff Buttle's HP (not his words, but the web organizers'), I did not get any offensive impression. The commentary was like thanks to the new system awarding steps and transitions better, he is credited for his strengths. This is a valid point.
    It is true that Chan's base value is pretty high despite the lack of quad and he tends to get high levels and good GOE and PCS. Perhaps he could have said these without the recourse to other athletes. The nobody complains.

    Say, Joannie recently said that, compared to her rivals, she had all types of triples, without specifically saying that Mao, Yuna, or Miki leave out jumps that they are not very good at. But she does indirectly get at it. Yet, nobody was outraged.

    Patrick would be better off by being a little vague and less specific.
    Last edited by Bennett; 02-11-2010 at 06:51 PM.

  4. #34
    ~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~ Ladskater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    4,709
    I really don't see what the big deal is here about his comments. Patrick is young compared to Plushenko. Maybe it's a bit "cheeky" to refer to Plushenko as old, but hey in the skating world, Plushenko is old!!! I am sure Patrick means no malice towards Plushenko.

  5. #35
    Vancouver 2010, 247.23, Bronze
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    2,989
    The long awaited quotes have arrived! Nah, to be honest, they are more lol than angry-making.

    I'm happy for Voronov and his coach, back in the day my rival, Lyosha Urmanov. They've done a lot, have progressed in many areas. This proves that my comeback isn't useless and has affected some (like Sergey, or Artyom Borodulin, who's so young, yet finished 3rd) in a positive way.
    http://www.rg.ru/2009/12/28/plyuschenko.html

    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    Witnessing the drawing procedure in the company of Plushenko is a somewhat educative experience. Zhenya comments the scene in a low voice. "That one has progressed a lot, - he says about one of the competitors, then adds quickly, - in weight gain". Someone draws the first starting number, and Zheya says with a tone of pity in his voice: "Too bad, will run out of steam before the start". Then a reminder about the necessity of obeying the rules follows, which hints at the recent situation with Andrei Lutai. Andrei, while a good guy, was too upset about losing in Skate America and got behind the wheel of someone else's car. And here's Zhenya making an immediate loud joke: "Guys, wanna go for a ride? I'll let you borrow my car".
    http://www.rg.ru/2009/12/25/jrebii.html

    -----------------------------------------------------------------

    I left many elements out of my program today. For instance, there is this moment in the program when I pull a gun, push the bolt, point the gun at the judges, and then I put the gun back in its holster. I haven't done it yet. I think, it's still too early to reveal all the details of the program.
    http://www.championat.ru/other/_skat...cle-42085.html

    ------------------------------------------------------------------

    (about the finger)

    - Zhenya, that gesture, who was it intended for?

    - Everybody. I wanted to remind them who's the master. There were talks about me coming back, not coming back. Some people would be delighted if I failed my comeback. That is why I explained them, in hand-waving terms, who is who, with no doubts left.
    http://www.kp.ru/daily/24383.5/563134/

    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    "Ice, not flies", by Konstantin Shumov, Perm

    - Did you enjoy the competition? (domestic Cup of Russia, Perm)

    - I found the roster a bit too tight. It seemed that way probably because of the difference between the time zones. I had my morning practices at 6 a.m. Moscow time. The organization of the competition has turned out not to be really super, to say the least. Nobody showed up to pick us up at the airport, we had to take a cab. The hotel arrangement was awful. The competition schedule was messy, with everything done in a hurry. Frankly, nowhere near international standard.

    Also, a shocking amount of flies. Where did they all come from? It's something I saw for the first time in my life: ice covered with flies. It's dangerous for a figure skater: you get them under your blade and you're prone to fall.
    http://www.nevod.ru/local/zvezda/pag...a/2009-10-13/1

    -------------------------------------------------------------------
    ^^^
    Famous Russian figure skater Evgeni Plushenko's lawyers threaten Perm journalist Konstantin Shumov with a lawsuit over his 'Ice, no flies' publication.
    http://59.ru/newsline/241437.html
    Last edited by Hsuhs; 02-11-2010 at 09:28 PM.

  6. #36
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    123
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    What Patrick presents is one of the schools of thought. I think that he makes the case.
    I read similar remarks posted on Jeff Buttle's HP (not his words, but the web organizers'), I did not get any offensive impression. The commentary was like thanks to the new system awarding steps and transitions better, he is credited for his strengths. This is a valid point.
    It is true that Chan's base value is pretty high despite the lack of quad and he tends to get high levels and good GOE and PCS. Perhaps he could have said these without the recourse to other athletes. The nobody complains.

    Say, Joannie recently said that, compared to her rivals, she had all types of triples, without specifically saying that Mao, Yuna, or Miki leave out jumps that they are not very good at. But she does indirectly get at it. Yet, nobody was outraged.

    Patrick would be better off by being a little vague and less specific.
    I agree. The way he says things may not come off quite as he intended, but he did have a valid point. His Plushenko is old comment really rings true. Plushenko's style of skating is beginning to become antiquated, and while his jumps may be strong enough to keep him competitive, skating is definitely evolving to favor skaters that can do more than big tricks.
    Plus, Chan didn't say anything -that- bad. It wasn't blatantly disrespectful or malicious; he simply used Plushenko to make a point.

  7. #37
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    5,609
    1. This isn't the first time that Chan has said something "controversial." After a certain benefit of the doubt (ie, the questions lead those answers), I think we should basically say that yeah: Chan's ego is definitely a little large. But I don't think his statements are entirely out of line or wrong (in other words, if this was an isolated incident, I think people would be more forgiving). That stated, I don't really see the big deal in these statements.

    To wit

    "For me the transitions are one of the most important things in a programme, otherwise it's very boring to watch," he said.
    This no different from Joubert/Plushenko stating that "quads are one of the most important things to men's skating."

    "I love the new system, it's a great way to promote an all around skater especially a skater like me," said Chan.
    Okay, admittedly, this is sketchy. But it's not like what he's saying is wrong: this system is extremely beneficial to a skater like him. He could have phrased it better (like I just did - if he said "COP benefits a skater like myself more than previous systems would" again, no one would bat an eye).

    He's (Plushenko) confident that the quad will really help him, that he doesn't need transitions. He's old, I can't tell him it's not good.
    This is far too hard for me to parse. But again, Plushenko does believe the quad will help him, and he'll work on the quad before he'd work on transitions if one was giving him trouble. But I think Chan's misreading these last two seasons of quadless world champions. The quad is a tool. One quad is worth 9.8 (or more). Two is 19.6 (or more). Compare that to Transitions: 10.00 for the short; 20.00 for the long. I'm a little surprised that Chan doesn't recognize that (or am I wrong with the values?)

    My big concern is, as always, that Chan's not realizing that he needs to leave it on the ice. Underestimating a talented and driven competitor is the dumbest thing you can do. Whatever I feel about him as a person, as an athlete that attitude bothers me.

  8. #38
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Kenai, AK
    Posts
    18,666
    perhaps what Chan meant by the old comment was - Plushenko comes from the old skool thinking - 6.0 and early CoP...

    what Chan forgets, though, is that Plushenko HAS skated this season outside of Russia and so he is somewhat capable of discerning what it is he needs to win.

  9. #39
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    3,083
    Say, Joannie recently said that, compared to her rivals, she had all types of triples, without specifically saying that Mao, Yuna, or Miki leave out jumps that they are not very good at. But she does indirectly get at it. Yet, nobody was outraged.
    That's not actually a true statement. Ando does do all the triples, she does the 3flip in her short program (every competition) And if she does the 3flip every short program that means she's perfectly capable of adding it to her long if she feels she needs it. In fact Ando has announced that she has a layout plan that includes a 3flip if she feels she'll need that to win or medal.

  10. #40
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    7,569
    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    One quad is worth 9.8 (or more). Two is 19.6 (or more). Compare that to Transitions: 10.00 for the short; 20.00 for the long. I'm a little surprised that Chan doesn't recognize that (or am I wrong with the values?)
    Except that Plushenko can score 19.6 with two quads, but no one ever gets 10.00 in any component category.

    Chan can and sometimes does get higher TR (transition) and CH (choreography) scores than other skaters. But even if he does, that isn't likely to offset the high TES skaters like Plushenko can generate with their high-value jumps that Chan doesn't have.

    Furthermore, other skaters (including Plushenko) get higher SS and IN scores

    Here are some recent Chan/Plushenko component scores. TR and CH are bolded:

    Total PCS, SS TR PE CH IN
    40.20 8.10 7.55 8.15 8.05 8.35 Plushenko, Europeans 2010 SP
    83.10 8.50 7.65 8.45 8.40 8.55 Plushenko, Europeans 2010 FS

    36.95 7.55 7.15 7.50 7.35 7.40 Chan, Worlds 2009 SP
    76.10 7.70 7.45 7.60 7.70 7.60 Chan, Worlds 2010 FS

    38.60 7.75 7.45 7.90 7.70 7.80 Chan, 4CC 2009 SP
    80.10 7.85 7.80 8.15 8.05 8.20 Chan, 4CC 2009 FS

    Chan's highest PCS scores were recorded at 4CC 2009. Even those scores don't give him any edge vs. Plushenko.

  11. #41
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    632
    LMFAO, and those are your quotes?
    None of those quotes Plush attacks anyone's personally and openly like Chan does. If only Chan had brains to generalize his comments like Plush did in all your comments, instead pointing fingers.

  12. #42
    Medalist
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    76
    It seems that Chan is a bit too arrogant for his own good. Maybe instead of bashing other (better) skaters, he should focus on improving his skating instead of bashing others to make himself feel superior. Definately won't be a fan of Chan, not that I was before. Chan could definately use some lessons in basic good sportsmanship.

  13. #43
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Kenai, AK
    Posts
    18,666
    interesting... Surya and Johnny are lauded as heroes on this board for not playing the PR game and sticking it to the media/judges/federations/rivals.... Chan does it and it's wrong.


    I'm not agreeing with him, but I just find it interesting... this double standard.

  14. #44
    Dreaming and dancing Bennett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Watching the sunset
    Posts
    2,793
    Quote Originally Posted by bekalc View Post
    That's not actually a true statement. Ando does do all the triples, she does the 3flip in her short program (every competition) And if she does the 3flip every short program that means she's perfectly capable of adding it to her long if she feels she needs it. In fact Ando has announced that she has a layout plan that includes a 3flip if she feels she'll need that to win or medal.
    I am glad to hear that she brings her flip back to her LP.

  15. #45
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    5,609
    Chuckm, I agree with you. Furthermore, not only will Plushenko's quads wipe the mat with Chan's transitions, it's not as if Plushenko scores zeroes for transitions anyway. It's a moot point, though. Chan needs to leave it on the ice, and underestimating the talented, driven competition is not the way to do that.

Page 3 of 11 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •